HGH + berberine + DHEA

[newbie]

Within longevity community it is believed that HGH alone shorts lifespan. However if HGH is combined with Metformin and DHEA not just that it doesn't reduce lifespan but it can actually reverse epigenetic age for 1.5 years. The main reason is because HGH is capable to regenerate thymus (details about protocol).
The protocol uses:
50mg DHEA
500mg Metformin
2ui HGH
Taken at night every second day.

Metformin and DHEA are included in the protocol because both counteract the diabetogenic effect of GH.

But I heard that metformin is bad for bodybuilding, people who used it complain they could not make any progress in their body mass. So I was thinking to include berberine + DHEA for that. Any thoughts?

 

[Mac11wildcat]

Some of the biggest guys on the planet are taking metformin. Truly don’t know where this shit comes from.

 

[Frozen]

Some of the biggest guys on the planet are taking metformin. Truly don’t know where this shit comes from.

What is you’re take on Metformin, I’ve tried twice now and legit within 48 hours it’s like digestion has cutback 50% and I get a weird type of indigestion/reflux.

On the other hand, take a moderate dose of lantus and my digestion increases by 200%

 

[Jin23]

Within longevity community it is believed that HGH alone shorts lifespan. However if HGH is combined with Metformin and DHEA not just that it doesn't reduce lifespan but it can actually reverse epigenetic age for 1.5 years. The main reason is because HGH is capable to regenerate thymus (details about protocol).
The protocol uses:
50mg DHEA
500mg Metformin
2ui HGH
Taken at night every second day.

Metformin and DHEA are included in the protocol because both counteract the diabetogenic effect of GH.

But I heard that metformin is bad for bodybuilding, people who used it complain they could not make any progress in their body mass. So I was thinking to include berberine + DHEA for that. Any thoughts?

Berberine, metformin, cinnamon, ... all off these agents drive ampk up, which is "the problem", if you will. This might be a problem with natty's who aren't diabetic (diabetes, ie. insulin resistance lowers shbg) because ampk also drives up SHBG, lowering your free androgens. Ampk also has other functions in relation to hypertrophy/mTOR, ie. it does the opposite. If you're a natty then you might see an impact, but for people on gear, your question has been answered above. The wildcat type of person however probably just assumed that you are on gear and that your query pertains to people using steroids, but I'm assuming you might be natty?

For 2IU's eod metformin might be completely unnecessary though. Especially if you're taking GH before bed, away from food. The use of DHEA is also questionable. Especially if you're young, and the same goes for GH btw. Is this protocol meant for the elderly?

 

[UncleBuns]

2 IU is a replacement dose and will inhibit your natural production. So, I would take 2 IU daily at bare minimum because on your "off" days your body is going to likely produce little or no GH.

Your protocol sounds like it's designed for 50 year and up crowd. I doubt you're going to get much good info on longevity here, people here take GH for recovery and anabolism, not to live longer. Very different type of usage.

 

[Mac11wildcat]

What is you’re take on Metformin, I’ve tried twice now and legit within 48 hours it’s like digestion has cutback 50% and I get a weird type of indigestion/reflux.

On the other hand, take a moderate dose of lantus and my digestion increases by 200%

You really need to stick with metofrmin for 2/3 weeks before making a decision. The first week or two can definitely upset digestion. I like it and use it.

 

[newbie]

Berberine, metformin, cinnamon, ... all off these agents drive ampk up, which is "the problem", if you will. This might be a problem with natty's who aren't diabetic (diabetes, ie. insulin resistance lowers shbg) because ampk also drives up SHBG, lowering your free androgens. Ampk also has other functions in relation to hypertrophy/mTOR, ie. it does the opposite. If you're a natty then you might see an impact, but for people on gear, your question has been answered above. The wildcat type of person however probably just assumed that you are on gear and that your query pertains to people using steroids, but I'm assuming you might be natty?

For 2IU's eod metformin might be completely unnecessary though. Especially if you're taking GH before bed, away from food. The use of DHEA is also questionable. Especially if you're young, and the same goes for GH btw. Is this protocol meant for the elderly?

Yes this is for elderly to regenerate thymus and improve immunity. I am not very old but I am planning to try it for the same purpose, to regenerate thymus because of chronic stress last 10 years. My DHEA level is on low side.

 

[Deadp007]

OP this is a great thread
Post in thread 'hGH + Metformin: A Good Thing (Metformin does not lower, but rather increases IGF-1)' hGH + Metformin: A Good Thing (Metformin does not lower, but rather increases IGF-1)

 

[may2021]

Within longevity community it is believed that HGH alone shorts lifespan. However if HGH is combined with Metformin and DHEA not just that it doesn't reduce lifespan but it can actually reverse epigenetic age for 1.5 years. The main reason is because HGH is capable to regenerate thymus (details about protocol).
The protocol uses:
50mg DHEA
500mg Metformin
2ui HGH
Taken at night every second day.

Metformin and DHEA are included in the protocol because both counteract the diabetogenic effect of GH.

But I heard that metformin is bad for bodybuilding, people who used it complain they could not make any progress in their body mass. So I was thinking to include berberine + DHEA for that. Any thoughts?

Two years ago I followed Dr. Fahys protocol for six months and saw a major reduction in gray hair. I stopped due to hair thinning - likely from the dhea. After a break - 3 months - the gray hair came back but my hair stopped thinning. I never used that combinatation again.

A couple things.
1. As someone mentioned, it was targeted at older people; like me.

2. MAIN POINT: The initial trial had such a small, demographically limited sample size, it should be taken with a grain of salt.

3. Early on he refused to divulge the amount of GH each patient was given. That may have changed since the start of his second phase trial.

4. There's a lot more old people willing to try self experimentation of all kinds, than I was aware of, including using GH. If you're young and in the prime of your life, get an early start and follow what the old codgers are doing from a self experimentation perspective; it can only help you.

Age Reversal Forum
Rapamycin Longevity News (A lot more than just Rapamycin here)

LongeCity Forums

www.longecity.org

5. I think the benefit OLD people can get from very small amounts of GH can actually improve quality of life (Just like TRT), if breaks are a part of the protocol.

I'm done.

 

[lilhawk]

What is you’re take on Metformin, I’ve tried twice now and legit within 48 hours it’s like digestion has cutback 50% and I get a weird type of indigestion/reflux.

On the other hand, take a moderate dose of lantus and my digestion increases by 200%

Another thing with Metformin is that the extended release version can be a bit easier on your stomach. I started with immediate release tabs, and had some digestive issues, then had my doctor switch me to extended release tabs and issues went away. As Mac11 said, give it 2-3 weeks and let your body adjust because digestive issues are common with it at first.

 

[newbie]

OP this is a great thread
Post in thread 'hGH + Metformin: A Good Thing (Metformin does not lower, but rather increases IGF-1)' hGH + Metformin: A Good Thing (Metformin does not lower, but rather increases IGF-1)

Two years ago I followed Dr. Fahys protocol for six months and saw a major reduction in gray hair. I stopped due to hair thinning - likely from the dhea. After a break - 3 months - the gray hair came back but my hair stopped thinning. I never used that combinatation again.

A couple things.
1. As someone mentioned, it was targeted at older people; like me.

2. MAIN POINT: The initial trial had such a small, demographically limited sample size, it should be taken with a grain of salt.

3. Early on he refused to divulge the amount of GH each patient was given. That may have changed since the start of his second phase trial.

4. There's a lot more old people willing to try self experimentation of all kinds, than I was aware of, including using GH. If you're young and in the prime of your life, get an early start and follow what the old codgers are doing from a self experimentation perspective; it can only help you.

Age Reversal Forum
Rapamycin Longevity News (A lot more than just Rapamycin here)

LongeCity Forums

www.longecity.org

5. I think the benefit OLD people can get from very small amounts of GH can actually improve quality of life (Just like TRT), if breaks are a part of the protocol.

I'm done.

Did Metformin impact your gains negatively? I heard that from some people, but only from those who are using it alone without hgh.

I am thinking to try first without Metformin, just HGH and DHEA and just monitor morning blood sugar levels. As long it is 5.2 I guess I don't need Metformin right? If it will starting to go higher I will just include Metformin too.

Did you use it at night every second day? I am little worried it will inhibit my natural production if I use it at night (see this study). This is why I am thinking to rather use it at morning 1-2 hours before breakfast, 5 days on 2 days off.

 

[Capodecapi]

You really need to stick with metofrmin for 2/3 weeks before making a decision. The first week or two can definitely upset digestion. I like it and use it.

Do you use metformin Before bed?

 

[Mac11wildcat]

Do you use metformin Before bed?

Yes.

 

[may2021]

Did Metformin impact your gains negatively? I heard that from some people, but only from those who are using it alone without hgh.

I honestly looked better (ripped/lean) back when I was doing Fahys protocol combined with weight training, than I do today; on TRT with the occasional 6-12 weeks of an AAS.

BUT I was also walking 5 -6 miles a day AND doing an additional hour of cardio on treadmill.

I am thinking to try first without Metformin, just HGH and DHEA and just monitor morning blood sugar levels. As long it is 5.2 I guess I don't need Metformin right? If it will starting to go higher I will just include Metformin too.

Did you use it at night every second day? I am little worried it will inhibit my natural production if I use it at night (see this study). This is why I am thinking to rather use it at morning 1-2 hours before breakfast, 5 days on 2 days off.

If you're under 50 I wouldn't even bother with Fahys protocol.
Just increase cardio.

Again, that initial study had something 8 people.

 

[newbie]

I honestly looked better (ripped/lean) back when I was doing Fahys protocol combined with weight training, than I do today; on TRT with the occasional 6-12 weeks of an AAS.

BUT I was also walking 5 -6 miles a day AND doing an additional hour of cardio on treadmill.



If you're under 50 I wouldn't even bother with Fahys protocol.
Just increase cardio.

Again, that initial study had something 8 people.

I didn't write all the details. I am not doing this protocol to lose fat but to improve immunity through thymus regeneration. I have some chronic health issues and even if I am not 50 yet I feel like I am over 50 and this may help me. I already have some hgh, I also have access to Metformin but I think I will just stuck with HGH, DHEA for start and monitor my blood sugar levels.

 

[may2021]

I didn't write all the details. I am not doing this protocol to lose fat but to improve immunity through thymus regeneration. I have some chronic health issues and even if I am not 50 yet I feel like I am over 50 and this may help me. I already have some hgh, I also have access to Metformin but I think I will just stuck with HGH, DHEA for start and monitor my blood sugar levels.

AH
Then substitute Metformin with Berberine if blood sugar is a concern.

The only reason Metformin was added in Dr. Fahys initial study was to control for blood sugar, not as something he thought might directly assist in regenerating the thymus.

From the very beginning, he thought GH would do it.

 

[Blang]

2 IU is a replacement dose and will inhibit your natural production. So, I would take 2 IU daily at bare minimum because on your "off" days your body is going to likely produce little or no GH.

No, that's not how it works, GH doesn't work like testosterone.

I don't know why this myth won't die.

 

[lilhawk]

No, that's not how it works, GH doesn't work like testosterone.

I don't know why this myth won't die.

And it wouldn't matter if it did anyway because your body's natural production is so little anyway.

 

[newbie]

No, that's not how it works, GH doesn't work like testosterone.

I don't know why this myth won't die.

I am not sure how to understand this study, but it seems it does have quite big inhibition:

Exogenous growth hormone inhibits growth hormone-releasing factor-induced growth hormone secretion in normal men.

Previous studies from this laboratory and by others in rats, monkeys, and humans support the concept that growth hormone (GH) can regulate its own secretion through an autofeedback mechanism. With the availability of human growth hormone-releasing factor ...

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

The GH response to GRF (maximal increment over time 0 value) was significantly inhibited after GH treatment (0-1.3 vs. 2.3-11.2 ng/ml before treatment, P = 0.05), but was not significantly affected by placebo.

 

[UncleBuns]

No, that's not how it works, GH doesn't work like testosterone.

I don't know why this myth won't die.

My understanding is that exogenous GH will inhibit natural production significantly. Sub q for about 24hr if I remember right. If you stop taking it natural production will come back rapidly without intervention though. So yes, it is like taking test but recovery of natural production is not the same as test, it's much easier and faster.