DNP Query

[nightwolf]

Hey guys,

Would like some guidance here.

My friend got some DNP tabs from a source here, we had compared it to one procured from Qsc. Qsc provides the raw powder version that when dried combusts as it should. The one that our friend got from a source here just burns. When he consumed it, he feels warm, he has lost some weight on it so it does work. Compared to the QSC one which make you hot and requires an AC blowing on you.

Screenehots here:
- the one lit with the matchstick explodes QSC deeper yellow almost orange
- the one on fire is the alternate source. Yellow.



Our question:
- is this a different type of DNP?

I don't want to name the other source until I know more, could be legit. Another friend said that it's a 'DNP like' molecule.

Thanks for your time.

 

[Astartes]

Thing with glps is that you'll get desensitized, could switch drugs like I do, I went to a max of 6mg on tirz and switched to sema 0.75 to 1mg is the dose that halts my appetite. 50 lbs sure fine. But 100lbs yea it's gonna be a long journey while I continue to fix my diet, exercise, etc. But I'm making progress, 1% better everyday.

Mmmm… Desensitized to high dose appetite curbing effect maybe. I’m not sure science supports desensitization for all the impacts that actually make GLPs GOOD for you. Semiglutide for example is almost biologically identical with a slight tweak to increase half life. Be careful drawing that assumption.

 

[Ghoul]

Mmmm… Desensitized to high dose appetite curbing effect maybe. I’m not sure science supports desensitization for all the impacts that actually make GLPs GOOD for you. Semiglutide for example is almost biologically identical with a slight tweak to increase half life. Be careful drawing that assumption.

I have been studying GLP compounds since before the first mention of them being used for weight loss by celebrities ever appeared in the media.

Post in thread 'Lowering Tirzepatide tolerance'

Aug 20, 2024

There continues to be a fundamental misunderstanding of how these drugs work.

They're not diet pills that induce appetite reduction when you take them.

They're hormones that set the body's weight regulating "thermostat" to a lower level. Since appetite reduction and the weight loss inducing effects are the body's natural mechanism to regulating weight, once the "setting" is reached appetite suppression weakens, then stops.

If you put on 10 pounds, and stayed on the same dose, appetite suppression would return, until you returned to the weight set point again.

To lose more weight...

• Ghoul

• 

 

[nightwolf]

You don't get desensitized to GLPs, you, like most people, don't understand how they work, and jumping from one compound to another is not the answer.

Hey Ghoul, I've read about your "set point" theory, I don't think I believe in it. It's anec data but I just think that your body get desentized at a particular dose. I have a log, I was on 5mg for about a month, went up to 6mg and then 7.5mg. At 6mg and 7.5 I was able to eat a cow compared to my first 2 weeks on tirz on 2.5mg. Right now on sema 0.75mg my appetite has completely reset as though I was never on the drug before. Sema likely hitting my receptors harder but that's been my experience thus far.

 

[RekTest]

I didnt want my dose to get too high, what do I do after 15mg? Do I go higher? What if I switch to sema and only 2.5mg is effective for me? What else would be effective on me after maxing out?

Those were my questions, so there was a guy named @Sector, that said that switching kinda jelps, so im rotating them in 3 month cycles when I think the dose gets a bit too high. My last resort would be to stack them, I believe this would give me the longest run on them both as I have about 100 lbs to go, down 50 already

I think your losing out on more than you think doing it that way, for instance (and I only know for Tirz not others) Tirz stimulates lipolysis, so all your thinking about is appetite control when Tirz does so much more and your losing out on only running it in low doses.

 

[nightwolf]

I have been studying GLP compounds since before the first mention of them being used for weight loss by celebrities ever appeared in the media.

Post in thread 'Lowering Tirzepatide tolerance'

Aug 20, 2024

There continues to be a fundamental misunderstanding of how these drugs work.

They're not diet pills that induce appetite reduction when you take them.

They're hormones that set the body's weight regulating "thermostat" to a lower level. Since appetite reduction and the weight loss inducing effects are the body's natural mechanism to regulating weight, once the "setting" is reached appetite suppression weakens, then stops.

If you put on 10 pounds, and stayed on the same dose, appetite suppression would return, until you returned to the weight set point again.

To lose more weight...

• Ghoul

• 

I get what you're trying to say, but if we go along with that wouldn't that mean that you keep increasing your dose anytime it stops working? Reaching 30,40,50,100mg of tirz for instance?

Coming off such large doses I'm sure would open up another bag of worms cause your body never knew "true hunger" cause you've been packed with glps all this time... You'd be eating cows for snacks all day long

 

[Astartes]

Hey Ghoul, I've read about your "set point" theory, I don't think I believe in it. It's anec data but I just think that your body get desentized at a particular dose. I have a log, I was on 5mg for about a month, went up to 6mg and then 7.5mg. At 6mg and 7.5 I was able to eat a cow compared to my first 2 weeks on tirz on 2.5mg. Right now on sema 0.75mg my appetite has completely reset as though I was never on the drug before. Sema likely hitting my receptors harder but that's been my experience thus far.

Again… you just need to study them more.

I wish I had time to link you all the studies and podcasts by field endocrinologists. I’m just 48 years old and closer to my end than ever before… and don’t have time to dig for folks.

(My son sucks up enough of my time talking about video games at the gym as my eyes glaze over)

Ghoul is correct in this case. Don’t confuse the _minor_ appetite curving impact deterioration and habit adjustment (Studies find this is primarily mental) for the real biological impacts that you benefit from… which primarily drive improved health and weight loss/regulation.

 

[nightwolf]

I think your losing out on more than you think doing it that way, for instance (and I only know for Tirz not others) Tirz stimulates lipolysis, so all your thinking about is appetite control when Tirz does so much more and your losing out on only running it in low doses.

I agree with you, I actually love tirz more than sema, but the suppression on tirz was fading even on higher doses, so 3 month cycle, switch back to tirz, if not I stack. I found myself eating 3 to 4k calories on tirz 6mg and 7.5 vs 5. Mind you there was some suppression but man it was miniscule.

 

[RekTest]

I agree with you, I actually love tirz more than sema, but the suppression on tirz was fading even on higher doses, so 3 month cycle, switch back to tirz, if not I stack. I found myself eating 3 to 4k calories on tirz 6mg and 7.5 vs 5. Mind you there was some suppression but man it was miniscule.

You still have to have willpower. I wouldnt call 6 or 7mg a high dose.

260lbs to 208lbs I only got up to 15mg Tirz, I dont know in what world you think you would ever get to 30mg, let alone 100mg i dont think you realize how insane that would be, chase fuking irons of Tirz

 

[nightwolf]

Again… you just need to study them more.

I wish I had time to link you all the studies and podcasts by field endocrinologists. I’m just 48 years old and closer to my end than ever before… and don’t have time to dig for folks anymore.

Ghoul is correct in this case. Don’t confuse the _minor_ appetite curving impact deterioration and habit adjustment (Studies find this is primarily mental) for the real biological impacts that you benefit from… which primarily drive improved health and weight loss/regulation.

I have been reading and will continue to do so, i am taking the necessary steps to improve my diet and exercise (2200 cals and 45 mins to 1hr cardio, weight will be added back in). However, the "minor appetite" craving to someone who has had a lifelong eating disorder would easily send me into a 8k surplus on a weekend, it's not so minor based on what I've experienced, if it was i'd be behind it.

 

[nightwolf]

You still have to have willpower. I wouldnt call 6 or 7mg a high dose.

260lbs to 208lbs I only got up to 15mg Tirz, I dont know in what world you think you would ever get to 30mg, let alone 100mg i dont think you realize how insane that would be.

Agreed, but my question still stands, what if and when i get to 250 lbs, I'm at max dose Tirz, switch to sema max dose doesn't work? What do I do then? appetite opens up, surplus, add on weight quicker, and keep rebounding?

Will by body create a new "thermal point" so now I go to 20 mgs (which i know is being researched). Surely you've experienced what happens when one comes off this drug. So I'm doing my best to mitigate any future implications now. There are people on this forum doing 30mg tirz and 2.4 mg sema and don't feel a thing too btw.

 

[Astartes]

Interesting thought. Though anecdotal.

Most people who see diminished (not saying all) appetite control and have to consistently up their doses aren’t (that I have witnessed) controlling carb intake.

I have noticed that folks who eat bad carbs or high amounts of carbs (high glycemic index or sugars) tend to really struggle.

They are feeding the carb addiction. Literally.

Those who control carbs at 25-30% of their daily diet and only eat mid/low glycemic index carbohydrates seem to survive on much lower doses.

My wife is a great example.(I am too)

She is on .45mg/week split every 4 days. (So really 8) All I need is .65mg/week. (Semaglutide)

Been on it over a year and actually now take 1 week off every 60 days due to slow build up in system making us a bit fatigued. 7 day half life leads to this buildup if taken weekly.

 

[Ghoul]

Hey Ghoul, I've read about your "set point" theory, I don't think I believe in it. It's anec data but I just think that your body get desentized at a particular dose. I have a log, I was on 5mg for about a month, went up to 6mg and then 7.5mg. At 6mg and 7.5 I was able to eat a cow compared to my first 2 weeks on tirz on 2.5mg. Right now on sema 0.75mg my appetite has completely reset as though I was never on the drug before. Sema likely hitting my receptors harder but that's been my experience thus far.

GIP in Tirz has a direct action on the brain that suppresses nausea and other GI side effects. Remove that "punishment inhibiting" component by using Sema, and it's harder to eat "beyond your appetite", so in the short term can induce faster weight loss. But the studies are clear, 15mg Tirz results in greater total loss than 2.4mg Sema.

Both Tirz and Sema show sustained weight loss via a maintenance dose over 3, and 4 years, respectfully.

If becoming desensitized to GLPs was happening, on the pharma protocol, the 17,000 patients followed should've regained the lost weight, yet they didn't.

I will point out however, that casual observation by myself, and increasingly clinicians, is that those who take any GLP class medication, then stop until it's washed out of their system, and return, even years later, fail to respond as well as "GLP naive" patients, and require higher doses for the same effect.

Those who never cease treatment don't have this problem.

It appears akin to developing an immunity to the weight loss effects of GLPs. I'm sure they'll get around to identifying the cause, but it's troubling because it seems very long lasting, if not permanent weakening of response.

I'll bet if you pick a single compound, and follow the same pharma protocol that's proven to work for 95%+ patients, you'd see more success than you do now.

 

[RekTest]

Interesting thought. Though anecdotal.

Most people who see diminished (not saying all) appetite control and have to consistently up their doses aren’t (that I have witnessed) controlling carb intake.

I have noticed that folks who eat bad carbs or high amounts of carbs (high glycemic index or sugars) tend to really struggle.

They are feeding the carb addiction. Literally.

Those who control carbs at 25-30% of their daily diet and only eat mid/low glycemic index carbohydrates seem to survive on much lower doses.

My wife is a great example.(I am too)

She is on .45mg/week split every 4 days. (So really 8) All I need is .65mg/week.

Been on it over a year and actually now take 1 week off every 60 days due to slow build up in system making us a bit fatigued. 7 day half life leads to this buildup if taken weekly,

I didnt know this, which is interesting because Ive been mainly keto and haven’t really struggled

 

[nightwolf]

Interesting thought. Though anecdotal.

Most people who see diminished (not saying all) appetite control and have to consistently up their doses aren’t (that I have witnessed) controlling carb intake.

I have noticed that folks who eat bad carbs or high amounts of carbs (high glycemic index or sugars) tend to really struggle.

They are feeding the carb addiction. Literally.

Those who control carbs at 25-30% of their daily diet and only eat mid/low glycemic index carbohydrates seem to survive on much lower doses.

My wife is a great example.(I am too)

She is on .45mg/week split every 4 days. (So really 8) All I need is .65mg/week.

Been on it over a year and actually now take 1 week off every 60 days due to slow build up in system making us a bit fatigued. 7 day half life leads to this buildup if taken weekly,

That is fair input, I could see how that would help. Carb addiction is real, I will explore this in-depth.

 

[Ghoul]

That is fair input, I could see how that would help. Carb addiction is real, I will explore this in-depth.

You may be better off sticking with Sema. Given the amount of weight you want to lose, and that you (and others) seem to benefit from the "punishment" effect that's stronger in Sema, a fail safe for when appetite satiety isn't enough to stop eating, it may be a better choice. Also, we have clinical trials for doses up to 7.2mg of Sema that are in Phase 3, enough to convince me it's reasonably safe to titrate up to that dose. It's also very cost effective.

So you have a very long runway with Sema. You can just keep increasing the dose every time you plateau. That would be a better idea than switching. or stacking compounds.

 

[nightwolf]

GIP has a direct action on the brain that suppresses nausea and other GI side effects. Remove that "punishment" component by using Sema, and it's harder to eat "beyond your appetite", so in the short term can induce faster weight loss. But the studies are clear, 15mg Tirz results in greater total loss than 2.4mg Sema.

Both Tirz and Sema show sustained weight loss via a maintenance dose over 3, and 4 years, respectfully.

If becoming desensitized to GLPs was happening, on the pharma protocol, the 17,000 patients followed should've regained the lost weight, yet they didn't.

I will point out however, that casual observation by myself, and increasingly clinicians, is that those who take any GLP class medication, then stop until it's washed out of their system, and return, even years later, fail to respond as well as "GLP naive" patients, and require higher doses for the same effect.

Those who never cease treatment don't have this problem.

It appears akin to developing an immunity to the weight loss effects of GLPs. I'm sure they'll get around to identifying the cause, but it's troubling because it seems very long lasting, if not permanent weakening of response.

I'll bet if you pick a single compound, and follow the same pharma protocol that's proven to work for 95%+ patients, you'd see more success than you do now.

Yea they should've regained their weight, but the research was done with participants who had about 50,60,70 lbs to lose for the majority, mostly doing it by BMI too. There were outliers and I'm still getting educated on the subject, but again, what do you do if you have 150 lbs to lose, slam higher GLP doses?

I agree with the coming off and on part.

There are studies that show majority of participants gaining back up to 85% of their weight in 3 years after coming off too. Mostly attributed to not fixing their underlying issue, their diet, exercise, etc as well.

"I'll bet if you pick a single compound, and follow the same pharma protocol that's proven to work for 95%+ patients, you'd see more success than you do now." - I don't doubt this, if I had 50lbs to lose, I'd hail mary my way up to 15mg right now. I'm afraid of what my mind would do after 15mg is no longer effective. So for now, I'm building my habits and taking my time, I know that there is some "slack" in the rope for the remaining doses I'll have to take eventually. My progress is steady, with some ups and downs but the work is in the diet and my mind and I'm thankful for what Tirz and Sema are helping me with.

For context, starting at 350lbs, managed to lose 55lbs natty took about 6 months, then rebounded, hopped on tirz, and made progress in about 1.5 to 2 months. Eating cleaner, better food choices, the works.

 

[nightwolf]

You may be better off sticking with Sema. Given the amount of weight you want to lose, and that you (and others) seem to benefit from the "punishment" effect that's stronger in Sema, a fail safe for when appetite satiety isn't enough to stop eating, it may be a better choice. Also, we have clinical trials for doses up to 7.2mg of Sema that are in Phase 3, enough to convince me it's reasonably safe to titrate up to that dose. It's also very cost effective.

So you have a very long runway with Sema. You can just keep increasing the dose every time you plateau. That would be a better idea than switching. or stacking compounds.

Yeah, makes sense. Tbh i don't feel any sides on sema when compared to Triz, I will consider sticking to sema longer depending on progress, etc. I do love the lipolysis benefit from Triz, and did have slightly more energy on it so there is that. However, it's good to know that the "runway" is getting longer. Still getting on high doses of any medications needs to be seen as a last resort in my opinion. Don't want to find yourself in a situation where only that dose will work on you now after you come off and realize that your food demon is back.

 

[Ghoul]

Yea they should've regained their weight, but the research was done with participants who had about 50,60,70 lbs to lose for the majority, mostly doing it by BMI too. There were outliers and I'm still getting educated on the subject, but again, what do you do if you have 150 lbs to lose, slam higher GLP doses?

I agree with the coming off and on part.

There are studies that show majority of participants gaining back up to 85% of their weight in 3 years after coming off too. Mostly attributed to not fixing their underlying issue, their diet, exercise, etc as well.

"I'll bet if you pick a single compound, and follow the same pharma protocol that's proven to work for 95%+ patients, you'd see more success than you do now." - I don't doubt this, if I had 50lbs to lose, I'd hail mary my way up to 15mg right now. I'm afraid of what my mind would do after 15mg is no longer effective. So for now, I'm building my habits and taking my time, I know that there is some "slack" in the rope for the remaining doses I'll have to take eventually. My progress is steady, with some ups and downs but the work is in the diet and my mind and I'm thankful for what Tirz and Sema are helping me with.

For context, starting at 350lbs, managed to lose 55lbs natty took about 6 months, then rebounded, hopped on tirz, and made progress in about 1.5 to 2 months. Eating cleaner, better food choices, the works.

Given how potent just 2.4mg Sema is, there are few "non-responders" at that dose, and produces the current maximum weight loss the drug is known for, I think 7.2mg is likely extremely effective. I'd be surprised if you had to go that high to lose even 100lbs and will stop short of it.

The main reason I recommend Tirz of Sema, usually, is for the GIP benefits over the long term, and gentler side effects.

But when there are other factors to consider, like cost effectiveness, or as in your case, someone needs a GLP with a strong "whip hand", Sema can be a better choice to get the job done.

 

[nightwolf]

Guys, as much as I'd like to continue the GLP talk....But the DNP question still stands.

I need input on the DNP question, been sidetracked. Who best to talk to for this @DECLAN @iris @Astartes. I need some solid data on it lol.

It could be diluted, but then wouldn't it have like small sparks when ignited rather than burn?

I haven't been able to find any scientific data on a different "type of DNP"

​

 

[nightwolf]

If it works don't care about it, maybe the yellow is pure the other is cut with others things, anyway tell your friend to take salbutamol or clen with a clean diet, DNP is dangerous and by the way he lose 1lbs per day is going right to the wall, weight is mean to go down slowly or you lose muscle and your body will take some serious damage,
2 hours cardio with 1800cal ? What's body weight ? Depending on weight maybe he have bad insuline resistance or maybe he played with thyroid meds and stop the natural production, if I do 2 hours cardio on 1800cal I will disappear in days

Man I've heard some stories about some drugs sourced from UGL labs....could be something else causing the warm reaction. Any info you could provide would be helpful, the diluted theory makes sense to a point, but I'm wondering if there might be something more.