Finasteride [5ARI] Induced/Associated Effects

Discussion in 'Men's Health Forum' started by madclown, Dec 18, 2006.

  1. oneday

    oneday Junior Member

    day 13

    Thursday, January 8, 2009

    Day 13!

    Yesterday afternoon, I had a 1/4 of a cup of small ice coffee which gave me bad sleep. I decided that i wanted some coffee b/c i hadn't drank coffee in almost 2 months. So I bought a cup from dunkin donuts just to see what it takes like again. After stopping propecia, i notice that coffee left me drained of my adrenals and could not get a decent sleep, ever, even if i drank a cup early in the morning. I took 500 iu of hcg in my inner right thigh, vitamin E, and nolvadex at 1am, then i went to bed. It probably took me an hour to sleep and I woke up at 8am with a slight erection (65%). So i decide to put my theory to work and see if I get the same outCUM. hehe. If you've been reading the journal lately, then you know that my semen has been watery every morning. Also, after i talked about time trials yesterday, that i wanted to see how long i can last. I worked up my erection to 85% and kept it going for 18 mins with erection quality fluctuating between 65-80%. After i climaxed, the semen quality was good and there was no water this time, just substance. I think that the longer I'm excited, that gives the body time to build up the necessary fluid for the finally. I'll test out the theory tomorrow about erection during vs semen viscosity.

    I don't know whether it is poor sleep or what, but I felt devoid of energy and depressed. Currently, I have a lot of complexes right now and it has been too much to bear. I'm dealing with propecia sides, Hair, Halitosis, Youth complexes, and it affected me today. See I have the pocket size halitosis meter (Tanita Breath Alert - Engadget) on me at all times to check my breath b/c i suffered from Halitosis for 12 years. I think this is the worst affliction that anyone can have other than being disfigured of course, b/c it removes all sociability that you have with anyone. I'm telling you, this fucks me up more than propecia. Having Halitosis, you don't know if you have offensive breath and it is always on the back of your mind. Whenever you are in front of someone, you wonder is your breath strong and is the person keeping a straight face while talking to you. After 12 yrs of dealing with this, you'll develop paranoia and lose yourself, just b/c you don't want to speak and have someone cringe. I saw my doctor about this and he has bad breath too, he told me to keep the mouth moist with lozenges. Whoa, what an appifiny, tic tacs, gum, Listerine pacs, mouthwash never came to my mind. What a dumb fuck have i been. (I'm being sarcastic) Whatever, I have been on a journey trying to correct that issue for a very long time. With the halimeter, it tells you the following: no odor, slight order, mild, and strong odor, will either display 1,2,3,4 dots respectively on the meter. For the first 9 years I flossed and brushed my teeth for 2-3 mins, but my breath was always at a 3-4 dot range. I'm sorry guys, that is socially crippling and this will leave anyone with a complex. I've tried Profresh.com works great, but my breath would continue to get worse as the day went on. On Profresh my breath would flucuate between a 1-4 at given points in the day. I have been measuring my breath for 5 yrs now with this meter and i know a lot about breath measurements throughout the day. I made a lot of breakthroughs in 2008 b/c i figured out what was wrong with me. I was not brushing and scraping correctly, but the explanation gets very complex. First, your mouth is a huge structure, with teeth, tongue, throat, gums, side walls of the cheeks, top of pallet, and saliva, so not understanding these structures led to my bad breath. (Boo hoo, yea cry me a river by Justin Timberlake). I'm a fighter, so i don't give up bitches... Plaque is your worst enemy even if you brush your teeth and floss, scape your tongue, brush the side walls of your cheeks, there is plaque that you cannot get too. I don't care if you been brushing for 5 mins and your teeth is silky smooth, there is plaque somewhere. I conquered bad breath in stages:

    1. I was brushing and not rinsing correctly. Think of this analogy, you are going to mop the floor, then clean up the mud off the floor and you go into the next room to use the same bucket of dirty water. The point is that you moving around the bacteria from one area to the other. You may brush the bacteria from your teeth, but it bacteria infested brush water is flowing down onto your tongue and throat. So, my solution was to mix Listerine/water (50/50 ratio) and use it during brushing, flossing, scrapping, i would use the mixture to rinse and spit out.

    - Brush your gums, gumline, cheeks, pallate, tongue, teeth, then rinse with fresh mouthwash mixture.

    2. you should never floss prior to brushing your teeth b/c you'll be bringing harmful bacteria from your teeth up into your gums. So brush first then floss and rinse with listerine/water combo.


    3. Buy a good tongue scrapper, get one from Profresh.com and another scaper from amazon ([ame=http://www.amazon.com/Tongue-Sweeper-Model-PRO-K/dp/B00023CD46]Amazon.com: Tongue Sweeper Model A PRO K: Everything Else[/ame])
    scrap the WHOLE tongue and back near the throat. Then rinse with listerine/water mixture.


    4. Use the stimudent from the front and back of the teeth. ([ame=http://www.amazon.com/Johnson-Stim-U-Dent-Plaque-Removers-Packs/dp/B000XP4I3C]Amazon.com: Johnson & Johnson Stim-U-Dent Plaque Removers 12 Packs of 25 Picks/Pack (300 Picks): Health & Personal Care[/ame])

    I didn't mean for this to be a clinic on brushing but it cured me. There is great detail to this because there are complicated steps and techniques that i'm not going to explain in this journal, maybe for a new oneday journal on some bad breath forum. Why did i go into this tangent... So, i'm at the gym with my buddy working out, and I knew going into it that I had no malodor because the halimeter says 1 dot, but my friend brushes his nose several times, which makes me think that I have bad breath. Because of my complex, I felt depress this morning and afternoon even if my breath wasn't bad. One time, i had my friend blow into the meter and it registered 2 dots meaning slight odor, but I couldn't smell anything from the person's breath, so my breath is currently between 1-2 dots... I'm so fucked up by this and that i don't know if I can ever break out of this breath complex even if my breath is ok. (I"m like that guy named Brooks from the movie Shawshank Redemption, where he was so institutionalized that when he was released from prison after 50yrs or so, he just could not cope with the outside world) I feel that I have been dealing with this for so long that it is apart of me now. I have to rehab myself, so I can feel confident again and live a normal life in the outside world unlike Brooks. The funny thing is, I was popular in college even tho i had horrendous breath, now, I have (1-2 dot) breath but lack all sense of sociability. Well i'm gonna have to pull an Angela Bassett in the movie - How Stella Got Her Groove Back, and oneday will get his grove back...hahaha

    Back to semen quality, I came back from the gym feeling depressed and decided that maybe a downloaded youporn video will bring up my spirits. I watched this video of some milf action and once I saw The Side Dish position day 25 on the link (How to do 28 kama sutra positions), that i just exploded. It only took 5 mins but if i hadn't seen that provocative position then I could have gone longer. Erection quality was much better at 85% throughout the 5 mins, but semen quality was watery. Given my theory about semen viscosity, I think if i went longer then my semen would have been thicker.

    I gonna buckle down and train myself to get better sleep. I want to get better from this and not have a propecia complex for the rest of my young life. I feel like I'm going through a midlife crisis at 29, when 29 should be the new 20. I'm too young for this shit,just got to meditate and stay fucking calm, ahummm, ahummm, ... no,no, it is woosaaaahhh, woosaaaahhh, woosaaaahhh from Bad Boys 2. That's better and i feel calm now.

    By the way, my balls were very firm this morning and in good shape. I'll be just taking vitamin E and Nolvadex tonight. wish me luck. oneday
     
  2. andysutils

    andysutils Member

    Re: Help me please -- finasteride-induced secondary hypogonadism, low T/LH/FSH, high

    you seemed to have many mental and physical issues before you took any fina. you sure its the propecia thats caused all of this?
     
  3. thenxtgrt1

    thenxtgrt1 Junior Member

    Re: day 12


    You will be unable to obtain accurate estrogen reading while taking nolva. Maybe someone with more knowledge can further elaborate.
     
  4. oneday

    oneday Junior Member

    It is just some self esteem issues that have come about from physical issues. As for the propecia side effects, it robs a man of his livelihood and to have a normal relationships with a woman. Just imagine that you lose all ability to have erections coupled with drug induced anxiety for 1.5 years, then will ppl not have emotional issues too??? There is a level of vanity in having great hair, great body, great intellect, or great in bed :D, if any of the aforementioned was taken from us then we'll definitely feel depressed.

    I'm sure that a monk can live contently on a mountain-top with other bald headed man, so there is no need for being great in bed, have great hair, or a great body. But I'm no monk and i need at least my manhood to be happy. If you can live like a monk, then you are the wiser man and i bow to you. :)
     
  5. researchin

    researchin Junior Member

    Re: Help me please -- finasteride-induced secondary hypogonadism, low T/LH/FSH, high

    hey guys, don't be so gloomy, and always consider foods and vitamins as being able to help you.

    I was on drugs and stuff (NOT FIN, but random protein shakes/muscle enhancing crap I'd just guzzle down at a friend's/marijuana/heavy alcohol/who knows what even) back in ... 2003-2004? and something happened, very similar. I'll go get my labs and see if they match up.

    Anyway, I got the sexual function back after trying crazy diets, hardcore adherence, for long periods of time. INCLUDING heavy usage of SOY PROTEIN.

    Then my thyroid just went and started dying. [:eek:)] you beat one thing and lose another!

    I'm quite a bit better now, it's not exactly perfect, but it's an interesting journey for sure.
     
  6. oneday

    oneday Junior Member

    day 14

    Friday, January, 9 2009

    Day 14 on pct and 42 days left... It is agonizing waiting for the results to appear. Sure there have been improvements, but it is taking forever. My balls are normal now and won't grow anymore. I have more frequent nocturnal and morning erections everyday surpassing what i was getting pre-PCT. Emotions fluctuates from time to time, but I am really happy while on PCT. I hope that if I restore my hormones back that I'll get thicker hair. It could be wishful thinking tho. I mentioned it in the past about the hair i had, but didn't elaborate. (here's the back story) Well, i remember how propecia became the drug of choice for me (It is like, when you ask ppl where were they when JFK was assassinated, or where were they on 9/11, when airplanes crashed into the Twin Towers) It all started with a CSI episode, where the agents are looking for the woman's killer. All they had were some hair follicles and when they held an ultraviolet light to the hair, it fluoresced. so, an agent brings in a doctor (suspect) into a room and the agents goes into a 5 min soliloquy and ask a rhetorical question, does he know anything about male pattern baldness and shit like that, Agent says, well to get the maximum hair growth, you NEED MINOXIDIL AND PROPECIA. Then the officer explains that minoxidil can be washed away, but finasteride will become apart of the hair follicle, so it will fluoresce under ultraviolet light. Guess what, the agent was holding a ultraviolet light and waved over the suspects hair, thus discovering that the doctor was the killer. The suspect breaks down and confesses to the crime. I eventually thought to myself, "hmmm, maximum hair growth???" and i was currently trying rogaine (it never worked for me) then thought that Rogaine works from the outside in, but if I took Propecia, that it would work from the inside thus being more effective. I decided to take propecia b/c it was mentioned in that show, and if i had never watched that episode than i would have never taken FIN. FUCK THAT SHOW, I haven't watched it since. hahaha. Like Big Softie, I took propecia and it made my hair worst, and I don't have the typical male pattern baldness. None of my family members have male pattern baldness, just thinning hair at age 55 yrs, so i really fucked up. I took propecia, then a month later the hair on the side of my head was really thin and I thought that I needed to give my body time to adjust. What a dumb, dumb I was. I can't look back on the past because I will be stuck there forever.. I'm moving on and PCT better work. If it fails then I'll go with the *clomid*, nolvadex, and hcg.


    I slept really good last night and had a total of 4 awakenings, 3 toss and turns, and 1 where i woke up at 4:35am started thinking about a girl that i just met. By the way, she has been busy lately and she's going to call me tomorrow. I thought about her for a minute and went back to sleep. I woke up at 8:30am with a decent erection 65% and played with the shaft a little to see if it would remain stiff. I was able to keep it going for 15 mins, then decided to take it for a joy ride. hehe. After 3 mins, joy ride was over just like the amusement park... you never get your money's worth. The ejaculate was viscous, probably because there was 15 mins of foreplay which gave the body enough time to gather the fluids together, or it is b/c i saw a very hot chick getting her pussy wrecked and you could tell that she genuinely enjoyed it.

    Starting next week, I'm going to workout 2 hours 3 times a week to see if I can get more gains in testosterone. Tonight, I will be taking vitamin e, nolvadex, and 300 iu hcg. I've reconsidered that 500iu is too much for me right now and 300 iu hcg is the best way to go to prevent desensitization.


    Hey 3pm, i checked out haporn.com and that is laced with commercials... sorry brotha, i'm sticking with youporn. oneday.
     
  7. oneday

    oneday Junior Member

    day 15

    Saturday, January 10, 2009

    Day 15th of pct, today was like any other morning and that same goes for nocturnal erections. My penile skin is looking supple, that is right, I said, "SUUUU-PLE," and it hasn't looked this healthy in 2 yrs. With all things going the same, my personal life is moving on the up and up. I'd talked to the girl that I met and she seems very sweet. We chatted for a little bit and told me if i wasn't busy tomorrow to give her a call. Definitely wish me luck.

    I woke up really early for work and so there wasn't time to take the equipment for a joy ride, no reach around, or the stranger (using the left hand)... haha you sucka... I didn't check my ejaculate or my balls b/c there was no time this morning. So far so good and I'm progressing steadily. This stuff takes time and just gotta be patient. I've looked over several forum entries on various sites and know that people see the libido explosion when they start tapering off of nolvadex. I'm taking 20mg of nolva a night and roughly 30 days left on this regiment, then i'll start tapering off. I'm really disappointed about the side effect of the puffy eyes and bought some girly products to reduce eye puffiness. Yea, you macho fellas will say what a puss, but I can't be looking old when I go on a date.

    Next week, I'm gonna get my blood tested to see if I have plenty of testosterone in my system and cut out the hcg. I hope I have good news to tell you guys about my testosterone levels.

    I still have to post my prior lab results and fill out my member story. I wanted to convey some information that van-man conveyed to me and post information about subcutaneous injections. Aight, i'm out. oneday.
     
  8. vintrig

    vintrig Junior Member

    Re: Help me please -- finasteride-induced secondary hypogonadism, low T/LH/FSH, high

    Hey, oneday, I'm in the same boat as you. Just wanted to say great job on the journal and keep fighting. I've had these issues for a long time, and I haven't nor will I give up. With so many of us suffering, sooner or later someone will find the answer for all of us.

    Don't let anyone tell you this is permanent, obviously it may not effect all of us the same, but some with as serious conditions as us have recovered. I've seen you also use propeciahelp, so I'm sure you know that.

    Keep fighting, Peace
     
  9. oneday

    oneday Junior Member

    Day 16

    Sunday, January 11, 2009

    WOW, It is day 16 on pct and things have been going well.

    I noticed that there was a change when i was sleeping. Last night, I woke up in a night sweat, either i was never in deep sleep long enough to develop a night sweat, or that the body has changed and i sweat more during the night. I believe that it is actually deep sleep and in the past, a bad dream would have cause me to wake up. Last night, I slept great and had a lot of dreams, tons and tons of dreams. Too many to explain.

    Last night, I took melatonin 300mg @ 8:30pm followed by vitamin E 1000IU and nolvadex 20mg @ 9:30pm. I had about 8.5 hours of sleep and i'm still sleepy which is a good thing. My problem after propecia was that i felt tired yet never drowsy, and now it got better last December (pre-PCT) and today it has reached a new pinnacle under PCT. It could be that either estrogen, or testosterone, or dht that has a function in sleep.

    During my sleep, I was erected all night b/c I would have sporadic awakenings (5-10secs) probably 5 in total and I could sense that it was erected without touching it. I mentioned in the past that I was able to sense my erections, but this time it was stronger. However, I don't want to mislead anyone and I have not gotten any rod-like erections of 95-100% and I'll start shooting fireworks when that happens. I got rod-like erections when I was on Big Softie's stack (Sustain-Alpha, ZMK, MVP-365, toco-8, Endo-Amp, Reset A.D), but once I had stop using the stack then things went down hill. Even tho, I had lost some gains, however it was a huge improvement over penis numbness, low libido, ED, and erectile sustainability. For those who want to try the stack, then you should go for it.

    Like many other ppl, we went with the non invasive approach and sought out supplements to restore what we had lost, in hind sight, you have to fight fire with fire. Yea, this protocol is more extreme and risky than the supplement approach, but I think if you're are on the right PCT then you'll get long term results. Why is this PCT risky??? Well, you need to get syringes and buy the drugs off the internet that are required for the PCT. Then, there's a question of quality b/c anything you buy off the internet is subjected to many assumptions. You have to assume that the drugs are manufactured to a high standard and the dosage that is listed is what you are getting. Well, most ppl are afraid that they are getting short changed when they receive 10mg and it is suppose to be 20mg, but what happens if it is the opposite and you are getting 500mg when it is suppose to be 20mg. So your job is to try and get your doctor to prescribe this stuff to you, or ask senior members in the forum who can vouch for the supplier.

    The reason why I chose the username oneday is because I'm very hopeful and optimistic that one day I'll be cured. After reading many recoveries threads, I zeroed in on the ones that failed, along with looking at the ones that originally failed but persevered and was able to recover after 2 yrs. These days, i just try to focus on the protocol that I'm on and plan B, just in case I do fail, but that is still far down the road.

    Please continue to wish me luck and lets be hopefully together, oneday.
     
  10. oneday

    oneday Junior Member

    to madclown

    Sorry man, I totally hijacked your thread, but if it wasn't for your original post on meso, then i wouldn't have not consider detailing my recover in this forum. Since, you and other ppl who had propecia side effects had posted to this thread, I thought it would be foolish for me to start the same thread somewhere else.

    Anyhow, thanks for getting it started. oneday
     
  11. simpllyhuge

    simpllyhuge Junior Member

    Re: Help me please -- finasteride-induced secondary hypogonadism, low T/LH/FSH, high

    how many mg of vitamin E can one take before overdosing. Also isnt that melatonin dose like 298 mg too much? obviosuly I am missing something but any way
     
  12. s0b

    s0b Junior Member

    Re: Help me please -- finasteride-induced secondary hypogonadism, low T/LH/FSH, high

    I think that the melatonin caps sold mostly in supplement stores are around 3 GRAMS. I used to take 1.5 or less grams(half a pill) to sleep for some hours when i came of the Cipro-Hydrocortisone NAPALM mixture (visit Cipro levaquin side effects floxin avelox or FQ Research Web Pages Home Page or the yahoo quinolone survivors group, before taking any fluoroquinolone) and it suppressed my LH levels more. Be carefull with the melatonin, it is a powerful hormone too, i dont understand how they can sell it in supplement stores so easily.

    Regarding the pct youre doing David im trying to keep up with what you are writing, i have to say that you have too much info which has to do with your personal life, feelings and sleep :p .
    Offcourse for us people this is good because we have been through a hellish nightmare after finasteride and each and every positive issue or even thought from someone who is trying to recover the PCT way is useful, maybe for many others though who dont reckon what the disastrous domino effect of using finasteride is like, it seems as useless personal info.

    However i am following closely your journal and trying to compare with other steroid users and think that if it works and you can restore your gonadotropins permanently to a higher level that the current one and get the positive libido and energy effects then it is definately worth the risk. I hope it goes right and i will follow you with the same protocol.

    My only concern with your program is whether you are supposed to use an aromatase inhibitor at some time due to the increased estrogen turnover from hcg use. I am not sure that nolvadex can suppress estrogens so good, even though you are using it for an extended period of time. As i have been reading in many peoples reports AIs have a use in PCT.

    On the other hand my concern regarding my situation is what kind of effect will those powerful drugs included in the PCT mix have on my wrecked low cortisol, high intracranial pressure, inflamed prostate and not only, body. I mean i am a total wreck already and any deviation from my current fragile hormonal equilibrium towards a wrong state, might completely dismantle me. So i have to search and search starting from the effects of those drugs on prostate, then on my head and blood viscocity and last but not least on concurrent low levels of cortisol.

    Will i be able to sustain any positive changes in estrogen and testosterone levels without a serious infliction on cortisol production and further drop in physical mental state?? What is the mechanism behind adrenal fatigue and stress axis suppresion and how would a rise in gonadotropins impose on the HPA?? will it be permanent or will there be another shift in homeostasis??

    So many unanswered questions. So many doctors who cannot answer. So many risks to take
     
  13. s0b

    s0b Junior Member

    Re: Help me please -- finasteride-induced secondary hypogonadism, low T/LH/FSH, high

    Oh, one more thing. What happened with the Reset AD stuff?? did it do you any good regarding energy levels or libido??

    And some humble questions.

    How often do you go training??
    Do you feel sore and manage to recover fast after training??

    i wanted to ask something else too, but my brain is lagging right now
     
  14. oneday

    oneday Junior Member

    Re: Help me please -- finasteride-induced secondary hypogonadism, low T/LH/FSH, high

    my bad, I meant to put 300 mcg (micrograms). oneday
     
  15. oneday

    oneday Junior Member

    Day 17

    Monday, January 12, 2009

    Day 17 on pct, my nocturnal erection was plump and laying on against my leg. Don't worry ppl, just because it wasn't erected doesn't mean that the PCT failed... It just meant that I probably caught the erection at the wrong time. Anyhow, I had a good morning erection when it was stimulated and it expanded to 80%. The most noticeable change was that my balls were extremely firm and it was surrounded by a bloated scrotum. Typically, the scrotal skin hugs against the testes and this time, I had to move the testes towards the outer skin, so I can feel to see if there was any changes. This development only happen within the last two days and it was really apparent today.

    As it stands, I have not gotten spontaneous erections, or have a spike in libido. The only things that stimulate an erections is physical contact to the shaft and sometimes to the balls, but porn will always gives me a rise. The more entertaining the scene, the more of an reaction I get.

    I suspect that the estrogen build up in my system is making my orgasm dull and my erections weak. I remember when I started to recover within 2-3 months on Big Softie's stack, that I was getting weak erections (60-75%) and sensation was dull (some would say that it feels numb, but it is just semantics), which almost resembles what I'm feeling now. My erections are much better, but not sensitive enough. I think I read somewhere on meso about this and other users of nolva have experienced the same thing. I'm really not worried about that side effect because it is what I signed for when I decided to do the PCT.

    Have a good night and to some, a good morning. oneday.
     
  16. oneday

    oneday Junior Member

    Day 18

    Tuesday, January 13, 2009

    This is my 18th day on pct, everything is going good and just want to write about staying the course. Whatever program you create for yourself, you should stick with it, unless you get some lab result that shows that your program is affecting then obviously stop and reassess. I get a lot of suggestions every now and then, but if I stray away from my program too much and I will rob myself of the experience. So far, there is no lab results or extreme side effects that justifies a change in PCT. Like I've said, I have a plan B if this fails, but I'm going to go through this PCT for 2 months, so if it fails, then i'll give myself probably 1-2 months of downtime before trying again. Whether I falter or achieve success, I'll do a thorough review at the end of the process, and see if there is a better method for restoring the HPTA.

    Today, I was in a store shopping and saw a girl with a tight ass, and I thought, "WOW, wonder what her face looks like????" I really wanted to see what she looked like because I was interested. For most of us, when we come off of finasteride, that there is a lack of interest in girls, sex, and relationships. I feel that the interest is coming back, but still waiting for the libido to kick in. Yea sure, libido means sexual desire, but what the hell does that mean to ME??? It means that a fragrance, or a touch from a cute girl, or the sight of a tight ass will cause a cascade of emotions. It starts with a rapid heart beat building to the point that it is literally pounding through your chest, possibly getting a tingle in your stomach (this happens sometimes, but not always), but the most important instrument of all starts to pulsate, your PENIS... The pulsation starts at the kegel muscles and radiates throughout your penis, as it gorges itself with blood from your body, it grows, it throbs, as it throbs it grows, until it rhythmically beats at the same rate as your Heart. I really really miss those moments and hope that they come back. I never realize how precious that was until I lost it.... Anyhow, if I get these sensations, then you can consider myself, CURED!

    Moving forward to day 19. Take care, oneday
     
    Last edited: Jan 13, 2009
  17. thenxtgrt1

    thenxtgrt1 Junior Member

    Re: Help me please -- finasteride-induced secondary hypogonadism, low T/LH/FSH, high

    Sounds like you're right on point thus far. After discontinuing nolva, do you plan on taking anything?
     
  18. oneday

    oneday Junior Member

    It depends on the final result of the pct. If my libido comes back then no, I won't be taking anything. I'll probably workout at feverish pace to maintain a normal testosterone level. I just want to give my body time to recover from PCT and try to see what is the new baseline.
     
  19. oneday

    oneday Junior Member

    answer to s0b



    hey s0b,

    you ask a lot of questions that some I have no answers and i can only talk about why i didn't choose to use an aromatase inhibitor. I don't really know if I should use AI in my protocol because i have to give the PCT program i've chosen a chance to work. I have a simple philosophy which is, "less is better" and hope that it serves me well. If AI is necessary then I'll use it in PCT 2.0 because right now, things are going well and don't want to falter or regress with any gains I have made. I don't know enough about cortisol or adrenal fatigue under this protocol, so these I'll have to pass off to another member to answer.

    I suggest that you post a thread called PCT for Low Cortisol individuals and keep on bumping the thread until it is answered.



    Reset AD helped me sleep I think but it was hard to tell what it was doing to your body. It is like taking a vitamin and you rarely see any overt result, but it is definitely doing something to your body. I did not get libido off of Reset AD, and I think it affected my sleep in a good way. I can't really explain b/c i wasn't keeping a journal about that sort of stuff, so can't really remember.


    I have not trained hard since coming off of finasteride b/c it would affect my sleep. My body would feel tired but will not allow me to sleep, maybe because i exhausted my body too much, so it didn't have enough brain chemicals to sleep. I just don't know...

    in the past, i always had a quick recovery like Wolverine in Xmen. I never felt sore or tired. I had very good gains prior to FIN, but i cannot speak about past situations and apply that to me now. I'll just have to train hard tomorrow and tell you how i feel.

    I know i put a lot of info in this journal and it is exhausting for me to type, but i do it because i want to be detailed. i'm not going to make a lot of friends and don't really care, bc this is to help ppl who want to know what it is like taking FIN or using PCT to restore HPTA. Being on a protocol, you go through ups and downs, and the only way for me to convey this info is to type everything. If ppl want to read everything, then read everything, or just skim over it, but it is up to them.

    Anyhow, thanks for understanding. oneday,.
     
  20. Clean

    Clean Junior Member

    Re: Help me please -- finasteride-induced secondary hypogonadism, low T/LH/FSH, high

    Hey Oneday! finally caught up with most of the read wich was great. The info on the whole pct is great. It made me decide to try hcg 250iu EOD for 4 weeks with nolvadex 20mg ED for 6 weeks or more depending on how my balls feel. Hopefully this will make them back to normal.

    Have you done any bloodwork lately? Can you post those results?

    Great read thanks.
     
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