Adrenal Thread

[swordfish]

I'm trying to figue out why Serzone worked for one day for me. That was the 1 day in which i felt normal in the last 12 years. I think it must have to do with stimulating noradrenaline.... I was taking it for a week, and then increaed the dosage, and bingo woke up hungry and bakc to self.

I will never use another anti-depressant, with the knowledge I am gaining of my endocrin system.

 

[ironaddict69]

hypothyroidism or adrenal fatigue?

i got lab tests and everythings normal besides my thryoid, but the only adrenal test thing i was tested for was cortisol.
cortisol: 16.0 ug/dl (6.2-29.9) morning serum.
so its in the middle and normal, yet i feel i have all the hypothyroid symptoms and the adrenal fatigue symptoms.
T4 was 6.0 on a scale of (5.1-14.1)
and progesterone was 1.9 (0.2-1.4)
i picked up the book adrenal fatigue and it sounds like me.
but if my cortisol is normal, is it impossible to have adrenal fatigue?


some one please help guide me in the right direction. im losing hope.

 

[Vforcer2]

Re: hypothyroidism or adrenal fatigue?

i got lab tests and everythings normal besides my thryoid, but the only adrenal test thing i was tested for was cortisol.
cortisol: 16.0 ug/dl (6.2-29.9) morning serum.
so its in the middle and normal, yet i feel i have all the hypothyroid symptoms and the adrenal fatigue symptoms.
T4 was 6.0 on a scale of (5.1-14.1)
and progesterone was 1.9 (0.2-1.4)
i picked up the book adrenal fatigue and it sounds like me.
but if my cortisol is normal, is it impossible to have adrenal fatigue?


some one please help guide me in the right direction. im losing hope.

If you have a one time cortisol test then that in itself is insufficient to diganose adrenal fatigue. You need a 4 X per day salivary test which measures the cortisol at 4 specific times of the day. Your morning cortisol blood test is low anyway.

You need a FREE T3 and FREE T4, and TSH( optional but helpful) to accurately diagnose the thyroid. The best forum on Adrenal Fatigue and Thryoid is www.stopthethyroidmadness.com

If you go on thryoid, be sure to only use Armour. You can read more at the website I mentioned, and you will want to begin addressing the Adrenals prior to the Thryoid.

You can get the full spectrum of salivary tests here: http://www.canaryclub.org/

 

[1cc]

Re: hypothyroidism or adrenal fatigue?

i picked up the book adrenal fatigue and it sounds like me.
but if my cortisol is normal, is it impossible to have adrenal fatigue?

some one please help guide me in the right direction. im losing hope.

Blood cortisol tests are not a good indicator for Adrenal Fatigue. Saliva tests are best for cortisol, with samples taken at 4 different times during the day. You can get this done at www.metametrix.com. Their samples are easy to collect and don't need to be frozen.

My blood cortisol labs showed my cortisol over the top of the range, yet my saliva cortisol tests showed that I was below normal.

 

[ironaddict69]

Re: hypothyroidism or adrenal fatigue?

If you have a one time cortisol test then that in itself is insufficient to diganose adrenal fatigue. You need a 4 X per day salivary test which measures the cortisol at 4 specific times of the day. Your morning cortisol blood test is low anyway.

You need a FREE T3 and FREE T4, and TSH( optional but helpful) to accurately diagnose the thyroid. The best forum on Adrenal Fatigue and Thryoid is www.stopthethyroidmadness.com

If you go on thryoid, be sure to only use Armour. You can read more at the website I mentioned, and you will want to begin addressing the Adrenals prior to the Thryoid.

You can get the full spectrum of salivary tests here: http://www.canaryclub.org/

im taking like a freeze dried organic bovine adrenal extract. hows that for treating them?
i felt pretty decent last time i took them. and yeah how do u free up ur t4 and t3? i got T3 from lion to hold me over till my i can see my endo and he will perscribe T3 to me. i took armour last time at 90 mg's and it sraised me like like 5.5-6.4 when the top range of the scale is fucking 14.
so i didnt get a good impression from armour. but from what i hear people need like 4 grains, when i was only taking 1 1/2

 

[Vforcer2]

Re: hypothyroidism or adrenal fatigue?

im taking like a freeze dried organic bovine adrenal extract. hows that for treating them?
i felt pretty decent last time i took them. and yeah how do u free up ur t4 and t3? i got T3 from lion to hold me over till my i can see my endo and he will perscribe T3 to me. i took armour last time at 90 mg's and it sraised me like like 5.5-6.4 when the top range of the scale is fucking 14.
so i didnt get a good impression from armour. but from what i hear people need like 4 grains, when i was only taking 1 1/2

Bovine adrenal extract is fine if it has enough cortisol in it. Is it standardized to contain a specific amount? If not you will want to change to ISOCORT, which is standardized to contain 2.5mg of cortisol per pellet. Most people can help their adrenals recover on 20 mgs of cortisol per day spread out.

Armour is best for treating the thyroid. You were likely not taking enough. I take 3.5 grains per day. 2 in the morning, and 1.5 at 6 pm. You want to try to get towards the top of the range, and some people feel good a little over the range. Everyone is different. The website I mentioned has volumes of info and great moderators there that know far more than most doctors on the subject of thyroid and adrenal.

 

[ironaddict69]

Re: hypothyroidism or adrenal fatigue?

no it doesnt say how much cortisol is in it. thats probly not very good i assume? and is cortisol the only thing i need to take for my adrenals? im not sure what that does.
my whole life i thought cortisol was terrible because it strips muscle from you.

 

[Vforcer2]

Cortisol is the hormone that the adrenal glands produce to deal with stress (among other things). When you supplement with cortisol you are taking the load off your adrenal glands so that they can rest and heal. An adrenal supplement should have the spectrum of adrenal tissue and cortisol in it.

You really need to visit www.stopthethyroidmadness.com and read up there.

 

[ironaddict69]

dont worry, i just joined their forumn and posted. however i like mesomorphosis, and steroid.com as well for other issues. but that one is definitely best for adrenals and thyroid. mine doesnt say if theres cortisol in it, but there must be because their adrenal glands and like 150 mg of extrract in each pill.

 

[swordfish]

do you guys think iscort will be strong enough for me or should I push for Cortef? I have an endo appt on Friday.

Heres the saliva lab:

 

[Vforcer2]

Isocort works just as well as cortef, however a RX for cortef may be cheaper depending on the price and your health care plan.

 

[swordfish]

ok sounds good. I have heard better results on the HC. So I'll try it first and let you guys know.

 

[smitty4]

I have a question regarding the saliva tests. If someone was doing the 4 saliva tests, I imagine that their cortosol would be increased if they worked out on the day they were doing the tests. If so, would one want to work out? Doing so could increase cortosol. Not doing so, could potentially miss the fact that ones adrenals might sputter under the strain of a hard work out. Just wondered what folks thought about this.

Thanks!

 

[JanSz]

Re: hypothyroidism or adrenal fatigue?

Bovine adrenal extract is fine if it has enough cortisol in it. Is it standardized
to contain a specific amount? If not you will want to change to ISOCORT,
which is standardized to contain 2.5mg of cortisol per pellet.
Most people can help their adrenals recover on 20 mgs of cortisol per day spread out.

Armour is best for treating the thyroid. You were likely not taking enough.
I take 3.5 grains per day. 2 in the morning, and 1.5 at 6 pm.
You want to try to get towards the top of the range,
and some people feel good a little over the range. Everyone is different.
The website I mentioned has volumes of info and great moderators there
that know far more than most doctors on the subject of thyroid and adrenal.

On the tests that you post I do not see adrenals or thyroid tests.
Are you dosing DHEA, Armour and Ioderal by how you feel plus possibly body temperature?
.
.

 

[Vforcer2]

Re: hypothyroidism or adrenal fatigue?

On the tests that you post I do not see adrenals or thyroid tests.
Are you dosing DHEA, Armour and Ioderal by how you feel plus possibly body temperature?
.
.

I dose Armour by how I feel, the relief of symptoms, plus my resting heart rate. I have had inconsistant results taking temps.

I dose DHEA by DHEA Sulfate blood test results and also I know when I take to much because it gives me acne. Just 25 mg gives me acne.

I did a telephone consult with Dr. David Brownstein and he recommended starting with 25mg of Ioderal per day and working my way up to the 50mg I am currently at. He also recommended 10mg of DHEA per day and stated most people take too much of this. I told him I usually purchased 25mg tabs and he said that was fine, just snap them in half for a 12.5 mg dose.

Here are my last two labs with no Amour before the test. It is easy to see if I took the Armour before the test, I would likely be over the top of the ranges.

7/06 1:00 o'clock
T3: 3.4 (2.3-4.2)
T4: 1.17 (0.61-1.76)

3/06 11:00 o'clock
T3: 4.0 (2.3-4.2)
T4: 1.33 (0.61-1.76)
__________________

 

[JanSz]

Re: hypothyroidism or adrenal fatigue?

I dose Armour by how I feel, the relief of symptoms, plus my resting heart rate. I have had inconsistant results taking temps.

I dose DHEA by DHEA Sulfate blood test results and also I know when I take to much because it gives me acne. Just 25 mg gives me acne.

I did a telephone consult with Dr. David Brownstein and he recommended starting with 25mg of Ioderal per day and working my way up to the 50mg I am currently at. He also recommended 10mg of DHEA per day and stated most people take too much of this. I told him I usually purchased 25mg tabs and he said that was fine, just snap them in half for a 12.5 mg dose.

Here are my last two labs with no Amour before the test. It is easy to see if I took the Armour before the test, I would likely be over the top of the ranges.

7/06 1:00 o'clock
T3: 3.4 (2.3-4.2)
T4: 1.17 (0.61-1.76)

3/06 11:00 o'clock
T3: 4.0 (2.3-4.2)
T4: 1.33 (0.61-1.76)
__________________

I see that you test T3 and T4 do you also test FreeT3 and FreeT4 as usually recomended on this board (I think)?
--------------
Advisor at LEF told me to increase supplementing with DHEA until my blood get into recomended range of (DHEA 500-640 g/dL). I already take 300mg DHEA plus two pills DHEA Complete, that is additional 50mg DHEA and 200mg 7-KetoDHEA plus other ingredients.
Do not have my lattest tests yet, in April my DHEA was 328. In 2005 it was 118. With all this I worry some about a state of my adrenals.

 

[Vforcer2]

Re: hypothyroidism or adrenal fatigue?

I see that you test T3 and T4 do you also test FreeT3 and FreeT4 as usually recomended on this board (I think)?
--------------
Advisor at LEF told me to increase supplementing with DHEA until my blood get into recomended range of (DHEA 500-640 g/dL). I already take 300mg DHEA plus two pills DHEA Complete, that is additional 50mg DHEA and 200mg 7-KetoDHEA plus other ingredients.
Do not have my lattest tests yet, in April my DHEA was 328. In 2005 it was 118. With all this I worry some about a state of my adrenals.

Those are Free T3 and Free T4. Sorry for not including that. You are certainly taking a TON of DHEA, but if I remember correctly you are over 60 years old, so you would naturally need more than me, but still that does seem like a lot since a good portion of it will convert to E2. I like LEF, but do think they go a bit overboard on DHEA. Levels in the 300-400 range are my target.

Has there been a difference it the way you have felt on this dose?

 

[1cc]

I have a question regarding the saliva tests. If someone was doing the 4 saliva tests, I imagine that their cortosol would be increased if they worked out on the day they were doing the tests. If so, would one want to work out? Doing so could increase cortosol. Not doing so, could potentially miss the fact that ones adrenals might sputter under the strain of a hard work out. Just wondered what folks thought about this.

Thanks!

Just do it on a day you are not working out. Don't worry about catching the sputter. If you have Adrenal problems, it will be very obvious. You might want to try the questionnaire mentioned earlier in this thread first, and if it indicates Adenal Fatigue, then confirm it with the saliva tests.

 

[JanSz]

Re: hypothyroidism or adrenal fatigue?

Those are Free T3 and Free T4. Sorry for not including that. You are certainly taking a TON of DHEA, but if I remember correctly you are over 60 years old, so you would naturally need more than me, but still that does seem like a lot since a good portion of it will convert to E2. I like LEF, but do think they go a bit overboard on DHEA. Levels in the 300-400 range are my target.

Has there been a difference it the way you have felt on this dose?

Thanks for clarifying your thyroid tests.
----------------
I do not see/feel any difference taking so much DHEA.
I do not have a decent handle on my E2.
Reading the boards I got impression that everybody who takes T supplementation should take AI. So I was taking Arimidex. On advice from LEF I was taking IC3 and DIM without realizing that I am doubling on AI's. I was, still am taking Chrysin w/ piperine.
I do not fault LEF, I overlooked available information.
On my latest test 5/2006 I had E2=26. But it must have been lower latter on since I started having erection problems. About 2 mo ago I stopped all those AI's (and Avodart), my erection came back. Last week I gave a blood for testing, still waiting for results.
Only few days ago I realized (it finally sunk in, I read about it before without good understanding) that variation in Testosterone supply are the reason for increases in E2.
So with Androgel or pellets there is less likelihood for increases in E2 and if they occur, they may be less severe than on shots or when one is cycling T, so mild AI (ie; Chrysin) may be sufficient to control E2 while I am on Androgel. I will have to check on cost and and other factors to figure out the best AI for me, assuming that I actually need E2 adjustment. Chrysin is preferred by LEF advisor, he also told me (last year) that if I can get Armour I should take some. I may finally be able to get the script for it or buy out right, I am just waiting to get comfortable with my decision.

 

[Vforcer2]

Are you getting your DHEA tested? I can't help but think you are taking way to high of a dose. Most books state up 100mg or so for a man. It would only make since that this much DHEA is converting to Estradiol.