"Generic" GH ASSAYS

[Geterdun]

Bro i do not expect for you to trust any of the information i will post later on. As i had mentioned whatever i post will be looked at under a microscope. And i do not expect it to be any different. I agree a sources data should be thrown away due to obvious reasons. I will post it since quite a few asked me to do so but please than do not question me about its validity.

I meant no disrespect. It was a question for my own understanding. I have enough brother here on meso to explain what I need to look at and what to throw in the trash. I just wanted to understand your testing process.

 

[Dr JIM]

Yes and no. Jim is well-versed enough in the generic GH game that he can look at the vial, especially things that're branded like Pharmacom and Kefis etc.,

No offense WP but are you serious, I never even heard of "Black Tops" until one week ago, lol

MANDS may be able to do what your suggesting but not yours truly.

 

[mands]

I wanted to add that I have been off gh for around 3 months. I will be getting base line igf-1 test preformed and then I will be start a generic GH... Stay tuned.

Yes and no. Jim is well-versed enough in the generic GH game that he can look at the vial, especially things that're branded like Pharmacom and Kefis etc., and know which lab it is. However, Mands and Jim both know I have full faith in them to NOT skew the results. There will ALWAYS be a way to poke holes in these sorts of things, but as a community, we have nothing to gain by doing so in this particular case. Mands and Jim are "G2G" as we say.

I wouldn't go as far as to say @Dr JIM is well versed in generic GH brands. I myself am.

mands

 

[Wunderpus]

Are you serious I never even heard of "Black Tops" until one week ago, lol

LOL, you're fucking smart enough to recognize the Pcom logo, Jim! Maybe I am overestimating your exposure to the generic market

Also, it's important to note, Black Tops matter, too.

 

[janoshik]

I'll forwarn you in order for HPLC to be of utility it MUST meet the following criteria

- "excessive" amounts of Glycine shall be accounted for

- use a research grade GH standard for comparison

- be certified as "HPLC ready" using the GOLD STANDARD an AAA!

- Moreover an HPLC can NOT determine PURITY. At best HPLC evaluates the AVERAGE MW of those molecules sampled
and their QUANTITY compared to the KNOWN STANDARD.

Finally with a margin of error of around 0.1% it's considerably less sensitive and/or specific than an AAA!
-

Mr. Doctor Jim, which excessive amounts of glycine are you talking about, if I may ask?
Making this whole argument easier to understand for community would certainly help to make this project even more successfull

 

[Dr JIM]

LOL, you're fucking smart enough to recognize the Pcom logo, Jim! Maybe I am overestimating your exposure to the generic market

Also, it's important to note, Black Tops matter, too.

Really and WHY would I recognize such a logo, or care enough to even look for it.

My exposure is almost exclusively limited to TESTING the stuff and MANDS has acquired close to 95%
of those samples assayed.

That's like suggesting I recognized the Argo starch sample bc I cook a lot

 

[Wunderpus]

Really and WHY would I recognize such a logo, or care enough to even look for it.

My exposure is almost exclusively limited to TESTING the stuff and MANDS has acquired close to 95%
of those samples assayed.

That's like suggesting I recognized the Argo starch sample bc I cook a lot

Ha, I was simply stating IF you wanted to, it'd take you all of about 30 seconds to realize what about 50% of the brands were. Jim, you know i'm not worried about you pulling some BS with these tests... Merely pointing out ONE plausible scenario.

 

[Mr.B66]

Puts a smile on my face to see this thread stay civil, informative and productive and not turn into a shit show. THIS is how i hoped this would go , @Dr JIM and @mands are going above and beyond and out of pocket, to help out the community that we are all a part of, so it sure is great to see this thread treated with the respect it deserves.

 

[Dr JIM]

Puts a smile on my face to see this thread stay civil, informative and productive and not turn into a shit show.

You're not the only one !

 

[Dr JIM]

Ha, I was simply stating IF you wanted to, it'd take you all of about 30 seconds to realize what about 50% of the brands were. Jim, you know i'm not worried about you pulling some BS with these tests... Merely pointing out ONE plausible scenario.

And i'm telling you its simply not the case, unless i want to spend even more time investigating "generic GH" on the net and anyone can do that, bc excluding ONE GREY I don't see the samples in REAL TIME!

Nuf said

 

[legendary]

Thanks guys. I must say I regretfully bailed because I was scared to send. Ty Jim and Mands. This is good info. Also Jim I must say I google issues a friend was having and post you made helped out from 2014. Thanks for everything.

 

[Dr JIM]

Sampei, it's Jim's thread, and he's doing the testing, so he gets to say whatever he wants.
PD, in regards to your comment about the testing being fishy, hope the blacktop results shows that Jim is honest about the results

This is one of the FEW forums where any declaration of "thread ownership" (excluding Millard Baker) is simply bogus.

The number of Meso "sightseers, bench warmers, lurkers etc" is the reason it's so important to emphasize NO CONCLUSIONS should be drawn from a SINGLE SAMPLE assay.

To that end MANDS and I are doing this for Meso members and/or those who are wilingl spend the time required to READ THE ENTIRE THREAD.

Questions like; hey Jim why don't YOU include the "sample identity" along with it's PIC and graphic data from the outset, is a classic example of some lazy fool needing to be spoon fed!

If anyone can provide a REASON, as in MOTIVE why I would "doctor, adjust, or alter etc, these or ANY other results, post it! FISHY ? NOT!

jim

 

[insertnamehere]

Nice to see this testing resume. Just want to say thank you to @Dr JIM , @mands , and everyone else that has contributed to making this happen - you're the reason I'm proud to call Meso my home board. Thanks again.

 

[Dr JIM]

Could you post some or even one of the testing you have that shows "purity"

I'm interested in what test you are doing and how you are "calculating purity %" from the test

If I'm not mistaken you may have used a SIMEC test result (Assay)

Related Proteins %
Related Substances %

To calculate "purity" for one sample

Any other testing data would really be helpful

Thanks

You are most certainly mistaken as these results or have ABSOLUTELY NOTHING to do with SIMEC or its methodologies!

Calculate GH "purity" based on what baseline values or measurements.

After the sample is hydrolysed an AAA first MEASURES the NUMBER of individual AA present in a sample, then using the known AA proportions in HUMAN GH, one can indirectly ESTIMATE purity.

Wiki has some fairly accurate discussions on the Amino Acid ASSAY

 

[Dr JIM]

Could you post some or even one of the testing you have that shows "purity"

I'm interested in what test you are doing and how you are "calculating purity %" from the test

To ensure we are on the same page, define "GH purity"?

 

[Dr JIM]

I will post multiple data. For a few batches of blacks. Just give me sometime as cannot get a scanner for now.

We/I don't need to be inundated with mounds of data on your blacks. What IS needed
-The HPLC graphic image
- The graphic standard used for comparison
- A brief narrative discussion much like what was included on the AAA I pated
- A "worksheet" page

IReview my FIRST SAMPLE POST for an example of all that may be required AND even less, in this case!

 

[janoshik]

You are most certainly mistaken as these results or have ABSOLUTELY NOTHING to do with SIMEC or its methodologies!

Calculate GH "purity" based on what baseline values or measurements.

After the sample is hydrolysed an AAA first MEASURES the NUMBER of individual AA present in a sample, then using the known AA proportions in HUMAN GH, one can indirectly ESTIMATE purity.

Wiki has some fairly accurate discussions on the Amino Acid ASSAY

I am not an expert in this field, but estimating a purity sounds a lot less precise than assaying / calculating it.

Also, generally the purity of HGH, from what I've heard is the amount of HGH / total amount of protein in the vial. This is important to some guys, because those other proteins can be immunogenic, or even straight up endotoxins.

 

[Dr JIM]

I am not an expert in this field, but estimating a purity sounds a lot less precise than assaying / calculating it.

Also, generally the purity of HGH, from what I've heard is the amount of HGH / total amount of protein in the vial. This is important to some guys, because those other proteins can be immunogenic, or even straight up endotoxins.

Oh!

 

[Dr JIM]

1) AAA first MEASURES the NUMBER of individual AA present in a sample, then using the known AA proportions in HUMAN GH, one can indirectly ESTIMATE purity.

1) I am not an expert in this field, but estimating a purity sounds a lot less precise than assaying / calculating it.

2) Also, generally the purity of HGH, from what I've heard is the amount of HGH / total amount of protein in the vial. This is important to some guys, because those other proteins can be immunogenic, or even straight up endotoxins.

1) So what does "measured" mean then!

2) WRONG!

No offense but I suggest; you begin reading WIKI with respect to the different analytical assays and their application to rHGH before you register another opinion "on what you have "heard elsewhere".

 

[janoshik]

1) So what does "measured" mean then!

2) WRONG!

No offense but I suggest; you begin reading WIKI with respect to the different analytical assays and their application to rHGH before you register another opinion "on what you have "heard elsewhere".

So are you saying that measuring the amount of amino acids is indeed a purity analysis?

What exactly is wrong about the second statement? I am checking the wiki and I can't really find much difference... Could you help me a bit over there, please? I'm sure other members of the community would appreciate it as well - I remember many arguments about what exactly a purity is.