Assuming diet & exercise are a 10 what "extra's" provide the best ROI?

[Titan18]

Whatever can be used at the lowest doees with the least side effects for the most results and that varies person to person. But almost everybody underestimates what test, a bit of mast or primo, and diet/hard training can do.

Agree 100 percent. After wasting tons of money on supplements that made zero impact on my physique and training I feel like most if not all are not worth the money. And after trying a bunch of AAS I've came full circle back to test and mast. Those and a consistent diet, and getting my training dialed have me making progress. Slow and steady but making progress. I think a common problem with most new guys is they are in too big of a hurry and underestimate how long it takes to get big. Once you wrap your head around that idea and accept that it's a years long process you realize you need to settle on a routine that is sustainable for a long long time.

 

[OldGHGuy]

Test, GH, Protein, Sleep, Water, progressive overload and I would throw creatine in there too as one of the few supps that actually work.

 

[Deleted member 134759]

Frogtech and trenavar

 

[dacman24]

Agree 100 percent. After wasting tons of money on supplements that made zero impact on my physique and training I feel like most if not all are not worth the money. And after trying a bunch of AAS I've came full circle back to test and mast. Those and a consistent diet, and getting my training dialed have me making progress. Slow and steady but making progress. I think a common problem with most new guys is they are in too big of a hurry and underestimate how long it takes to get big. Once you wrap your head around that idea and accept that it's a years long process you realize you need to settle on a routine that is sustainable for a long long time.

This is tremendously helpful. Thanks

 

[dacman24]

Test, GH, Protein, Sleep, Water, progressive overload and I would throw creatine in there too as one of the few supps that actually work.

instead of GH would a peptide that increases hgh be sufficient? Ipamorelin maybe?

 

[borkies]

Test, GH, Protein, Sleep, Water, progressive overload and I would throw creatine in there too as one of the few supps that actually work.

I'm surprised it was this far down in the thread before someone mentioned sleep. Sleep is HUGE. Good, deep sound sleep and ideally some naps sprinkled thru the week.

 

[dacman24]

I'm surprised it was this far down in the thread before someone mentioned sleep. Sleep is HUGE. Good, deep sound sleep and ideally some naps sprinkled thru the week.

Yes exactly. Oddly enough CJC1295 helped my sleep it seems but I think I've created good enough habits I can do without out now but sleep is huge. Good Sleep = No Cortisol = Prescence of Growth