Finasteride [5ARI] Induced/Associated Effects

[koneall]

A few years ago I tried testosterone cypionate injections. Eventually quit because they raised libido too high. I felt like a dirty old man leering at every woman I saw. Then due to BPH I tried betasitosterol.. This is a 5ARi similar to proscar. It destroyed my libido and led to nascent gynecomastia. So I went back to testosterone injections. It had only a minor improvement on libido. It reduced the gyno signs but little else. I then tried Deprenyl. Blood work showed everything normal. So maybe Deprenyl being able to cross the BBB is might do something that improves libido. I've been using it for about 3 months now. The benefits: My mood is better, I occasionally wake up with wood, I'm definitely more interested in women. The negative effects are constant low-grade headache and constipation.

Just wanted to share that,

koneall

 

[Dr JIM]

Locate therapy for that "brain fog" and you'll notice a remarkable and expeditious recovery of your physical yearnings!

 

[ironwill1951]

sometimes you hear all the bad and none of the good about a drug.
ive been using finasteride for well over 10 yrs with no problem

 

[Ticonderoga]

Finasteride works as it claims and for most men, there are no problems. Some men have problems with it. I took it for years without any problems. It was when I quit that my body did not adjust and my HPTA crashed.

 

[Energyx]

My Urologist who is 48 takes propecia every day as a preventative measure against BPH due to enlarged prostates being in his family genes. He is very well known and he says all the reports about irreversible side effects are nonsense. He has been prescribing it for over 11 years and has yet to see long term issues. His feelings on irreversible side effects are probably due to other underlying conditions or men who are already on the brink of low T and after a few years their T levels plummet naturally any way with or without propecia.
He says lower ejaculatory volume will happen because the prostate shrinks and some men due experience gyno. Other than that, he loves it.
My friend who is losing his hair goes to a very well known hair transplant dr and he gives most of his patients propecia before trying hair transplantation and even he says he has yet to see any issues with long term side effects. This guy has every reason to say propecia is dangerous because he makes his money with hair transplants, NOT prescribing propecia.
Think about it, if propecia continued to render side effects for years after stopping, that means prostate effects would be permanent ( a good thing) and hair loss would stop permanently. Propecia wouldnt just cause permanent side effects in your penis but be reversible every where else.

 

[Ticonderoga]

PM me the name of your uro. Maybe he can help me. Thanks.

 

[Ticonderoga]

Energyx, I am not flaming your post. I am serious as if he is in the US I will consider seeing him. Thanks.

 

[dogheat]

It's just like russian roulette. You play with fire, you get burned.

Play with finasteride, you get symptoms of low t which are irreversible and ED 4 life.

 

[johnnyBALLZ]

It's just like russian roulette. You play with fire, you get burned.



Play with finasteride, you get symptoms of low t which are irreversible and ED 4 life.

Yea it's like Russian roulette except there's not a 1 in 6 chance it's more like 1 in 100.. A little different..

 

[Enden]

I just posted some information in another thread. I discovered this sticky thread after doing so, so I'll just quote myself.

I realize that this is an old thread, but the topic is still relevant. I just want to inform people with PFS that there's a new private forum, that's centered around blogging, research and experimental treatments. To maintain a certain quality, only people that have an account on propeciahelp.com will be accepted. You can register there first if you don't have an account, and then you're welcome to join http://www.solvepfs.com (SolvePFS.com)

I hope that the moderators here will allow this post. I apologize if you don't.

 

[jonyoung]

I have a similar problem I believe after using andractim dht gel excessively and improperly and my dht levels were low

my dr was put me on a generic armidex so instead my testosterone converting to estradiol or estrogen it converts to dht (I'm also on clomid)
this was helped with sex drive and other factors though I'm still not exactly where I want to be

I'm not too familiar on this topic so I'm just throwing my experience out there , personally I have also read up on proviron though and those would be my 2 best bets to look into and neurotransmitters may be another wise decision

though if anyone has any solutions or full proof cures I'm all ears and would love to hear it

 

[Nba]

Re: Help me please -- Finasteride-induced secondary hypogonadism, low T/LH/FSH, high

Look my life is ruined due to finasteride, and i only took it for 1 month or 5 weeks as far as i can remember.

As soon as i quit (2 weeks later in precise) all HELL BROKE LOOSE. Balls started to ache, dick started to loose sensitivity, sperm started to decrease in quantity and fade in quality and so on. Finally i was left with 2/3 of my previous ball size and 4-5 cm decrease in penis size. I didnt have sex for 2 straight years. Not even a BJ. Not even felt anything about it.

Then i started training very hard, quit smoking and anything that affected my health. Well, guess what, within 1 year i was very strong and managed to get back some of penile sensitivty , BUT NOT BALL SIZE. By 2 years time training heavily, squatting, playing bball i had restored 70% of my sexual function. If i quit training for 2-3 weeks things went bad again. If i quit taking whey protein and carbos things got bad also.

Finally so much training started to hit me along with me wokring and studying all day long, since in order to recover from stressful situations you need normal testo levels, which i didnt have after fin and i was trying to reach!!! Dahh..

So soon i started getting boots of fatigue which i coudlnt explain. I couldnt recover readily from training any more.I developed overtraining twice in 4 months, second time led me to heavy dysautonomia and adrenal fatigue. Adrenal fatigue was not handled properly here by greek docs and ended up screwing up completely my body. Now i have Chronic Fatigue Syndrome full blown. ALL MY HORMONES ARE VERY LOW. MY balls recently got screwed up for uknown reason more and are SO FUCKING SMALL AND SO SOFT. I cant even touch them.

Anyways, i dont know what to do. I tried many drugs, unfortunately i am so unlucky i had to take CIPRO ony year ago and then i urgently took HYDROCORTIONE as well and this fucked me even more, side effects have not gone away, CIPRO caused me increased intracranial pressure and tendon problems eye problems (double vision, floaters), dizziness for months and for sure it fucked my axis even more. Just after cipro it was that my balls got even smaller than before noticeably this time for even doctors.I am in bed for more than 2 years now MOST days i dont have the energy to even ride my bike around my building, -walking is very hard to do and it messes up my head pressure and i have to stay in bed for days with headaches- somedays i feel i should just jump off the building

ONE DRUG AND YOUR LIFE CAN BE SOOO OVER.

Now if there is a chance to recover from all this somehow i guess i need to heal my prostate first from the finasteride damage and then head for restoring the HPT axis with hcg and novla. But can those two work while i have so low cortisol levels? Will they bring my cortisol levels up more or will i get some more sides ???

Yet it seems that i have been in the same situation with no improvement for more than 6 months now. Its like i have hit the roof of restoration with natural ways.

STAY AWAY FROM FINASTERIDE. ITS NO JOKE DRUG. I KNOW 20 PEOPLE AT LEAST THAT HAVE TAKEN IT, DOCTORS INCLUDED AND YEARS LATER THEIR LIFE STARTED TO FALL APART. THE BODY DOESNT SEEM TO ADAPT TO THE CHANGES THE DRUG CAUSES AND THEY ARE PERMANENT

Have you managed to recover from your Chronic Fatigue yet ? If so, how ? I took Propecia and developed full blown Chronic Fatigue with severe head symptoms. I feel better when I get nocturnal erections but these are very infrequent. My symptoms are getting rapidly worse now I'm in my late thirties. Interested to hear any news from you.

 

[Nba]

Re: Help me please -- Finasteride-induced secondary hypogonadism, low T/LH/FSH, high

Look my life is ruined due to finasteride, and i only took it for 1 month or 5 weeks as far as i can remember.

As soon as i quit (2 weeks later in precise) all HELL BROKE LOOSE. Balls started to ache, dick started to loose sensitivity, sperm started to decrease in quantity and fade in quality and so on. Finally i was left with 2/3 of my previous ball size and 4-5 cm decrease in penis size. I didnt have sex for 2 straight years. Not even a BJ. Not even felt anything about it.

Then i started training very hard, quit smoking and anything that affected my health. Well, guess what, within 1 year i was very strong and managed to get back some of penile sensitivty , BUT NOT BALL SIZE. By 2 years time training heavily, squatting, playing bball i had restored 70% of my sexual function. If i quit training for 2-3 weeks things went bad again. If i quit taking whey protein and carbos things got bad also.

Finally so much training started to hit me along with me wokring and studying all day long, since in order to recover from stressful situations you need normal testo levels, which i didnt have after fin and i was trying to reach!!! Dahh..

So soon i started getting boots of fatigue which i coudlnt explain. I couldnt recover readily from training any more.I developed overtraining twice in 4 months, second time led me to heavy dysautonomia and adrenal fatigue. Adrenal fatigue was not handled properly here by greek docs and ended up screwing up completely my body. Now i have Chronic Fatigue Syndrome full blown. ALL MY HORMONES ARE VERY LOW. MY balls recently got screwed up for uknown reason more and are SO FUCKING SMALL AND SO SOFT. I cant even touch them.

Anyways, i dont know what to do. I tried many drugs, unfortunately i am so unlucky i had to take CIPRO ony year ago and then i urgently took HYDROCORTIONE as well and this fucked me even more, side effects have not gone away, CIPRO caused me increased intracranial pressure and tendon problems eye problems (double vision, floaters), dizziness for months and for sure it fucked my axis even more. Just after cipro it was that my balls got even smaller than before noticeably this time for even doctors.I am in bed for more than 2 years now MOST days i dont have the energy to even ride my bike around my building, -walking is very hard to do and it messes up my head pressure and i have to stay in bed for days with headaches- somedays i feel i should just jump off the building

ONE DRUG AND YOUR LIFE CAN BE SOOO OVER.

Now if there is a chance to recover from all this somehow i guess i need to heal my prostate first from the finasteride damage and then head for restoring the HPT axis with hcg and novla. But can those two work while i have so low cortisol levels? Will they bring my cortisol levels up more or will i get some more sides ???

Yet it seems that i have been in the same situation with no improvement for more than 6 months now. Its like i have hit the roof of restoration with natural ways.

STAY AWAY FROM FINASTERIDE. ITS NO JOKE DRUG. I KNOW 20 PEOPLE AT LEAST THAT HAVE TAKEN IT, DOCTORS INCLUDED AND YEARS LATER THEIR LIFE STARTED TO FALL APART. THE BODY DOESNT SEEM TO ADAPT TO THE CHANGES THE DRUG CAUSES AND THEY ARE PERMANENT

Have you managed to recover from your Chronic Fatigue yet ? If so, how ? I took Propecia and developed full blown Chronic Fatigue with severe head symptoms. I feel better when I get nocturnal erections but these are very infrequent. My symptoms are getting rapidly worse now I'm in my late thirties. Interested to hear any news from you.

 

[Michael Scally MD]

A 27-year-old Caucasian man with no past medical history presented to our clinic complaining of brownish discoloration on this bilateral temples and forehead. He reported that this rash initially started on his bilateral temples two years ago, approximately 6-8 months after having started low-dose finasteride (Propecia®) for prevention of androgenetic alopecia.

Famenini S, Gharavi NM, Beynet DP. Finasteride associated melasma in a caucasian male. J Drugs Dermatol 2014;13(4):484-6. Finasteride Associated Melasma in a Caucasian Male: Scientific, Peer-Reviewed Dermatology Article Indexed with MEDLINE/PubMed

Melasma is an acquired hypermelanosis that typically affects sun-exposed areas on the face and presents as symmetric brownish macules and patches. It is most commonly reported in women and thought to be related to the effects of estrogen and progesterone on melanocytes. Since the advent of finasteride 1mg daily tablets for the treatment of androgenic alopecia, we have noticed an increase in the number of men presenting with melasma. Here we present one of those cases. We hypothesize this could be related to the effects of finasteride on estrogen and progesterone concentrations in the skin

 

[Michael Scally MD]

Highlights
• Post-finasteride patients show altered levels of neuroactive steroids.
• Post-finasteride patients show persistent sexual side effects.
• Post-finasteride patients show anxious/depressive symptomatology.

Caruso D, Abbiati F, Giatti S, et al. Patients Treated for Male Pattern Hair with Finasteride Show, after Discontinuation of the Drug, Altered Levels of Neuroactive Steroids in Cerebrospinal Fluid and Plasma. J Steroid Biochem Mol Biol. PATIENTS TREATED FOR MALE PATTERN HAIR WITH FINASTERIDE SHOW, AFTER DISCONTINUATION OF THE DRUG, ALTERED LEVELS OF NEUROACTIVE STEROIDS IN CEREBROSPINAL FLUID AND PLASMA

Observations performed in a subset of patients treated for male pattern hair loss seem to indicate that persistent sexual side effects as well as anxious/depressive symptomatology were reported even after discontinuation of finasteride treatment.

Due to the capability of finasteride to block the metabolism of progesterone (PROG) and/or testosterone (T) we have evaluated, by liquid chromatography-tandem mass spectrometry, the levels of several neuroactive steroids in paired plasma and cerebrospinal fluid (CSF) samples obtained from post-finasteride patients and in healthy controls.

At the examination, post-finasteride patients referred muscular stiffness, cramps, tremors and chronic fatigue in the absence of clinical evidence of any muscular disorder or strength reduction.

Severity of the anxious/depressive symptoms were quite variable in their frequency, overall all the subjects had a fairly complex and constant neuropsychiatric pattern.

Assessment of neuroactive steroid levels in CSF show a decrease of PROG and its metabolites, dihydroprogesterone (DHP) and tetrahydroprogesterone (THP), associated to an increase of its precursor pregnenolone (PREG).

Altered levels were also observed for T and its metabolites. Thus, a significant decrease of dihydrotestosterone (DHT) associated to an increase of T as well as of 3alpha-diol was detected.

Changes in neuroactive steroid levels also occurred in plasma. An increase of PREG, T, 3alpha-diol, 3beta-diol and 17beta-estradiol was associated to decreased levels of DHP and THP.

The present observations show that altered levels of neuroactive steroids, associated to depression symptoms, are present in androgenic alopecia patients even after discontinuation of the finasteride treatment.

 

[deadwood]

A 27-year-old Caucasian man with no past medical history presented to our clinic complaining of brownish discoloration on this bilateral temples and forehead. He reported that this rash initially started on his bilateral temples two years ago, approximately 6-8 months after having started low-dose finasteride (Propecia®) for prevention of androgenetic alopecia.

Famenini S, Gharavi NM, Beynet DP. Finasteride associated melasma in a caucasian male. J Drugs Dermatol 2014;13(4):484-6. Finasteride Associated Melasma in a Caucasian Male: Scientific, Peer-Reviewed Dermatology Article Indexed with MEDLINE/PubMed

Melasma is an acquired hypermelanosis that typically affects sun-exposed areas on the face and presents as symmetric brownish macules and patches. It is most commonly reported in women and thought to be related to the effects of estrogen and progesterone on melanocytes. Since the advent of finasteride 1mg daily tablets for the treatment of androgenic alopecia, we have noticed an increase in the number of men presenting with melasma. Here we present one of those cases. We hypothesize this could be related to the effects of finasteride on estrogen and progesterone concentrations in the skin

Very careless of you to post that shitty study without explaining it to these idiots. Considering the board consists of low educated idiots you should explain this study is bullshit causation study. It's like saying since 911 I get more heartburn so 911 caused my increased heart burn. Show me one study that shows chloasma as a side effect of taking finasteride???

There have been 100's of well funded studies on both this and dut that show absolutely no change in hormonal profile (save the decrease in DHT) except a modest increase in test and a modest increase in LH. Not ONE showed it increases estrogen or any other hormone in the body except those two listed.

In other words, as an MD, you really shouldn't be helping these law suit faggot shills and idiots with mental health issues. If you listen to these fucking goofs Fin is the single most destructive application since radiation. Some of your lawyer shills also try to throw in Saw Pametto in the mix for fun.,

 

[deadwood]

Basically it will come down to this: Who will you believe: Some random goofs on hair loss or BB sites (many who are 1-3 post wonders who post that same old rehashed horror story) or 18,000 cancer men?
MMS: Error

Notice the number of placebo guys who had ED on this study. People are fucked. It's that simple. ED is a common problem for most old men.

I am sure the side effect of 25% fewer cases of prostate cancer and 50% fewer cases of benign prostate hyperplasia is never complained about on these shady boards huh?


I also don't hear the horror stories of NSAIDS on these boards and those kill 8,000 people a year. Where are the grieving wives, children, parents??? Oh yeah....no trial or lawsuit is happening there.

 

[LOW T]

Hi guys, I've been lurking for awhile but the time has come for me to post... I really need your help, PLEASE. I don't know what to do anymore and my health and quality of life has been ruined thanks to Finasteride.

LAB ATTACHMENTS ARE INCLUDED IN THIS POST.

I am 27 years old, 5'10, 150lbs. I took Finasteride (Proscar) quartered 1.25mg/day for 11 months when I was 25-26 for hairloss. It has now been 14 months since I quit (cold turkey) and I have still not recovered from the side effects I experienced. This was after I was told by my doctor and MERCK's literature that any side effects would resolve upon discontinuation of the drug.

Prior to Finasteride I was a perfectly healthy 25 yr old guy, I loved to have sex, could get hard at the drop of a hat, was always horny and mentally sharp. Now a year and a half later I'm a shell of my former self, and am STILL experiencing side effects that manifested while on the drug, including:


Sexual:
---------
- Low libido, no primal desire for sex, never horny
- No spontaneous, morning or nocturnal erections
- Numb feeling/lack of sensitivity in penis/balls, rubbery penis
- Penis/nuts extremely wrinkled when flaccid, constantly retreating
- Penile/scrotum shrinkage
- Porn/girls don't turn me on anymore (nothing happens down there)
- Some penis curvature and rotation on axis to left
- Semen volume/shooting distance decrease
- Semen consistency change from thick creamy white before fin, to clear and watery while on fin.... after fin, semen is somewhat thick and sheet yellow/white in color.
- Loss of erections soon after penetration, unable to sustain


Mental:
--------
- Brain fog, difficulty remembering things, forgetfulness
- Stumbling over words, tongue tied, slurring of speech
- Emotional blunting / no feelings
- Lack of energy, interest in hobbies, no passion to do anything anymore


Physical:
--------
Pseudo-gyno


When I quit on October 1, 2005, my dick was shrivelled, totally numb and tingly, and completely lifeless... I couldn't feel anything down there anymore. I couldnt get turned on, my jizz was like water and I felt like I was constantly out of it mentally, and always tired. Also by this point I was experiencing full-blown panic attacks, anxiety, weight gain and the beginnings of puffy nips/gyno (I had major chest pains in month 6 -- should have recognized the signs).

2 weeks after I quit I felt a massive flood of DHT come back into my system. I felt horny and alive again!!! I could get turned on no problem, erections were 100%, jizz volume great, penis/balls were full size.

3 months later by January 2006, the flood of DHT had disappeared and I felt like complete crap... my system had crashed. At this point I got my first labs drawn.


LABS (Canadian values):
-----------------------

1. January 2006 (3 months off):
- low T (12.8 nmo/L, range 8.4-28.7 = 388 in US)
- high TSH (4.54, range 0.30-5.50).

Family doctor refused to believe Finasteride could be causing these problems, said everything was in my head. I knew it wasn't and by this point I had found the Yahoo Finasteride Side Effects forum. I came to realize there were hundreds of other men who had their HPTA screwed by finasteride, and have yet to recover.

2. May 2006 (8 months off) - 2nd blood test:
- T went up to 17.3 (519)
- TSH went down to 2.33
- Estradiol 154 (43 US terms)
- LH 2.0 (2.0-18) ... BORDERLINE
- FSH 2.1 (2.0-18) ... BORDERLINE
- Also had a semen test - came back fertile.

I realized at this point I was experiencing symptoms of secondary hypogonadism. Again my doctor shrugged things off and told me to come back in 6 months.


TODAY:
--------

December 2006 (14 months off):

- Have since seen a world-reknowned Urologist who basically told me this was all in my head and claimed all my values were "normal", yet found it "interesting" that I had no morning, noctunals or spontaneous wood.
- Prescribed me Viagra (at 27!!!) and sent me on my way.

Even though its been 14 months since I quit, I am still experiencing all of the above side effects, and nothing has really improved. My main issue is still the lack of sex drive, penis/nuts shrinkage, reduced ejaculate and difficulty getting erections (due to lack of libido).

I am seeing another local Endo in March but may get new labs before then (they cost me $) to check Estradiol, Total T, TSH, LH, FSH, Prolactin, Progesterone, SHBG, DHT, AST, ALT, DHEA-s, Cortisol, Albumin, and Free Testosterone.

--------------

TREATMENT HELP:

Well, here's where I need your guys' help and expert opinions...

Basically... HOW CAN I GET BACK TO NORMAL? I understand HCG and Clomid can be used to jumpstart the HPTA... but for how long after you've been shutdown? Does anyone even know how or why Fin screws up the HTPA in the first place (besides blocking DHT/T upregulation/extra aromatization to E?)

Based on my last labs, my best guess is to get my Estradiol under control (apparently its high?) to correct the T/E ratio, and see where Prolactin and SHBG are with my next labs. I understand the former can shutdown T production/the latter binds Free T, which is crucial for libido. Hopefully by correcting those hormones LH will be stimulated and T/FSH will rise again?

However, eventually I think I will make an appointment to see Dr John or Shippens in the US. I understand they have experience treating men shutdown my Fin... but if anyone knows a doctor or endo in Canada that has treated Finasteride patientsthen please let me know... I really don't want to have to resort to going on TRT for life (if I could even find a doc willing to work with me on it).


Thanks in advance for any and all insight, I feel like a shell of my former self but I know there must be a way to beat this.

You guys are the best.

Hey man i took finasteride for 15 months.. I am currently on TRT.. I think i got hit but i dont think i got hit as bad as u.. As it currently stands i have been finasteride for 7 months. i went and seen a urologist 2 months after i had a sede effect of anorgasmia.. I quit immediately.. Im on testoserone cream daily and i eat 5m daily cialis.. I am able to have sex everyday on this protocol?? i have been on this protocol on cialis daily for 2 months and it works just as well as the first time i took it.. i too had watery semen and now that i have been on TRT it is thick and white again.. i was on the propecia help forum but they kicked me off because they said i didnt have PFS because this protocol was working form me.. Have u tried TRT and cialis daily 5 mg and does it work for u???

 

[Michael Scally MD]

Upreti R, Hughes KA, Livingstone DEW, et al. 5?-Reductase type 1 modulates insulin sensitivity in men. The Journal of Clinical Endocrinology & Metabolism. http://press.endocrine.org/doi/abs/10.1210/jc.2014-1395

Context: 5?-Reductase (5?R) types 1 and 2 catalyse the A-ring reduction of steroids, including androgens and glucocorticoids. 5?-R inhibitors lower dihydrotestosterone (DHT) in benign prostatic hyperplasia: finasteride inhibits 5?R2; dutasteride inhibits both 5?R2 and 5?R1. In rodents, loss of 5?R1 promotes fatty liver.

Objective: To test the hypothesis that inhibition of 5?R1 causes metabolic dysfunction in humans.

Design: Double-blind randomised controlled parallel group study.

Setting: Clinical research facility.

Participants: 46 men (20–85 years) studied before and after intervention.

Intervention: Oral dutasteride (0.5 mg daily; n=16), finasteride (5 mg daily; n=16) or control (tamsulosin; 0.4 mg daily; n=14) for 3 months.

Main outcome measure: Glucose disposal during a stepwise hyperinsulinaemic euglycaemic clamp. Data are mean (SEM).

Results: Dutasteride and finasteride had similar effects on steroid profiles, with reduced urinary androgen and glucocorticoid metabolites, reduced circulating DHT, but no change in plasma or salivary cortisol.

Dutasteride, but not finasteride, reduced stimulation of glucose disposal by high dose insulin (dutasteride by -5.7 (3.2) ? mol/kg fat-free mass/min, versus finasteride +7.2 (3.0), and tamsulosin +7.0 (2.0)).

Dutasteride also reduced suppression of non-esterified fatty acids by insulin, and increased body fat (by 1.6 (0.6) %). Glucose production and glycerol turnover were unchanged.

Consistent with metabolic effects of dutasteride being mediated in peripheral tissues, mRNA for 5?R1 but not 5?R2 was detected in human adipose.

Conclusion: Dual inhibition of 5?Rs, but not inhibition of 5?R2 alone, modulates insulin sensitivity in human peripheral tissues rather than liver. This may have important implications for patients prescribed dutasteride for prostatic disease.

 

[Paul_Johnson]

fina is a whore who will fuck you and leave u burnin!