Voltrader
New Member
Wow@brutus79 not exactly the formalities I would have chosen but hey there is a whole lot of truth in your post.
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Mike,
You still carrying Phen??
-Myth-
You still carrying Phen??
-Myth-
whodatnation
New Member
I think Mike is a night owl and the high traffic numbers getting on that board so quickly has caused his site to shut down. He probably won't get it fixed until later.
Brutus nice way to put it actually to basskiller. Respect is earned and you may have had it in the past with the old board but the fact is if you haven't earned it with this board today, you aren't going to just get it because you have been here for ten years.It does blow my mind that the narcotic trade actually runs more sufficiently then a trade of fucking steroids. The problem is the non face to face repercussions and consequences that the internet provides these backdooring cowards. It is what it is.
And you will get no shit Brutus because you are here everyday. If basskiller wants to put the same effort into this board and clear his name completely from the Kane fiasco he can do so. I know of him from his post on brewing gear but as for a mainstay here fighting in the trenches protecting one another from scammers I do not.
Brutus nice way to put it actually to basskiller. Respect is earned and you may have had it in the past with the old board but the fact is if you haven't earned it with this board today, you aren't going to just get it because you have been here for ten years.It does blow my mind that the narcotic trade actually runs more sufficiently then a trade of fucking steroids. The problem is the non face to face repercussions and consequences that the internet provides these backdooring cowards. It is what it is.
And you will get no shit Brutus because you are here everyday. If basskiller wants to put the same effort into this board and clear his name completely from the Kane fiasco he can do so. I know of him from his post on brewing gear but as for a mainstay here fighting in the trenches protecting one another from scammers I do not.
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BIGMESC
New Member
So it not just me, can't get in either.
whodatnation
New Member
I am pretty damn sure his server is overloaded and will need to be tweaked to handle the raw numbers that will be going there now.
Let me add some perspective. For the past 15 years or so, it's been @basskiller and his websites that have taught the majority of homebrewers how to get the job done; every wannabe UGL stops to pick up some lessons directly or indirectly from bass. Any question related to homebrew, etc, @basskiller probably knows the answer. He's had a big impact in our subculture. He knows more than a thing or two about connecting our subculture on the internet and forum communities. This is why @basskiller has my respect.
That doesn't mean that I have to agree with him on everything. Now, @basskiller isn't perfect. He is totally on the wrong side of the issue when it comes to MESO
MESO has attempted to flatten traditional hierarchies so that the merit of one's argument is the most important factor determining credibility. No good ol' boy network, no cronyism among admins and mods to protect anyone no matter who genuine they may or may not be. This leads to instances when people like BK are harshly rebuked for expressing their opinions; everyone has to prove themselves and earn respect from within the community even if they have already done it elsewhere. This makes respect earned at MESO much more meaningful.
The MESO approach was certain to disrupt the status quo for better or worse. But the more time that passes, the more that MESO members -- with their dedication to the truth and protecting the community from harm -- have convinced me that our approach is the best approach.
I greatly appreciate all the die-hard defenders who speak up on behalf of MESO against those who resist the change for a variety of reasons. Some detractors have malicious intent (scammers and others in the UGL ecosystem) and some are well-meaning (like bass).
That doesn't mean that I have to agree with him on everything. Now, @basskiller isn't perfect. He is totally on the wrong side of the issue when it comes to MESO
MESO has attempted to flatten traditional hierarchies so that the merit of one's argument is the most important factor determining credibility. No good ol' boy network, no cronyism among admins and mods to protect anyone no matter who genuine they may or may not be. This leads to instances when people like BK are harshly rebuked for expressing their opinions; everyone has to prove themselves and earn respect from within the community even if they have already done it elsewhere. This makes respect earned at MESO much more meaningful.
The MESO approach was certain to disrupt the status quo for better or worse. But the more time that passes, the more that MESO members -- with their dedication to the truth and protecting the community from harm -- have convinced me that our approach is the best approach.
I greatly appreciate all the die-hard defenders who speak up on behalf of MESO against those who resist the change for a variety of reasons. Some detractors have malicious intent (scammers and others in the UGL ecosystem) and some are well-meaning (like bass).
I contacted him to check things out@ I am not saying that anyone should get special treatment here. But we should not welcome fellow or former here. With that type of welcome right off the bat. Imo
Here's the thing, BK. You have a problem with the Meso's members because many don't respect the guys that have supposedly "paid their dues" in a virtual community that's made up of anonymous members. Of course paying their dues means nothing more than having "put in time" without directly scamming anyone (that you know of).
That's fine and you're entitled to hold that position despite the fact that you are wrong.
What I and many others do object to is when you or anyone else that have "paid their dues" uses their name without being aware of how it influences noobs.
You say you haven't endorsed anyone? Perhaps not explicitly but certainly tacitly. The illegal nature of this business necessitates a certain degree discretion from its participants and being able to "read' through that discretion and find the true meaning takes time and practice - something noobs don't have. So your comments about MS in this thread will certainly be taken as an explicit endorsement by noobs who are desperately searching for a source and haven't yet learned how to differentiate between a few positive words about someone and a full recommendation.
I suspect you have been involved in this racket for so long that is something you haven't even considered since... well, since you were a noob.
Oh, come on, now. "All the little puppies follow suit?" Not like on your (and others) boards where the noobs dick ride the mods and admins, hanging on every word they say in the hopes that you'll throw them a bone every now and then until they meet "the criteria" that says they've paid their dues, right? LMFAO
Meso might have its share of problems but a forum full of nut huggers isn't one of them. The fact that you see a bunch of guys sticking together and fighting for the same cause as little puppies following suit says more about you than us.
Speak for yourself. Meso's record on thoroughly investigating sources requires NO DEFENCE.
Sure sounds like an endorsement to me, both explicit and tacit.
There you go again. You are *endorsing* this source while at the same time lashing out at Meso's members for not automatically showing respect to a member of the community who has "paid his dues."
You would be well served by reflecting on your thoughts regarding Meso because the problems you perceive lie with your own biases.
In the meantime, why don't you step up and share some of your immense experience with Meso instead of only posting criticism. I guarantee you'll get far more respect from the members. You might even realize we're not as bad as you think.
Regards
CBS
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Let me add some perspective. For the past 15 years or so, it's been @basskiller and his websites that have taught the majority of homebrewers how to get the job done; every wannabe UGL stops to pick up some lessons directly or indirectly from bass. Any question related to homebrew, etc, @basskiller probably knows the answer. He's had a big impact in our subculture. He knows more than a thing or two about connecting our subculture on the internet and forum communities. This is why @basskiller has my respect.
That doesn't mean that I have to agree with him on everything. Now, @basskiller isn't perfect. He is totally on the wrong side of the issue when it comes to MESO
MESO has attempted to flatten traditional hierarchies so that the merit of one's argument is the most important factor determining credibility. No good ol' boy network, no cronyism among admins and mods to protect anyone no matter who genuine they may or may not be. This leads to instances when people like BK are harshly rebuked for expressing their opinions; everyone has to prove themselves and earn respect from within the community even if they have already done it elsewhere. This makes respect earned at MESO much more meaningful.
The MESO approach was certain to disrupt the status quo for better or worse. But the more time that passes, the more that MESO members -- with their dedication to the truth and protecting the community from harm -- have convinced me that our approach is the best approach.
I greatly appreciate all the die-hard defenders who speak up on behalf of MESO against those who resist the change for a variety of reasons. Some detractors have malicious intent (scammers and others in the UGL ecosystem) and some are well-meaning (like bass).
Millard, well written and most of us would know that when you see a post of this length from you, then it's time to concentrate and read carefully. For obvious reasons your word means something and more fool anyone who doesn't pay attention.
As you know I came to meso because of you and the work you do in the AAS space (man love aside
). However the reason I stay is because of the dudes that are here every day looking out, sharing information, calling out bullshit and having a laugh. No doubt we all have busy lives and there is something pretty strong that means so many log in to see what's up. I'm new around here so it's in my best interests to know who's who. It's exactly what I do IRL and it's what's kept me alive to this point. Obviously there are a few guys that have been here for many years but to be honest these aren't necessarily the same guys I look to for info and advice. Whilst 'paying your dues' has to be acknowledged, in my world it doesn't give anyone a free pass. In fact it's the brothers that have paid their dues but don't see themselves as any better than others that are the ones I look to.
For the record, I don't spend time on others boards. Had a look and no thanks. So from my perspective I have seen the member you are referring to post about a dozen times since I've been here and to be honest IMO it's contributed nothing to this community. So whilst he may be respected elsewhere, he clearly has no interest in offering me anything with his infinite wisdom.
We could all talk about what we've been doing over the years to contribute. Mine hasn't been on AAS forums or brewing, mine started over 15 years ago handing out needles to guys injecting steroids and trying to share info on reducing related harms. So what! It means little and I've got so much more to learn. Difference is I try to be here to be involved rather than piss on others because I'm somehow better. I like meso and to be honest from my perspective anyone who doesn't like what's been created here can eat shit. Sorry for my long rant!
basskiller
New Member
Millard, I am going to quote yours separately as most of this has nothing to do with you.
I quoted you all to make it a bit easier.
Kane was good people the entire time I knew him , so is mike.. You guys have totally missed the point. Because I say he's good people in your eyes equates to a glowing endorsement. Well it doesn't. I mention the man himself and commented on mike's strong gear.. That is good.
My whole point to this conversation is and always will be.. Stop jumping on the bandwagon. One guy, because they don't know a person starts screaming foul.. The it seems like a pile-on happens. You want to protect this or any other site.. Absolutely fanfreakintastic! I applaud you for doing so. But in all honesty, How many that piled on did any research on any number of the people that have come here where they got lets say a less than cordial welcome. Not just a given source, but anyone. Because you don't know them, what they say doesn't mean jack or they are lying?? Come on..
I don't expect respect, never have! I don't think of myself any better or worse than the next guy. I'm just another guy on these forums trying to help where I can and getting help where it's supplied.. Thats it.. I don't expect jackshit from anyone. Don't rightfully care if I get it either. I'm just voicing an opinion of what I have seen grow on this board.
While the intentions may be good, your application snubs out what could be pretty good members because they voice an opinion that differs from your.. They are then called shill and other things.
Back to the mike thing.. Have I tried his gear, Yes. A number of times but not recently. Do I think the man is honorable.. Yes I do.. Do I think he has integrity, Yes I do..
Do I vouch for him.. No I don't .
Again.. All I'm saying is take more than 5 minutes to get to know the guy. How about doing searches for his name. his gear, his board.. Then if you still think he's not good.. Fine.
But these rabbit judgments you guys make are wrong.
There was a time I hunted down scammers, I've brought down more than my fair share. It's tiredsome, But what I didn't do is yell scammer without first researching the damn guy.
brutus79 I could care less if your curse, it's in the manor in which you do so. We're all adults here, or should be.
Guys.. again I don't need nor want your respect.
You ask why do I not come here more.. I don't know? Could be the tone. I'm tired of all the infighting that goes on. I've always come here to learn reading works put out by Millard and the rest of the writers here.
basskiller
New Member
Let me add some perspective. For the past 15 years or so, it's been @basskiller and his websites that have taught the majority of homebrewers how to get the job done; every wannabe UGL stops to pick up some lessons directly or indirectly from bass. Any question related to homebrew, etc, @basskiller probably knows the answer. He's had a big impact in our subculture. He knows more than a thing or two about connecting our subculture on the internet and forum communities. This is why @basskiller has my respect.
That doesn't mean that I have to agree with him on everything. Now, @basskiller isn't perfect. He is totally on the wrong side of the issue when it comes to MESO
MESO has attempted to flatten traditional hierarchies so that the merit of one's argument is the most important factor determining credibility. No good ol' boy network, no cronyism among admins and mods to protect anyone no matter who genuine they may or may not be. This leads to instances when people like BK are harshly rebuked for expressing their opinions; everyone has to prove themselves and earn respect from within the community even if they have already done it elsewhere. This makes respect earned at MESO much more meaningful.
The MESO approach was certain to disrupt the status quo for better or worse. But the more time that passes, the more that MESO members -- with their dedication to the truth and protecting the community from harm -- have convinced me that our approach is the best approach.
I greatly appreciate all the die-hard defenders who speak up on behalf of MESO against those who resist the change for a variety of reasons. Some detractors have malicious intent (scammers and others in the UGL ecosystem) and some are well-meaning (like bass).
Millard, You know I love this site and have mentioned it on numerous boards. I know the meaning of what you have tried to create here when you reopened the underground. While thoughts and intentions were stellar, The outcome, not so much. I've always spoken bluntly and it does tend to get me into trouble and people angry with me. I often write down things that don't come out so clear as they are in my head. The difference comes out a bit asque.
But I am who I am. I have the utmost respect for you, the guys writing for you, the site itself. While I may not come here often enough to post, I'm always quoting something that can be found on this site in my many emails and such.
The people that truly attempt to help the site and community, Come on.. You know I've always been for that. I've done it for countless thousands never asking nor expecting a damn thing in return. I agree that every person's word should count equally. Do you really think that's what's been going on here lately? And I'm not speaking of myself.. I could care less what anyone thinks about me..
Someone comes in and sez something that all the guys who post here on an everyday disagrees with. I see an attack, being called out, and if it pertains to a source, being called a shill. Thats what I see. And sounds very much the opposite of "No good Ol boy network".
You have a good old boy network weather you know it or not.
I do appreciate the words you spoke about me.. Thank you.. and no matter what ever happens, I will continue to send people to your articles. Have been and can't see any reason why to stop.
Good day gentlemen.
the floor is yours
basskiller
New Member
One last thing.. I don't expect anyone to trust anyone. Especially if they are a source. It's not what I would do either. But for God's sake, do your homework on a person before making harsh judgments.
If I've used the same source for 10 years, I still ask around how well things are going with that person. It's just something you have to do.
Anyone can go bad at anytime. Anyone can get popped at anytime. It's the lifestyle that they choose(the latter).
But do your homework.. research the same as you would injecting a substance into your body.
If I've used the same source for 10 years, I still ask around how well things are going with that person. It's just something you have to do.
Anyone can go bad at anytime. Anyone can get popped at anytime. It's the lifestyle that they choose(the latter).
But do your homework.. research the same as you would injecting a substance into your body.
Great post basskiller. I think you hit on a lot of issues that need brought up
https://thinksteroids.com/community/index.php?threads/134291284/
Is there any truth to this????
Is there any truth to this????
Boilermech
Member
Wow. That took a while to catch up on everything. I don't post hardly at all on here, not because I don't want to I just don't have the time usually. But what I do enjoy doing on Meso is reading and learning. This is a great board to sift through for sources and great info if one puts in the time reading. The only reason that makes it a great site for that is how everyone works in there own way to either promote or hate on sources. Not saying attacking a source is the way to go by no means, but I have seen times where a new source hears the dogs barking and heads for the gate. He might of been legit and just couldn't handle the pressure so he fled. Or he was a scammer and realized he stepped onto the wrong board trying to make a buck. That's fine we don't need them around here. Then we get someone that is a true good guy who gets some love and lots of hate but he has some brains. So he understands why the hate and he sticks it out and earns his trust through the way the board tells him to.
This is how it is and this is why I came to Meso and am staying here. Everyone has there place here on Meso. I am definitely not promoting the watch dogs nor the promoters just saying they all have their place. And if one does their research and reads through all the BS. They will be able to eventually find a good source and get great advice from all of you.
On another note I do not promote or deny Mike by any means. I don't know the guy at all other than just remembering the name years ago.
So what do you all say (CANT WE ALL JUST GET ALONG).
That was a joke by the way. I wouldn't enjoy reading all these posts so much if that was the case. Lol
This is how it is and this is why I came to Meso and am staying here. Everyone has there place here on Meso. I am definitely not promoting the watch dogs nor the promoters just saying they all have their place. And if one does their research and reads through all the BS. They will be able to eventually find a good source and get great advice from all of you.
On another note I do not promote or deny Mike by any means. I don't know the guy at all other than just remembering the name years ago.
So what do you all say (CANT WE ALL JUST GET ALONG).
That was a joke by the way. I wouldn't enjoy reading all these posts so much if that was the case. Lol
Colt44
Well-known Member
Looks like some pretty good research right there.
idk...i never heard mike strong was busted.
mikestrong
Subscriber
HEY MESO members,
Hey just bacl from running errands.
Yes the site is down, I am in the middle of changing hosting companies. If you are worried about using my service over this, I have no problem if you wish to wait, should be up in 24-48 hours, so help me GOD.
OK a lot of stuff to adress, don't have the time to do it all.
Got to get to PM's then emails.
But quickly
Bigkarch Member
lol...funny shit....btw mike strong was busted...if you didnt know that, you dont need to buy juice..
I know it was not me, but I am sure it was a mike strong a MOD on some site, forget the name, they collected donations for him & all. Maybe with time I can dig it up.
PLZ note I am NOT in the USA, I am not an American. I give thanks that I am safe!
Good to see BK over here & also Millard. Brutus I don't mind the harsh language, in the good old days it was just the same. Makes me laugh, but I feel we can direct it appropriately. I am just back here, so don't know who does what here & just come in from time to time. But there are several Members that go to many boards, BK, is one of those. That is very important for inter-communication. This ofcourse limits the amount of time they can be at one board.
One member said above that if they endorse others they will get free gear, HAHA, I guess that could happen with some noob sources. I DON'T give free GEAR, pay your way is my motto & tell the truth about my gear if you really want to help others.
Lets PLZ keep it peaceful until we have a reason to call someone out.
The KANE.D3 issue obviusly brings out anger, which I can understand if some have been screwed & also lost faith in the process.
If possible can we take it to another post. I have BANNED him. Is he banned here?
Anyway Respect members.
mikestrong
I will be working for now.
Hey just bacl from running errands.
Yes the site is down, I am in the middle of changing hosting companies. If you are worried about using my service over this, I have no problem if you wish to wait, should be up in 24-48 hours, so help me GOD.
OK a lot of stuff to adress, don't have the time to do it all.
Got to get to PM's then emails.
But quickly
Bigkarch Member
lol...funny shit....btw mike strong was busted...if you didnt know that, you dont need to buy juice..
I know it was not me, but I am sure it was a mike strong a MOD on some site, forget the name, they collected donations for him & all. Maybe with time I can dig it up.
PLZ note I am NOT in the USA, I am not an American. I give thanks that I am safe!
Good to see BK over here & also Millard. Brutus I don't mind the harsh language, in the good old days it was just the same. Makes me laugh, but I feel we can direct it appropriately. I am just back here, so don't know who does what here & just come in from time to time. But there are several Members that go to many boards, BK, is one of those. That is very important for inter-communication. This ofcourse limits the amount of time they can be at one board.
One member said above that if they endorse others they will get free gear, HAHA, I guess that could happen with some noob sources. I DON'T give free GEAR, pay your way is my motto & tell the truth about my gear if you really want to help others.
Lets PLZ keep it peaceful until we have a reason to call someone out.
The KANE.D3 issue obviusly brings out anger, which I can understand if some have been screwed & also lost faith in the process.
If possible can we take it to another post. I have BANNED him. Is he banned here?
Anyway Respect members.
mikestrong
I will be working for now.
Colt44
Well-known Member
I hope not but worth looking into.
Edit: read the post above. I'd like to see that info.
mikestrong
Subscriber
To find more about the other mike strong bust. You need guys that go to different forums. Not just on here.
I know mike strong is very similar to mikestrong.
But again it is NOT me.
GOOD MESO MEMBERS. Just a QUICK & IMPORTANT note.
I am in NO way asking members from here to sign up on my forum: TheVIPBoard nor is it a requisite to work with me.
I am happy if you do, but it is NOT needed or required. Just PM me on here & we will see about your REF'S, RANK, TIME HERE, POSTS or perhaps a trial order.
THEVIP should be back up soon I was told.
Respect
mikestrong
I know mike strong is very similar to mikestrong.
But again it is NOT me.
GOOD MESO MEMBERS. Just a QUICK & IMPORTANT note.
I am in NO way asking members from here to sign up on my forum: TheVIPBoard nor is it a requisite to work with me.
I am happy if you do, but it is NOT needed or required. Just PM me on here & we will see about your REF'S, RANK, TIME HERE, POSTS or perhaps a trial order.
THEVIP should be back up soon I was told.
Respect
mikestrong
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