MALDI-TOF-MS/HPLC-UV-VIS rHGH results

[muscle96ss]

rpbb:

Here's a good example of what I've been saying. This is a recent quote from PM

(This is not a Jab but merely an observation of the "Testing Knowledge" at PM"

"Hope someone can help me out here...did a serum test with. 6fingers white tops at 5 iu last week 3 hours after injection... Now my serum level came back at 13.7 which is not bad for only 5 iu but my igf levels came back at only 143...now I have been running 5 ius for a few weeks now but should my igf levels be higher ? I did a serum test 8 weeks ago using only 3.3 iu of 6fingers red tops and my serum level was 6.5 but my igf levels were 291... So I'm a little confused as to why if my serum levels are higher but my igf levels are lower ...any help on this would be truly appreciated"

See, the focus is on the GH Serums. Also, there is no actual Lab Analyis of the vial that produced GH Serum 13.7/6.5 to confirm any accurate concentration with GH Serums (we've debunked this using HPLC/Blood Work)

I see now where the confusion is:

GH SERUM cannot determine the quality or potency of HGH

This is a common misconception often mentioned on bodybuilding forums
This is a common misconception often mentioned on bodybuilding forums
This is a common misconception often mentioned on bodybuilding forums

HGH serum levels will not tell you "how strong" the growth hormone is, only whether it is real or not. (GH PROTEIN, Somatropin, Somatrem, quality unknown)

"In normal plasma the bound fraction for 22K HGH (Somatropin) averaged 50.1%. Above a hGH level of about 20ng/mL the bound fraction declines in concentration-dependent manner due to saturation of the binding protein. The complexed (bound) hGH has important implications for metabolism, distribution, and biological activity."

GH Serums determine GH Protein Concentration in Blood Serum at time of testing.....not the amount of GH inside the vial that has been injected.

The spurious relationship between serum IGF1 levels and growth response precludes the use of IGF1 as a surrogate marker for efficacy.(NOT GH SERUM)

Low IGF1s is more of an indicator than any GH Serum result (High/Low)

That user has listed what changes he has made to his drug regiment since his last IGF-1 test. I would be willing to be that the change in IGF-1 levels is related to the health of his liver and has nothing to do with the GH being used. It will be interesting to see once he drops those compounds what happens to his IGF-1.

 

[rpbb]

I thought he was running a different manufacturer. I also saw that low serum result a couple of posts up. but I'm not sure you can say that is good or bad hgh unless you run igf levels testing

 

[Rick Kane]

@ProfessorX The second to last sentence states that the user is "confused" about higher serum levels yet lower IGF score. How do you see that as "See, focus is on the gh serum"?

No one is arguing that HPLC/lab testing is more accurate. Ever hear the old adage " Don't oversell the sale".

Furthermore, unless a user sticks to an identical protocol regarding gh/gear/training when testing IGF, how can they compare different results. Did you read his follow up post?

I have a 1pm lab today for my igf test on 6's gh. My testing protocol is identical to when I tested greytops. For my last IGF test I didn't drink for one week, no exercise for 48 hours, fasted, TRT 80mg/week.

 

[mands]

In a nutshell BUCK, trying to determine Generic GH "strength" "Potency" "Quality" with blood work is just something done on BBing Forums

SIMEC.ch
Info@SIMEC.ch

Indentify , content mg/IU , % purity

Julian
Matthias
Dr A

Good Luck!

Hey Prof!!! Are you working for SIMEC? Just seems like you are pitching them in every post.

mands

 

[rpbb]

@ProfessorX The second to last sentence states that the user is "confused" about higher serum levels yet lower IGF score. How do you see that as "See, focus is on the gh serum"?

No one is arguing that HPLC/lab testing is more accurate. Ever hear the old adage " Don't oversell the sale".

Furthermore, unless a user sticks to an identical protocol regarding gh/gear/training when testing IGF, how can they compare different results. Did you read his follow up post?

I have a 1pm lab today for my igf test on 6's gh. My testing protocol is identical to when I tested greytops. For my last IGF test I didn't drink for one week, no exercise for 48 hours, fasted, TRT 80mg/week.

I think profs point is that serum testing is not a valid test for determining quality or dosage of the gear. igf testing the way you are doing it is

 

[rpbb]

Hey Prof!!! Are you working for SIMEC? Just seems like you are pitching them in every post.

mands

I believe any accredited lab would be ok. right now simec is the easy choice

 

[ProfessorX]

Hey Prof!!! Are you working for SIMEC? Just seems like you are pitching them in every post.

mands

Of course not

Like I stated before....I learned a great deal from the testing I did myself (Blood Work, HPLC, UPLC

I was hoping you and Jim would continue testing

I'm all about learning.... I could care less about what source sells what color top that's producing high GH Serums

 

[Rick Kane]

I think profs point is that serum testing is not a valid test for determining quality or dosage of the gear. igf testing the way you are doing it is

I understand that and don't disagree. I"m a IGF testing proponent but I can't discount all the serum tests too. Honestly I don't understand enough about the subject to claim one thing or another. I see serums as one of several methods of weeding out bunk gh brands.

 

[ProfessorX]

That user has listed what changes he has made to his drug regiment since his last IGF-1 test. I would be willing to be that the change in IGF-1 levels is related to the health of his liver and has nothing to do with the GH being used. It will be interesting to see once he drops those compounds what happens to his IGF-1.

This would be a good sample for the user to send directly to the Lab

This would eliminate all the guessing

Samples producing "questionable" blood work results are the best samples to learn from with Real Lab Analysis

Just sharing some info brutha

 

[ProfessorX]

I understand that and don't disagree. I"m a IGF testing proponent but I can't discount all the serum tests too. Honestly I don't understand enough about the subject to claim one thing or another. I see serums as one of several methods of weeding out bunk gh brands.

"I see serums as one of several methods of weeding out bunk gh brands"

Exactly....but nothing more than that:

Somatropin
Somatrem
176aa
Low Purity GH

LabCorp doesn't target only high quality EXO Somatropin

 

[mands]

Of course not

Like I stated before....I learned a great deal from the testing I did myself (Blood Work, HPLC, UPLC

I was hoping you and Jim would continue testing

I'm all about learning.... I could care less about what source sells what color top that's producing high GH Serums

I would agree we could have answered a lot of questions out there. Just didn't work out as great as we hoped.

mands

 

[muscle96ss]

I think profs point is that serum testing is not a valid test for determining quality or dosage of the gear. igf testing the way you are doing it is

In the scenario we are currently talking about, if it turns out we are correct that the users liver is the culprit of his low IGF-1's, then how can you say that IGF-1 is the way to go over serum. In other words, if it is his liver, then his serum is actually a better reflection of whats going than his IGF-1. This is one of the few drawbacks of the IGF-1 test.

 

[ProfessorX]

In the scenario we are currently talking about, if it turns out we are correct that the users liver is the culprit of his low IGF-1's, then how can you say that IGF-1 is the way to go over serum. In other words, if it is his liver, then his serum is actually a better reflection of whats going than his IGF-1. This is one of the few drawbacks of the IGF-1 test.

Diminishing IGF1 (Tolerance or Protein Immunogenicity)

From low quality Chinese Black Market GH

But you'll never know unless you test it (Purity %)

 

[muscle96ss]

Let me address one issue that I have been hearing for a long time. People keep saying that the Chinese are tricking us and putting special peptides in the GH to alter the serum scores. Firstly, nobody has been able to name a single peptide that when taken in the manner we do for our serums, that would significantly alter it. Secondly, in all the testing we have done on PM, we have yet to find a single GH where people consistently get high serums and low IGF-1's. I think it is a lot of paranoia. In fact serum GH's have only been used in the bodybuilding arena for several years and outside the internet bodybuilding arena, most people have no clue that we are even using them. I highly doubt that a Chinese manufacturer of GH even has any care or clue what we are doing. They are simply manufacturing and selling their product. Just a lot of paranoia.

 

[muscle96ss]

Diminishing IGF1 (Tolerance or Protein Immunogenicity)

From low quality Chinese Black Market GH

But you'll never know unless you test it (Purity %)

The GH in question isn't even Chinese.

 

[ProfessorX]

Let me address one issue that I have been hearing for a long time. People keep saying that the Chinese are tricking us and putting special peptides in the GH to alter the serum scores. Firstly, nobody has been able to name a single peptide that when taken in the manner we do for our serums, that would significantly alter it. Secondly, in all the testing we have done on PM, we have yet to find a single GH where people consistently get high serums and low IGF-1's. I think it is a lot of paranoia. In fact serum GH's have only been used in the bodybuilding arena for several years and outside the internet bodybuilding arena, most people have no clue that we are even using them. I highly doubt that a Chinese manufacturer of GH even has any care or clue what we are doing. They are simply manufacturing and selling their product. Just a lot of paranoia.

Jigga waaa? Squirrel!

Another good example to test

I already addressed this issue with 2 Brands with Protein Characterization (UPLC)

I used these 2 particular brands to elevate my IGF1 quickly and very high

Without my Lab Analysis....everyone thought they contained Peps (IGF1)

So again, Real Lab Analysis Vs using Blood Work

 

[Rick Kane]

Jigga waaa?

Another good example to test

I already addressed this issue with 2 Brands with Protein Characterization (UPLC)

I used these 2 particular brands to elevate my IGF1 quickly and very high

Without my Lab Analysis....everyone thought they contained Peps (IGF1)

So again, Real Lab Analysis Vs using Blood Work

What was your gh serum on the two brands you tested?

 

[ProfessorX]

What was your gh serum on the two brands you tested?

Multiple numbers. All over the board.

PM
rpbb....he has some links if you'd like

What we did do is test :

IGF1 (elevated)
IGFBP3 (elevated)
GH Serum (Single Digit)

Even though the GH Serum was elevated to only a single digit (10IU IM 3.5 HRs)...it was still
Elevated compared to baseline....it still indicates a GH Protein....but that's it

IGF1/IGFBP3 are the better indicators

 

[Rick Kane]

Multiple numbers. All over the board.

PM
rpbb....he has some links if you'd like

What we did do is test :

IGF1 (elevated)
IGFBP3 (elevated)
GH Serum (Single Digit)

Even though the GH Serum was elevated to only a single digit (10IU IM 3.5 HRs)...it was still
Elevated compared to baseline....it still indicates a GH Protein....but that's it

IGF1/IGFBP3 are the better indicators

Ok, I was just wondering how it tested for gh serum since we see results range from the teens - 50's.

 

[ProfessorX]

Ok, I was just wondering how it tested for gh serum since we see results range from the teens - 50's.

Yes, correct

And with some of the recent GH Serums along with my previous Blood Work/HPLC.....we've shown GH Serums do not accurately represent mg/IU of the vial being tested.....that's all I'm saying

Everyone seems to agree with that....then I'll read recent posts stating "overdosed! 50ng/mL serum"