Very discouraging.
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Kinikuman
Well-known Member
It seems that a large number of UGLs are coming back with these kinds of numbers from looking around the threads. With the issue being so widespread, I have to wonder if something hasn't happened on the raw distribution side. Maybe just a bit too coincidental that labs all over the place are coming back at 5x around the same timeframe. If we are seeing a temporary dip in quality among all suppliers that is one thing, but another if this is going to be the trend going forward. Let's hope this gets worked out soon.
I was thinking the same. Possible that both Astro and MS are getting raws from the same place? Both seem to have Test E/C problems.
Rocks Off
New Member
So, We now have had members run MS Test E and Test C and they have come back with lower than expected blood levels now. (I've also seen the same with Astro gear) Are we to take it that MS Test is under dosed in general or are we assuming physiological differences between individuals accounting for the lower than expected results?
And how do we explain the supposed positive LabMax results with MS Test that some posted?
And how do we explain the supposed positive LabMax results with MS Test that some posted?
Mem1guy
New Member
Labmax only shows that the hormone is present. It does not show the concentration of the finished product.
Let's see what Boiler's labs look like in a week or so. Then we can make a true determination on the quality/doage of the MS test. VERY interested in how his tests go... We'll all know for sure then. Mass spect or not...
xgunx
Well-known Member
I havent researched this much but this is how i feel before looking into the 10x rule in depth so just take it as bro science or whatever i guess.
Test e 300mg pinned once a week @ 300mg x 10 would give 3000tt after 5 weeks. Which would be 1 high peak during the week.
Test e 300mg pinned twice a week @ 300mg. Would 600mg x 10 \2 which would still be 3000tt but steady throughout the week.
Anyone who has every been hooked on opiates knows if you keep taking 100mg of oxy a day is just not going to withdraw, they are keeping blood levels even, but the are not getting high. Now if they take 200mg they get a big peak that day and high as fuck. (Sorry about my choice of analogies)
We cant get something from nothing guys and until i take the time to really look into this it is my opinion only, so take it as just that. I think that we need to find the math for the different dosage procedures. I know alot of you are working hard on that and thank you. There just has to be more to it than 10x
Test e 300mg pinned once a week @ 300mg x 10 would give 3000tt after 5 weeks. Which would be 1 high peak during the week.
Test e 300mg pinned twice a week @ 300mg. Would 600mg x 10 \2 which would still be 3000tt but steady throughout the week.
Anyone who has every been hooked on opiates knows if you keep taking 100mg of oxy a day is just not going to withdraw, they are keeping blood levels even, but the are not getting high. Now if they take 200mg they get a big peak that day and high as fuck. (Sorry about my choice of analogies)
We cant get something from nothing guys and until i take the time to really look into this it is my opinion only, so take it as just that. I think that we need to find the math for the different dosage procedures. I know alot of you are working hard on that and thank you. There just has to be more to it than 10x
Yep. Think about it. MS, Astro and Superior have had issues in the last month or so. These aren't some jack-legged sources that just popped up on reddit. These guys have had solid reputations for some time now.
What does this mean? It means the sources and the end users (us) have been fucked by our slant eyed "suppliers" again. It happens and will continue to in this game. It's widespread at this point IMO.
What can we do to address this issue? Well, in a perfect world the source would have adequate testing procedures in place to minimize this risk. Who the fuck can actually do this? I have no clue!
After much reading and contemplation, the only thing we can do as a community is be more committed to our blood testing IMO. All we can do is test and hold our source accountable. A solid source will fix the issue in a timely manner to protect his good name. It sucks, but it's the hand we are dealt and have to play with during this time.
If I'm off base here, flame away and educate me. I can take it.
You're exactly right, imo
xgunx
Well-known Member
I agree, and was thinking this as well. My last post wasnt saying that we havent gotten delt some underdosed gear. Hope nobody thinks that. I just think we are not applying some math somewhere or something to that nature.
Marcus
New Member
Very interested too, however I did just ask him today in his cycle log and his batch is from about 6 months ago. I would sincerely hope his tests come back better
Ozzy619
Well-known Member
I think youre totally on point here too. Its obvious the chinese produce shit raws just like everything else the make.
No brother, wasn't assuming anything about your previous post. With all of the "proper" testing protocol (source vs user) and the addition of questionable compounds, it's making for one hell of a crapshoot when it comes to the actual facts. It sucks, and I hate it.
xgunx
Well-known Member
That paticular was directed at everyone.
Gotcha. Just read your post and kept rollin' with it. We're on the same page here brother.
Cmxer32
New Member
I think the new standard is 50-70% pure. I'm ready for someone to surprise me
Kinikuman
Well-known Member
I think it's unfair to say they make shit raws. My guess is 95% of all the Test manufactured on the globe comes from raws produced in China. Watson, Bayer, all of them, most likely get their raws from China. They can make very good raws. Who they will sell them to at that purity and at what price point becomes another issue. In my experience, the Chinese can make products on a quality level with what we used to see coming out of Japan or more recently, Korea. The problem is one of economics - everybody wants domestic quality at Chinese prices so that they can reap extraordinary profits. That doesn't work. The Chinese invented capitalism - they have no compunction about giving you exactly what you pay for. If you want something at a certain price point, they will give it to you. But when that price point reaches a certain level, shortcuts are going to be taken. They are not going to take a loss under any circumstances.
For example, I witnessed a load of pigs coming to a meat plant at an undisclosed location in the PRC. Outside the plant the trucks were lined up along with a tanker truck off to the side that looked like it was watering the pigs as they unloaded them. On closer inspection, the pigs were being force fed liquid through a tube - no doubt to increase their final sale weight. Checking the tanker truck, we found that the liquid being used was sewer water. The pig suppliers had agreed to an extremely low price for their stock and were not about to go back to their homes empty handed so they made "adjustments" to the product. Never underestimate greed in any human. Needless to say it was really tough for me to eat anything made with pork in that country for a long time.
In our case I believe the culprits are the distributors of the raws, as I seriously doubt any of the labs are buying from the front office of the any of the manufacturers. The distributors have the time, opportunity and motive to do so. If they send out underdosed raws its not exactly like the labs are going to just ship it back for a refund. If there is a UGL buying direct and still coming in underdosed, then they are just thieving pieces of human refuse, because they are cutting their gear by near 50% based upon the evidence we've been seeing..
tmac34
Member
I came out with 583mg ew.
tmac34
Member
So is there a way to tell if the MS test cyp I recently received is underdosed? Asking so I can abort running it for the next 6 weeks and getting bloods to find out what we may already know.
Other than LM, (which doesn't help that much) the only thing I could suggest is front load and draw bloods early.
What do you guys think? Is this feasible?
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