Big.E89
Member
Very true
MESO-Rx
Anabolic Steroids
Metformin for insulin resistance due to high dosage GH pre contest.
- Thread starter Big.E89
- Start date
Very true
Why not dose insulin to correct your sugars along with berberine etc. Not a big metformin fan
Can use a long acting insulin or a sliding scale short acting and checking glucose before meals. This is in order to help the pancreas, so it's not burning out and leading to diabetes.
Berberine is fantastic as well. Before using GH berberine made my sugars very low end of normal after just 2 weeks. GH just put them smack in middle range.
There is a lot of reasons not to use metformin for bodybuilding reasons which I'm sure you've researched. It's just not ideal and comes with a good amount of side effects.
And GH causes elevated blood glucose and more insulin release from the pancreas. Increasing your insulin sensitivity is just one small angle of combating this. You can have the worlds best insulin sensitivity, pin 6iu GH, release glucose into blood and your still needing to release more insulin making the pancreas work harder, making insulin sensitivity decrease etc etc
In my humble opinion. Checking fasting am glucose and before meals is necessary. Then a proper insulin dosing regimen. And there are better drugs/agents than metformin to help with insulin sensitivity like berberine etc. Along with a healthy diet. But yes, monitor monitor monitor.
Can use a long acting insulin or a sliding scale short acting and checking glucose before meals. This is in order to help the pancreas, so it's not burning out and leading to diabetes.
Berberine is fantastic as well. Before using GH berberine made my sugars very low end of normal after just 2 weeks. GH just put them smack in middle range.
There is a lot of reasons not to use metformin for bodybuilding reasons which I'm sure you've researched. It's just not ideal and comes with a good amount of side effects.
And GH causes elevated blood glucose and more insulin release from the pancreas. Increasing your insulin sensitivity is just one small angle of combating this. You can have the worlds best insulin sensitivity, pin 6iu GH, release glucose into blood and your still needing to release more insulin making the pancreas work harder, making insulin sensitivity decrease etc etc
In my humble opinion. Checking fasting am glucose and before meals is necessary. Then a proper insulin dosing regimen. And there are better drugs/agents than metformin to help with insulin sensitivity like berberine etc. Along with a healthy diet. But yes, monitor monitor monitor.
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I can tell you that being a diabetic absolutely sucks ass to the worst degree!!! You are tethered to that fucking glucose monitor, it's in the back of your mind every god damn day!! For the past 8 yrs now there hasn't been a single day I can relax and just not worry abt the effect of food on my body. It's terrible
When glucose gets too high or too low it fucks your sleep up too. When someone says "try this it's really good" you absolutely get sick to death of telling them you're a diabetic and cannot eat it. Fuck, I'm telling all u guys if u knew how much of a twist on life this shit makes you wouldn't be fucking around with any of it. You could promise me I'd be Mr. Olympia tomm and I wouldn't trade you for this fucking shit !!
When glucose gets too high or too low it fucks your sleep up too. When someone says "try this it's really good" you absolutely get sick to death of telling them you're a diabetic and cannot eat it. Fuck, I'm telling all u guys if u knew how much of a twist on life this shit makes you wouldn't be fucking around with any of it. You could promise me I'd be Mr. Olympia tomm and I wouldn't trade you for this fucking shit !!
Zenith Physiques
New Member
Gh abuse did this to you?
Agreed. Why I would do GH with ancillaries like insulin with purpose of preventing diabetes not looking best for show
No, although I dabbled a little in HGH and insulin I never did it much. Horrible sleep, stress, and the constant need to eat lbs of potatoes each day And abt 12 cups of rice probably did this to me.
When your body is made to be 180-200lbs and u get to 260lbs shit doesn't want to work like it should anymore. If I could go back in time I would have been happy with 200-220 lbs and left it the fuck alone. Oh well, too late now
That's really high. You should be below 100 fasted. Metformin at 500, 1000, 1500mg works great for me. I was like 102 fasted and started with 500-1000 metformin and it worked after a week or two. Brought my fasted bg down to 85ish.
weighted chinup
Well-known Member
I think the concern with using basal insulin is the fact that he is deep into contest prep which significantly complicates using glargine or other long-acting insulins to minimize beta cell damage. The concern being, of course, effects on fat burn and combining long + fast in an athlete where calories are very low and cardio is probably high. There is absolutely a risk of complications.
I do think he has exhausted almost all options short of using basal insulin or dropping the GH dosage (my preferred option obviously).
I do think he has exhausted almost all options short of using basal insulin or dropping the GH dosage (my preferred option obviously).
100% agree. I'm talking about the future more I suppose. Long term GH requires insulin and ancillaries. Then you can stop those before a show and even drop GH down.
weighted chinup
Well-known Member
I do agree with you that it is a safer approach for high-level athletes who are using GH year round or in high amounts. For the majority of people, I think time off for several months of the year off GH can help off-set the insulin sensitivity accumulated from GH usage, and for advanced guys using basal insulin if they are using GH in a caloric surplus.
88general88
Well-known Member
Holy shit, For the most part that was exactly what I was going to advise, but curious to know what you current protocol is with GH and insulin, the type? Timing? Dosage? How do you feel with your dosing, I know you said bogged down, which is weird cause BG isn’t low by any means, personally I would look into lowering the berberine metformin 500mg 3x Ed 1 at breakfast 1 lunch and 1 before bed or 850mg 2xday breakfast and bedtime
weighted chinup
Well-known Member
I've been off GH for several months now and probably won't start again until July-ish and that's even if it's necessary for my off-season goals. In the past, I tend to do split dosing, 2iu twice a day. Dosing was split and timed primarily for fat-loss (upon waking on an empty stomach and PWO usually). I have experience with both humalog and lantus at separate occasions but they were used primarily for growth rather than mitigating insulin sensitivity. My BG was always great regardless of being on GH or not but I attribute this to being young and genetics.
People with the amount of muscle mass the OP and some of the other advanced guys on this forum are carrying may have a harder time keeping a good BG while running GH, part due to the GH and part due to the insane amount of food they need to eat to maintain that level of muscularity. The amount of carbs needed for advanced guys is not to be overlooked as a factor that contributes to this, GH certainly doesn't help.
For the majority of people though, time off the growth and some berberine or other GDA's and/or basal insulin can go a long way.
Didn't hit me till i was 38. Wish my fasted was 120,
With Metformi,Fortament, Glucophage, start 500mg twice a day,with food. I take 1000 twice a day. Expect some gastrointestinal distress till you get used to it. I think your better off taking the Metformin and LOWERING your slin intake.
The thing will insulin and metformin etc is we are talking different mechanisms of action and use.
GH causes the releas if glucose in your blood. Your pancreas has to secrete insulin to match. You get increased insulin resistance over time as a result
Just decreasing your insulin resistance isn't the answer. Every GH shot still releases glucose and the pancreas still has to secrete more than usual insulin. Diabetes results from the pancreas cells getting burnt out and the body not being able to meet the insulin requirements. Better insulin sensitivity means the pancreas releases less insulin, yes, but the cycle still slowly rolls on towards insulin resistance etc.
I mitigate this by giving the body a small amount of insulin to help the pancreas while on GH. Also increasing insulin sensitivity with berberine, diet, r ala, etc. Metformin works but for me it's a dirty drug with many unwanted side effects, and when you get into it not very great for bodybuilding. I check my sugars fasted every morning and make sure the trend isnt upwards.
GH causes the releas if glucose in your blood. Your pancreas has to secrete insulin to match. You get increased insulin resistance over time as a result
Just decreasing your insulin resistance isn't the answer. Every GH shot still releases glucose and the pancreas still has to secrete more than usual insulin. Diabetes results from the pancreas cells getting burnt out and the body not being able to meet the insulin requirements. Better insulin sensitivity means the pancreas releases less insulin, yes, but the cycle still slowly rolls on towards insulin resistance etc.
I mitigate this by giving the body a small amount of insulin to help the pancreas while on GH. Also increasing insulin sensitivity with berberine, diet, r ala, etc. Metformin works but for me it's a dirty drug with many unwanted side effects, and when you get into it not very great for bodybuilding. I check my sugars fasted every morning and make sure the trend isnt upwards.
88general88
Well-known Member
Really shouldnt have any GI issues if you are taking the SR version. If you take IR(IMMEDIATE RELEASE) it may be a bad move for you because the ast thing you need is diarhea or nausea. So if you decide to dive into it, go with the sustained release. After the contest feel free to expirament with immediate release
Just my 2cent
Big.E89
Member
When you say pre workout do you mean fasted? I eat my pre workout meal and hour or maybe 1.5 hour pre gym to get my gh dose as far away from food as possible.
I always heard best to take the metformin dose with a meal?
With a preworkout meal, the dose at night does not need to be consumed with a meal, just hit it before bed
Also, for anyone needing metformin, reliablerxpharmacy has the shit cheap
"Glucophage" is the name fpr metformin, for those who aren't aware.
88general88
Well-known Member
I can see where one could look at metformin as being dirty. For someone that has very bad eating habits, it has the ability to allow them to continue on eatin like shit, with less consequences. Taking metformin before eating a bowl of ice cream and then getting into bed is not unheard of. But for people that are disciplined and have their diet on lock, it becomes a incredible nutrient partioner and can be added to your list of tools. I don’t know if I wouldnt consider it to be as good of a partioner as tren is because I believe they work differently.
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