Biggest Guy I Know Told Me Training Doesn't Matter

[Astartes]

I once had a neighbor (back during the whole hysteria in baseball era) who displayed contempt for all the 'immoral' baseball players who were linked to AAS use. And he, with a straight face and being completely serious, said something to the effect that 'if he wasn't such a good moral person he would be playing in MLB too.'

It's the same sentiment expressed in the OP's example: training doesn't really matter, it's the drugs.

For example, these are the same type of people who seem to think if they used the same protocol as you, they too would have the same results and become pro bodybuilders too.

Many of us who have followed your journey know differently.

We see (as much as can be conveyed in words/photos/videos) what type of dedication, knowledge, implementation, and of course sheer training volume and intensity it takes to achieve that type of success.

When presented with this, it's more difficult for anyone to really believe they are working just as hard as the pros.

So, yeah training IS always very important.

I think this false sense of accomplishment has always existed. A narrative that the unaccomplished and unwilling sell to justify their lack of life direction or trajectory.

Armchair quarterbacks, sports fans that couldn’t run 1/2 mile in 20 minutes… down right audacious in their conjecture and critique of those who exist in the upper echelon of human accomplishment.

In my background it is men who steal valor from those that have given the ultimate sacrifice and had the fortitude to achieve great heights.

Unfortunately… I see this happening more and more. The newer generations are so awash in technology that they have lost perspective on what real life accomplishment …. means.

Accomplishment is easy. Gratification is instant.

Why be Force Recon… Seals…. Ranger Teams… pro football player… power lifter… pro BB when you can play Black Ops and talk trash with no consequence? When you can play Madden 12,456 and win the Super Bowl while eating Doritos and cheese dip with Mtn Dew?

Why lift hard, eat right and educate yourself when you can pump PEDs and lift like a 15 year old in his basement? Our society has been infinitely impacted by the lethargy and stigma of …. EASY…

That is why nuclear family units are so critical in raising our children to think independently and critically. Why parents …must… CHALLENGE their children with hardship and adversity.

 

[29trt]

I think this false sense of accomplishment has always existed. A narrative that the unaccomplished and unwilling sell to justify their lack of life direction or trajectory.

Armchair quarterbacks, sports fans that couldn’t run 1/2 mile in 20 minutes… down right audacious in their conjecture and critique of those who exist in the upper echelon of human accomplishment.

In my background it is men who steal valor from those that have given the ultimate sacrifice and had the fortitude to achieve great heights.

Unfortunately… I see this happening more and more. The newer generations are so awash in technology that they have lost perspective on what real life accomplishment …. means.

Accomplishment is easy. Gratification is instant.

Why be Force Recon… Seals…. Ranger Teams… pro football player… power lifter… pro BB when you can play Black Ops and talk trash with no consequence? When you can play Madden 12,456 and win the Super Bowl while eating Doritos and cheese dip with Mtn Dew?

Why lift hard, eat right and educate yourself when you can pump PEDs and lift like a 15 year old in his basement? Our society has been infinitely impacted by the lethargy and stigma of …. EASY…

That is why nuclear family units are so critical in raising our children to think independently and critically. Why parents …must… CHALLENGE their children with hardship and adversity.

Well that might be true but lets not generalize, the guys that use gear instead of putting the effort in the gym might have a reason to do so...we may be inclined to say it is stupid but it depends on ones goals... I for one like working out... but someone else might see gear as a way to decrease time "wasted" in the gym and who am I to argue with that?
I am by no means encouraging the use of huge amounts of gear to reach IFBB levels of mass.. I am talking more about guys that want to look above the average lifter..and might use 1g of gear instead of 500mg to get there but spend less time in the gym...
Oh and also everyone seems to ignore the fact that training be it natural or not induces systemic inflammation in the body , using gear makes you able to train more and this makes matters worse . I could not find a study where the amount of inflammation from the PED use and training was compared to training naturally.
But all I can say is that every time I took a longish break from training and ate like a human being my mind is sharper and my memory better (natural or not! )
There must be a balance of AAS,training, bodyweight and diet that is optimal for each individual and his goals .

 

[olrak]

Well that might be true but lets not generalize, the guys that use gear instead of putting the effort in the gym might have a reason to do so...we may be inclined to say it is stupid but it depends on ones goals... I for one like working out... but someone else might see gear as a way to decrease time "wasted" in the gym and who am I to argue with that?
I am by no means encouraging the use of huge amounts of gear to reach IFBB levels of mass.. I am talking more about guys that want to look above the average lifter..and might use 1g of gear instead of 500mg to get there but spend less time in the gym...
Oh and also everyone seems to ignore the fact that training be it natural or not induces systemic inflammation in the body , using gear makes you able to train more and this makes matters worse . I could not find a study where the amount of inflammation from the PED use and training was compared to training naturally.
But all I can say is that every time I took a longish break from training and ate like a human being my mind is sharper and my memory better (natural or not! )
There must be a balance of AAS,training, bodyweight and diet that is optimal for each individual and his goals .

If people are using more gear to spend less time in the gym they've no business using gear at all.

 

[DECLAN]

If people are using more gear to spend less time in the gym they've no business using gear at all.

Lol, this statement sounds so hypocritical. If this context is followed, nobody should be on gear.

 

[rufflesbaby]

I take shits bigger than your friend, and the fact that he cruises on minimal test most of the year and nothing else is absolutely repulsive!

Judging by your media you probably definitely take bigger shits than his friend, wtf are your calves by the way god damn lol - ur a beast man.

 

[olrak]

Lol, this statement sounds so hypocritical. If this context is followed, nobody should be on gear.

Really? Can you elaborate?

 

[Mac11wildcat]

Well that might be true but lets not generalize, the guys that use gear instead of putting the effort in the gym might have a reason to do so...we may be inclined to say it is stupid but it depends on ones goals... I for one like working out... but someone else might see gear as a way to decrease time "wasted" in the gym and who am I to argue with that?
I am by no means encouraging the use of huge amounts of gear to reach IFBB levels of mass.. I am talking more about guys that want to look above the average lifter..and might use 1g of gear instead of 500mg to get there but spend less time in the gym...
Oh and also everyone seems to ignore the fact that training be it natural or not induces systemic inflammation in the body , using gear makes you able to train more and this makes matters worse . I could not find a study where the amount of inflammation from the PED use and training was compared to training naturally.
But all I can say is that every time I took a longish break from training and ate like a human being my mind is sharper and my memory better (natural or not! )
There must be a balance of AAS,training, bodyweight and diet that is optimal for each individual and his goals .

Why are we avoiding inflammation? Transient inflammation is a response to stimulus and is generally good for us, and at a minimum for repair of damage. Chronic inflammation is bad. People who avoid activities that create inflammation aren’t de facto healthier than those that don’t. Arguably less healthy. There’s really no reason to defend or justify taking the step into the enhanced world but halfassing training.

Lol, this statement sounds so hypocritical. If this context is followed, nobody should be on gear.

This is one of the most annoying statements on social media. If you want to obtain a certain level of mass it requires drugs. There is no time scale on which someone will reach a muscular BMI ~30+ naturally. Period. It’s also blatantly obvious it isn’t this simple because the number of people on gear, here and in every gym, is way higher than the number of people who look like they’re on gear.

We can argue where the point is…but that isn’t the intended argument in this thread. The argument is why wouldn’t you do your best in all other facets before increasing AAS dosage?

•

Edit; this whole thing is crazy to me. I cannot imagine what taking AAS is like when you hate the things that make it work well.

How do you guys go to the gym every day and pussy foot training? If I didn’t enjoy training I wouldn’t even be in the gym.

 

[Millard]

Well that might be true but lets not generalize, the guys that use gear instead of putting the effort in the gym might have a reason to do so...we may be inclined to say it is stupid but it depends on ones goals... I for one like working out... but someone else might see gear as a way to decrease time "wasted" in the gym and who am I to argue with that?
I am by no means encouraging the use of huge amounts of gear to reach IFBB levels of mass.. I am talking more about guys that want to look above the average lifter..and might use 1g of gear instead of 500mg to get there but spend less time in the gym...
Oh and also everyone seems to ignore the fact that training be it natural or not induces systemic inflammation in the body , using gear makes you able to train more and this makes matters worse . I could not find a study where the amount of inflammation from the PED use and training was compared to training naturally.
But all I can say is that every time I took a longish break from training and ate like a human being my mind is sharper and my memory better (natural or not! )
There must be a balance of AAS,training, bodyweight and diet that is optimal for each individual and his goals .

This is just weird logic and just a strange argument that doesn't make sense any way I look at it.

If you want to spend LESS TIME working out and put in LESS EFFORT, the solution is NOT to use more drugs.

It's the opposite.

If you want to spend MORE TIME working out and put in MORE EFFORT, that is where AAS can be extremely beneficial. AAS make this possible.

Furthermore, it's not like TIME and EFFORT are mutually exclusive. Just because you spend less time doesn't mean you must put in less effort.

You can certainly work out intensely within any time restrictions you may have.

The whole argument seems like a rationalization for being lazy.

 

[olrak]

This is just weird logic and just a strange argument that doesn't make sense any way I look at it.

If you want to spend LESS TIME working out and put in LESS EFFORT, the solution is NOT to use more drugs.

It's the opposite.

If you want to spend MORE TIME working out and put in MORE EFFORT, that is where AAS can be extremely beneficial. AAS make this possible.

Furthermore, it's not like TIME and EFFORT are mutually exclusive. Just because you spend less time doesn't mean you must put in less effort.

You can certainly work out intensely within any time restrictions you may have.

The whole argument seems like a rationalization for being lazy.

100% agree, tbh some of the posts here surprise me, wtf happened to work ethic and challenging yourself hitting PRs, for me this is what keeps me hooked, as I've said in my previous post if people are taking drugs to spend less time in the gym they've no business using them, and to elaborate on that they've no business using them as they are most likely going through a phase and don't have the resolve to play the long game, when I say long game I'm talking ten years minimum, and yes slackers! Contrary to popular belief there is a long game to be played even with drugs

 

[Millard]

How do you guys go to the gym every day and pussy foot training? If I didn’t enjoy training I wouldn’t even be in the gym.

That's always the first thing I ask anyone who expresses interest in improving their physical appearance or transforming their physique:

'Do you enjoy lifting weight?'
'Does it give you actual pleasure?'
'Or is it simply a means to an end?'

And I tell them quite honestly, and without judgment, if it's just a means to an end, they're fucked. They might have short-term success, but unlikely long-term.

AAS won't change that.

It's a lifestyle change. The weights are not for everyone. They should choose tennis or rockclimbing or any other physical pursuit that gives them pleasure and enjoyment. That, they will be able to stick with.

They may not look like a bodybuilder, but they can improve health, lower bodyfat, look more athletic.

“Everybody wants to be a bodybuilder, but nobody wants to lift no heavy-ass weights.” -- Ronnie Coleman

 

[OmL]

The truth of the matter is that these people exist.

 

[Rido]

If people are using more gear to spend less time in the gym they've no business using gear at all.

I personally feel like I need to spend more time in the gym on blast.

I am creating an environment of more harm and more benefit. Need the benefits to outweigh the harm during this period of time.

 

[Rido]

The truth of the matter is that these people exist.

Atleast they make us look better

 

[OmL]

Atleast they make us look better

I think they make us look worse.

 

[Rido]

I think they make us look worse.

Well I mean among AAS users . But yes. In the general population

 

[Millard]

The truth of the matter is that these people exist.

Well I mean among AAS users . But yes. In the general population

I am creating an environment of more harm and more benefit. Need the benefits to outweigh the harm during this period of time.

This is the big challenge of harm reduction. Everyone's risk/reward ratio is different but I hope sites like MESO can move the needle, no pun intended, towards lower risk. At the very least, maximize the benefit with a given risk. Obviously, some people have more room for improvement than others yet we can all benefit from this approach.

 

[29trt]

I was in no way implying that using drugs to make up for less time in the gym is a good thing... but I see it all the time... and it seems to work fine for average BMI... not the healthiest approach though and not the route I take or advise taking.

 

[Rido]

I was in no way implying that using drugs to make up for less time in the gym is a good thing... but I see it all the time... and it seems to work fine for average BMI... not the healthiest approach though and not the route I take or advise taking.

I think you are lying. I think you want us to inject 2 grams of tren while sitting at home eating a bag of cheetos and curl once a week

 

[29trt]

I think you are lying. I think you want us to inject 2 grams of tren while sitting at home eating a bag of cheetos and curl once a week

You're right .. now where is that study that shows guys gaining 'LEAN MASS' on test and not training

 

[Rido]

You're right .. now where is that study that shows guys gaining 'LEAN MASS' on test and not training

After doing so many dexa scans. Water retention can be viewed as FFM gained... I gain 10 lbs just by going on cycle.(obviously lose 10 after)