Banning immigrants from "certain" countries

Since an exceptionally ill-informed, or disingenuous, individual said that Obama was such a shining example, and nobody sued him or his policies, let's look at the truth and see exactly what Obama's track record was - hint: it sucked ASS

**** Obama Has Lost In The Supreme Court More Than Any Modern President ****

The Obama administration has lost most of its lawsuits that wound up in the U.S. Supreme Court. That’s far short of the modern presidential record.

July 6, 2016

Each year, Supreme Court reporters and legal pundits devise a “theme” for the term just ended. They try to connect disparate cases into a coherent narrative about, for example, “the court’s turn to the Left,” the “triumph of minimalism,” or even its “libertarian moment.” Such trendspotting is mainly an artificial exercise driven by the vagaries of the docket; it’s not like the justices suddenly decide to make ideological shifts or alter jurisprudential approaches.

This term, however, confirmed a very real phenomenon: the Obama administration, by historical standards, has done exceedingly poorly before the Supreme Court. While this conclusion may seem counterintuitive given the term’s liberal victories on abortion and affirmative action—or previous terms’ rulings upholding Obamacare—the statistics are staggering.

This past term, the federal government won 13 cases and lost 14. Such mediocrity may seem surprising, but the 48 percent win rate is actually the Obama Justice Department’s third-best result. The administration’s best term was 2013-2014, when it went 11-9 (55 percent), while its worst record of 3-9 (25 percent) came in the abbreviated 2008-2009 term—counting only cases argued after the January 2009 inauguration.

Overall, the administration has managed a record of 79-96, a win rate of just above 45 percent. There’s little difference between the first term’s 35-44 (just above 44 percent) and second term’s 44-52 (just below 46 percent). Now, there may be a handful of cases to add to the totals before the next president takes office, but we can essentially audit the 44th president’s judicial books now.

This Is Something New

That audit doesn’t look too good when compared to the record of his predecessors. George W. Bush achieved a record of 89-59 (60 percent)—and that’s if you fold in all of 2000-2001, including cases argued when Bill Clinton was president in what was an unusually bad term for the government (roughly 35 percent). Clinton, in turn, had an overall record of 148-87 (63 percent), again including all of 1992-1993. George H.W. Bush went 91-39 (70 percent), while Ronald Reagan weighed in with an astounding record of 260-89 (about 75 percent).

While it looks like this is merely a tale of a downwards trend in recent years, Jimmy Carter still managed a 139-65 record (68 percent). Indeed, the overall government win rate over the last 50 years—I’ve calculated back to the early 1960s—is comfortably over 60 percent.

To be sure, this isn’t an exact science, with some judgment calls to be made about certain cases that aren’t pure wins or losses for either side. The Supreme Court also used to hear many more cases, so the last 20 years or so are statistically less significant. But even giving Barack Obama every benefit of the doubt, his 45 percent score falls far short of the modern norm—which is really the relevant period, regardless of how well or poorly Andrew Jackson or Benjamin Harrison may have done.

Obama’s Own Justices Are Voting Against Him

You could argue, of course, that a simple won-loss rate doesn’t tell the whole story. After all, Obama’s solicitors general have faced a bench occupied by a majority of Republican appointees. (As did Clinton’s, but that didn’t stop him from pipping his Republican successor.) But the news gets even worse when you look at unanimous losses.

This term, the federal government argued an incredible 10 cases without gaining a single vote, not even that of one of President Obama’s own nominees, Sonia Sotomayor and Elena Kagan. That brings his total to 44 unanimous losses. For comparison, George W. Bush suffered 30 unanimous losses, while Bill Clinton withstood 31. In other words, Obama has lost unanimously 50 percent more than his two immediate predecessors.

These cases have been in such disparate areas as criminal procedure, religious liberty, property rights, immigration, securities regulation, tax law, and the separation of powers. Here are some recent unanimous headline-grabbers.

In Hosanna-Tabor Church v. EEOC (2012), the government sued a church school that fired a teacher for violating one of its religious tenets. The court ruled that punishing a church for not retaining an unwanted teacher violates the First Amendment.

In United States v. Jones (2012), the government claimed the power to attach a GPS device to a suspected drug dealer’s car and monitor his movements without a warrant. While the justices had differing opinions on why this violated the Fourth Amendment, all agreed that it did.

In Sackett v. EPA (2012), the government denied property owners the right to contest an order to stop building their house. The court ruled that access to courts is the least the government can provide in response to “the strong-arming of regulated parties.”

While the conventional wisdom about Arizona v. United States (2012) is that the high court smacked down a perniciously anti-immigrant state, Arizona actually won unanimously on its most controversial “show me your papers” provision. Not one justice accepted the theory that mere enforcement priorities trump state laws.

In Horne v. Department of Agriculture (2013), the government claimed raisin farmers weren’t entitled to judicial review of a byzantine New Deal-era program that confiscated crops in an attempt to regulate prices. The Supreme Court again allowed plaintiffs their day in court—and two years later ruled for them 8-1 on the merits.

In Riley v. California (2014), the Supreme Court ruled that the government needs to get a warrant if it wants to search the digital information stored on arrestees’ cell phones.

In Noel Canning v. National Labor Relations Board (2014), the court invalidated President Obama’s National Labor Relations Board appointments essentially because the Senate had not declared a recess when he made them.

Just last week, in McDonnell v. United States (2016), the court reversed the conviction of a former Virginia governor because meetings with constituents who seek the favor of elected officials are not the kinds of “official acts” that can be prosecuted under public-corruption statutes.

Obama Thinks He Deserves to Rule Unchecked

The government’s arguments across this wide variety of cases would essentially allow the executive branch to do whatever it wants without meaningful constitutional restraint. This position conflicts with another unanimous decision, Bond v. United States (2011). Bond vindicated a criminal defendant’s right to challenge her federal prosecution. As Justice Anthony Kennedy wrote, “federalism protects the liberty of the individual from arbitrary power. When government acts in excess of its lawful powers, that liberty is at stake.”

The government’s arguments across this wide variety of cases would essentially allow the executive branch to do whatever it wants.

Curiously, Bond again came before the Supreme Court in 2014—on the question of whether a weapons-trafficking statute could be used against someone who used household chemicals in a bizarre revenge plot—and again the government lost unanimously.

To be clear, I’m not saying that the government’s lawyers are sub-par. Solicitor General Don Verrilli and his predecessors (including Kagan herself) are very well respected, and their staffs are populated by people who graduated at the top of elite law schools and clerked on the Supreme Court. If they’re not qualified to represent the government, nobody is.

No, this is a situation where, as noted Supreme Court advocate Miguel Estrada put it a few years ago when asked to opine on the administration’s poor record: “When you have a crazy client who makes you take crazy positions, you’re gonna lose some cases.”

So the reason this president has done so poorly at the high court is because he sees no limits on federal—especially prosecutorial—power and accords himself the ability to enact his own legislative agenda when Congress refuses to do so. The numbers don’t lie."

Source: Obama Lost Supreme Court More Than Any Modern President
 
I'd add that the violent portions are all in the Old Testament - i.e. the Jewish heritage - which, for nearly all intents and purposes do not guide Christians in their day-to-day physical actions particularly much. Seems more to be more of a background and historical reference exercise to me. (highly selective too - more below)

If you actually attend a church, which I do once or twice a year (the wife is really into that stuff, I'm an agnostic but unlike the atheists I don't fear I'll melt if I set foot in a church...) I find that the time spent in sermons is biased toward New Testament content - with tie-backs to (select portions) OT of course - after all, it isn't called CHRISTianity for no reason.

I've never heard any preacher go on about the (Jewish) laws and dictates found in OT portions like Ezekiel, Deuteronomy, Leviticus etc - the Jewish Torah content with references to stoning and sword stuff (probably where Muhammad got much of his violent content, except he took it to the next level and then some) - so for the Christianophobes to hang their hate and arguments on all that legacy OT content is ridiculous.

Maybe Christians should have another of their Bible rewrite councils and dump that stuff, I don't see why they retain it. Some Christians think so too, take a look at John Calvin and his thoughts on how some portions of OT were invalidated by Christ's sacrifice. I digress.

And as you say, it's descriptive, to me it's a bunch of Jewish story-telling, certainly not in the least prescriptive these days. I find that to be the redeeming quality (if you will) about Christianity, what has enabled it to move away from the tyrannic theocracy era hundreds of years ago, to becoming a civilized and calm religion these days.

Still waiting for Islam to get to that level of maturity - but with their prescriptive & infallible & indisputable dogma, I doubt it will ever happen.

(to the Christianophobes - I'm not a believer in the least, but I enjoy history and learning what makes cultures tick, you should try it)

The Old Testament laws aren't to be followed by Christians. Which is a main difference between itself and Judasim. If Christians weren't taught the old testament then you wouldn't fully understand, mainly prophecies and the whole reason for Christ coming.
 
Since an exceptionally ill-informed, or disingenuous, individual said that Obama was such a shining example, and nobody sued him or his policies, let's look at the truth and see exactly what Obama's track record was - hint: it sucked ASS

**** Obama Has Lost In The Supreme Court More Than Any Modern President ****

The Obama administration has lost most of its lawsuits that wound up in the U.S. Supreme Court. That’s far short of the modern presidential record.

July 6, 2016

Each year, Supreme Court reporters and legal pundits devise a “theme” for the term just ended. They try to connect disparate cases into a coherent narrative about, for example, “the court’s turn to the Left,” the “triumph of minimalism,” or even its “libertarian moment.” Such trendspotting is mainly an artificial exercise driven by the vagaries of the docket; it’s not like the justices suddenly decide to make ideological shifts or alter jurisprudential approaches.

This term, however, confirmed a very real phenomenon: the Obama administration, by historical standards, has done exceedingly poorly before the Supreme Court. While this conclusion may seem counterintuitive given the term’s liberal victories on abortion and affirmative action—or previous terms’ rulings upholding Obamacare—the statistics are staggering.

This past term, the federal government won 13 cases and lost 14. Such mediocrity may seem surprising, but the 48 percent win rate is actually the Obama Justice Department’s third-best result. The administration’s best term was 2013-2014, when it went 11-9 (55 percent), while its worst record of 3-9 (25 percent) came in the abbreviated 2008-2009 term—counting only cases argued after the January 2009 inauguration.

Overall, the administration has managed a record of 79-96, a win rate of just above 45 percent. There’s little difference between the first term’s 35-44 (just above 44 percent) and second term’s 44-52 (just below 46 percent). Now, there may be a handful of cases to add to the totals before the next president takes office, but we can essentially audit the 44th president’s judicial books now.

This Is Something New

That audit doesn’t look too good when compared to the record of his predecessors. George W. Bush achieved a record of 89-59 (60 percent)—and that’s if you fold in all of 2000-2001, including cases argued when Bill Clinton was president in what was an unusually bad term for the government (roughly 35 percent). Clinton, in turn, had an overall record of 148-87 (63 percent), again including all of 1992-1993. George H.W. Bush went 91-39 (70 percent), while Ronald Reagan weighed in with an astounding record of 260-89 (about 75 percent).

While it looks like this is merely a tale of a downwards trend in recent years, Jimmy Carter still managed a 139-65 record (68 percent). Indeed, the overall government win rate over the last 50 years—I’ve calculated back to the early 1960s—is comfortably over 60 percent.

To be sure, this isn’t an exact science, with some judgment calls to be made about certain cases that aren’t pure wins or losses for either side. The Supreme Court also used to hear many more cases, so the last 20 years or so are statistically less significant. But even giving Barack Obama every benefit of the doubt, his 45 percent score falls far short of the modern norm—which is really the relevant period, regardless of how well or poorly Andrew Jackson or Benjamin Harrison may have done.

Obama’s Own Justices Are Voting Against Him

You could argue, of course, that a simple won-loss rate doesn’t tell the whole story. After all, Obama’s solicitors general have faced a bench occupied by a majority of Republican appointees. (As did Clinton’s, but that didn’t stop him from pipping his Republican successor.) But the news gets even worse when you look at unanimous losses.

This term, the federal government argued an incredible 10 cases without gaining a single vote, not even that of one of President Obama’s own nominees, Sonia Sotomayor and Elena Kagan. That brings his total to 44 unanimous losses. For comparison, George W. Bush suffered 30 unanimous losses, while Bill Clinton withstood 31. In other words, Obama has lost unanimously 50 percent more than his two immediate predecessors.

These cases have been in such disparate areas as criminal procedure, religious liberty, property rights, immigration, securities regulation, tax law, and the separation of powers. Here are some recent unanimous headline-grabbers.

In Hosanna-Tabor Church v. EEOC (2012), the government sued a church school that fired a teacher for violating one of its religious tenets. The court ruled that punishing a church for not retaining an unwanted teacher violates the First Amendment.

In United States v. Jones (2012), the government claimed the power to attach a GPS device to a suspected drug dealer’s car and monitor his movements without a warrant. While the justices had differing opinions on why this violated the Fourth Amendment, all agreed that it did.

In Sackett v. EPA (2012), the government denied property owners the right to contest an order to stop building their house. The court ruled that access to courts is the least the government can provide in response to “the strong-arming of regulated parties.”

While the conventional wisdom about Arizona v. United States (2012) is that the high court smacked down a perniciously anti-immigrant state, Arizona actually won unanimously on its most controversial “show me your papers” provision. Not one justice accepted the theory that mere enforcement priorities trump state laws.

In Horne v. Department of Agriculture (2013), the government claimed raisin farmers weren’t entitled to judicial review of a byzantine New Deal-era program that confiscated crops in an attempt to regulate prices. The Supreme Court again allowed plaintiffs their day in court—and two years later ruled for them 8-1 on the merits.

In Riley v. California (2014), the Supreme Court ruled that the government needs to get a warrant if it wants to search the digital information stored on arrestees’ cell phones.

In Noel Canning v. National Labor Relations Board (2014), the court invalidated President Obama’s National Labor Relations Board appointments essentially because the Senate had not declared a recess when he made them.

Just last week, in McDonnell v. United States (2016), the court reversed the conviction of a former Virginia governor because meetings with constituents who seek the favor of elected officials are not the kinds of “official acts” that can be prosecuted under public-corruption statutes.

Obama Thinks He Deserves to Rule Unchecked

The government’s arguments across this wide variety of cases would essentially allow the executive branch to do whatever it wants without meaningful constitutional restraint. This position conflicts with another unanimous decision, Bond v. United States (2011). Bond vindicated a criminal defendant’s right to challenge her federal prosecution. As Justice Anthony Kennedy wrote, “federalism protects the liberty of the individual from arbitrary power. When government acts in excess of its lawful powers, that liberty is at stake.”

The government’s arguments across this wide variety of cases would essentially allow the executive branch to do whatever it wants.

Curiously, Bond again came before the Supreme Court in 2014—on the question of whether a weapons-trafficking statute could be used against someone who used household chemicals in a bizarre revenge plot—and again the government lost unanimously.

To be clear, I’m not saying that the government’s lawyers are sub-par. Solicitor General Don Verrilli and his predecessors (including Kagan herself) are very well respected, and their staffs are populated by people who graduated at the top of elite law schools and clerked on the Supreme Court. If they’re not qualified to represent the government, nobody is.

No, this is a situation where, as noted Supreme Court advocate Miguel Estrada put it a few years ago when asked to opine on the administration’s poor record: “When you have a crazy client who makes you take crazy positions, you’re gonna lose some cases.”

So the reason this president has done so poorly at the high court is because he sees no limits on federal—especially prosecutorial—power and accords himself the ability to enact his own legislative agenda when Congress refuses to do so. The numbers don’t lie."

Source: Obama Lost Supreme Court More Than Any Modern President

Question remains the same if the same judges were doing their job at obamas administration why the outrage now ???? For the blocked eo !!!!
My apologies for my ignorance. Since Obama never called out federal judges incompatent and other names it may never got on my radar. when the courts did their job and kept the Obama White House on check good job for them!!!
What's the difference now than if you agree with them than what's your point now?
 
The Old Testament laws aren't to be followed by Christians. Which is a main difference between itself and Judasim. If Christians weren't taught the old testament then you wouldn't fully understand, mainly prophecies and the whole reason for Christ coming.

Absolutely - I called it "tie-backs" when I referred to the role OT plays in churches. Your explanation is better. Still, the point remains the same - it is a FALSEHOOD to compare what is in OT with what is in the Koran. Liberals have long practiced reality denial so maybe it works for them.
 
I just want a real explanation why every time I point out something Trump administration does illegal, it's deflected and finger pointed at Obama? Stand for your candidate on the ground of legality and what he stands for!! Not jut " but he did it too" rhetoric.

Still didn't answer this question!!! Do you have any original thoughts or input beside he did it too?? How about a legal
Argument to back up his EO !!!! Deflect, deflect, deflect. I guess that's what you "ilk" is only good at..... come back with substance you are a parrot for redwing publications keep copy and post it may make you smarter to the I'll informed Lol
 
Question remains the same if the same judges were doing their job at obamas administration why the outrage now ???? For the blocked eo !!!!
My apologies for my ignorance. Since Obama never called out federal judges incompatent and other names it may never got on my radar. when the courts did their job and kept the Obama White House on check good job for them!!!
What's the difference now than if you agree with them than what's your point now?

Oh, you changed your argument? OK.

I'm not arguing against the courts stepping in - or being called in - that's why we have a judiciary.

What is outrageous is the OUTLANDISH over-reaction by liberals, the open thuggery going on in the streets, the naked fascism displayed by sore loser Democrats. That is an outrage. There is no sense pf proportion considering that ALL Presidents since at least FDR have engaged in similar activities. Can we agree on the last part?
 
Still didn't answer this question!!! Do you have any original thoughts or input beside he did it too?? How about a legal
Argument to back up his EO !!!! Deflect, deflect, deflect. I guess that's what you "ilk" is only good at..... come back with substance you are a parrot for redwing publications keep copy and post it may make you smarter to the I'll informed Lol

Judging by your spelling and syntax skills, you're not a legal scholar - why are you so outraged over something that we've proved that all Presidents since at least FDR have done in some degree or fashion?

Cool your jets - let's see how the courts address this - that's what they're there for.
 
Cool your jets - let's see how the courts address this - that's what they're there for.
I am typing on my phone so the spelling Will be off at times, I have a life outside of meso :)
I knew we would find something you and I can agree on. All 3 branches of the government are equally powerful and constitution is the only thing they should uphold !!!
See your "ilk"and mine all wants the same thing. Free safe place to raise our families :) I'll cool my heat if you promise to stop the monolith flaming liberal nonsense!!! I am one of the few flaming liberals believes not every Trump spotter is a fascist.
I happened to have very productive conversations with Quiet a few fellow Meso brothers who are Sturn Trump supporters. We don't call each other names :)
 
I could see people being pissed if Trump made a ban against US citizens but he is keeping out people from another country, I didnt know people from foreign countries have rights guaranteed by the US constitution?? Is everyone in the world a US citizen now?
 
Your point has nothing to do with my statement. Whether the percentage of Muslims who self-detonate is 0% or 100%, it still doesn't change the fact that the Quran commands them to slay the infidel.



Where did I say they are all the same?

Regardless, every civilization that has ever had the misfortune of encountering Islam has found themselves at war with it. This has been happening since Muhammed was molesting a 9 year old girl he called his wife (which happens to be why Islam still permits child marriage today, btw). Everywhere Islam has spread, bloodshed has followed. The reason, of course, is because Islam commands Muslims to spread the faith by the sword.



Facts are scare tactics now? Got it.



You're putting words in my mouth. I provided an explanation - based on the teachings of their religion - for the "acts of a very few extremists."



I have read it. I've also read the sunnahs and hadiths, as well as Islamic jurisprudence. Obviously you haven't yet you still feel qualified to lecture us on Islam and draw moral equivalencies with Christianity. I expect your lecture on the Crusades is coming next.



There is lots of killing in the Bible. No one will dispute that. But there is a big difference: the violent passages in the Bible are descriptive; the violent passages in the Quran are prescriptive. You're welcome to try and find an example of prescriptive violence in the Bible. I won't hold my breath though.



Being killed in the name of Christianity is not the same as being killed because Christianity commands it. Unless you're an Amalekite, you have nothing to fear.



Homo sapiens are a violent species. No argument there. Committing violence when you believe God approves removes all restraint.


I actually agree with alot of the things you have stated. It is deplorable how they treat their women. I feel that it's a pretty backwards religion but I feel all religions are backwards thinking.

That being said the system that they're using to keep people out of the country isn't good discerning who is a terrorist and who isnt.

And it absolutely aids in a recruitment tool for the enemy. He campaigned on a Muslim ban not a seven countries that are in the Middle East but a Muslim ban.

Our enemies and critics are going to correctly interpret it as a hostile act.

We never fucking learn.
 
I could see people being pissed if Trump made a ban against US citizens but he is keeping out people from another country, I didnt know people from foreign countries have rights guaranteed by the US constitution?? Is everyone in the world a US citizen now?

Egg-fucking-zactly, not only is this not aimed at US citizens, but only at migrants (of whatever flavor) from 7 really unsavory places (barely countries a couple of them).

WTF is wrong with those who claim anyone should be able to enter at will? Have they never been to any other country, never gotten an entry permit or visa in their passport? And all contingent on being accepted into that country. If you overstay, the consequences will be severe. Why can't the US operate like EVERY other nation on the planet?
 
America has enough people, no need to let any more in. That being said, we sure do not need to let any more uneducated rabble in.

America was 85% White when I was born, now it is 60% White, also in the same time frame Blacks were the second largest ethnic group, now they are number three. It seems for some it is ok that whites and blacks are being erased in America, this type of disgusting genocidal racism makes me sick.
 
I actually agree with alot of the things you have stated. It is deplorable how they treat their women. I feel that it's a pretty backwards religion but I feel all religions are backwards thinking.

That being said the system that they're using to keep people out of the country isn't good discerning who is a terrorist and who isnt.

And it absolutely aids in a recruitment tool for the enemy. He campaigned on a Muslim ban not a seven countries that are in the Middle East but a Muslim ban.

Our enemies and critics are going to correctly interpret it as a hostile act.

We never fucking learn.
So, if we don't let someone move to this country they become a terrorist and kill Americans. Are you telling me the answer to that is to let that person move to America?
 
So, if we don't let someone move to this country they become a terrorist and kill Americans. Are you telling me the answer to that is to let that person move to America?

Doesn't it kind of sound like how if the Middle East doesn't sell us oil we go in and overthrow democratically voted governments, murder innocent men, women and children, install dictators who would acquiesce to our will, etc? You play with fire long enough and you will be burned
 
So, if we don't let someone move to this country they become a terrorist and kill Americans. Are you telling me the answer to that is to let that person move to America?

Come on browski. Have another cup of coffee. Smoke a joint. Read what I posted again. Maybe three times if its good smoke. I never once said let anyone in without being screened. There are good ways of doing things and the wrong way to doing things. We always pick the latter it seems.

Its like immigration. There are many problems, you can point them out and fix them without calling mexicans drug dealers and murderers.

Hows the smoke?
 
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