Prednisone PROMOTES Muscle Growth?

Yeah, but for Crohns that may have been exactly what you needed. I don't want people to avoid these drugs if they may really benefit from them.
Yes, i was close to dying from crohns. Prednisone worked well. But the side effects were harsh. First time was 12 weeks and being weened off.

For medical reasons if your doctor wants you on it I wouldn't avoid it, but I'd want to know all the options.

To use it recreationally would be stupid.

Second time I cold turkey off at 9 weeks as I wanted to die from it. By then I was on an auto immune suppressor and was fine.
 
no. that has nothing to do with it. it has nothing to do with "withdrawal" or "addictive". If you know people on it, they want to get off of glucocorticoids. Most people hate it.

long term glucocorticoids is associated with muscle wasting, osteoporosis, alot of endrocrine issues, weight gain, water retention, insomnia, severe acid reflux, increased chance of infection.

This is 100% correct
 
Prednisone is like the 22nd most prescribed medicine. It's used for nearly.......everything, and it's taken long term MOST OF THE TIME.

It's a miraculous drug........that has consequences. Nearly everyone on Prednisone comes to the point of wanting or needing to ween off it due to side effects. Most aren't able to do that. Dosages go up and down. This is the story of Prednisone.
This is incorrect. Prednisone or Methopred is typically prescribed for ramp down (high initial dose to low dose) for 7-10 days. Anything more makes providers nervous due to cholesterol and glucose impacts (Even Chron’s and IBS are prescribed this way typically to kill flare ups)
 
Yeah, tell that to the millions of patients on long term/permanent glucocorticoid therapy. More are on long term therapy than short term therapy. Go dig for the statistics. They are out there.
 
no. that has nothing to do with it. it has nothing to do with "withdrawal" or "addictive". If you know people on it, they want to get off of glucocorticoids. Most people hate it.

long term glucocorticoids is associated with muscle wasting, osteoporosis, alot of endrocrine issues, weight gain, water retention, insomnia, severe acid reflux, increased chance of infection.

I saw some review where they found two instances of glucocorticoid dependence. They had very nasty withdrawals. Dependence is NOT the same as addiction. Most people don't know the difference (I suspect you do, but most don't).

For those unaware:
Dependence is a physical dependence which causes withdrawals upon cessation of a substance.

Addiction is continuing to use a substance despite it destroying your life and every sign in the world telling you to stop...yet you continue to use because you are mentally addicted. The physical dependence and mental addiction obviously play into one another very intimately. However, they are separate issues.

Sure, for someone who was prescribed them for too long, they could become dependent. Or if, for some reason, they LIKED the awful, horrible feeling of glucocorticoids then I suppose they could keep taking them. But jesus christ just smoke some weed and take a fucking ritalin instead lmao. It's probably about the same feeling but the withdrawals at least won't kill you.
 
I saw some review where they found two instances of glucocorticoid dependence. They had very nasty withdrawals. Dependence is NOT the same as addiction. Most people don't know the difference (I suspect you do, but most don't).

For those unaware:
Dependence is a physical dependence which causes withdrawals upon cessation of a substance.

Addiction is continuing to use a substance despite it destroying your life and every sign in the world telling you to stop...yet you continue to use because you are mentally addicted. The physical dependence and mental addiction obviously play into one another very intimately. However, they are separate issues.

Sure, for someone who was prescribed them for too long, they could become dependent. Or if, for some reason, they LIKED the awful, horrible feeling of glucocorticoids then I suppose they could keep taking them. But jesus christ just smoke some weed and take a fucking ritalin instead lmao. It's probably about the same feeling but the withdrawals at least won't kill you.
You're splitting hairs with the addiction vs dependence topic. That may be more appropriate for other drugs like opiates. Corticosteroids are addictive/make dependent and people continue to take them even after their doctor weaned or took them off (for good reason or not). The definition doesn't matter here.

I know many, especially the elderly, who have for example, "gone blind" because they couldn't wean down and come off the corticosteroids. They were warned that their eyesight was going going be gone most likely and it's time to abandon the Corticosteroids, but they simply couldn't do it. Does that satisfy the destructive element that your definition of addiction requires?
 
Yeah, tell that to the millions of patients on long term/permanent glucocorticoid therapy. More are on long term therapy than short term therapy. Go dig for the statistics. They are out there.
Exactly. You nailed it on the head.

They are on LONG TERM THERAPY. This causes dependence. Although if there are that many (which I doubt), then why does this MEDLINE search study only find 26 possible and 22 confirmed case studies of glucocorticoid (GC) dependence? That does not line up with "millions of patients" on long term GC therapy. Also here, "Dependence is unusal" on glucocorticoids.

But wait, there's more: This study found in the UK (note, release date 2000) only identified 244,235 oral GC users in their General Practice Research Database (GPRD--not to be confused with GDPR).

Within that population:
- 103,008 only received one prescription during follow up.
- 37,424 received two scripts
- 103,803 received 3 or more.

Prednisolone was most frequently prescribed. This is basically a prodrug for prednisone; it get converted into prednisone in the liver.

Another study in Denmark, found 926,314 GC users from 1999-2014.

With those numbers and info on number of scripts received and approximated equivalent duration of usage. This does NOT add up to millions of long term GC users.

Please do research before you spout out information.
 
You're splitting hairs with the addiction vs dependence topic. That may be more appropriate for other drugs like opiates. Corticosteroids are addictive/make dependent and people continue to take them even after their doctor weaned or took them off (for good reason or not). The definition doesn't matter here.

I know many, especially the elderly, who have for example, "gone blind" because they couldn't wean down and come off the corticosteroids. They were warned that their eyesight was going going be gone most likely and it's time to abandon the Corticosteroids, but they simply couldn't do it. Does that satisfy the destructive element that your definition of addiction requires?
Do you work in a clinical setting? How do you know so many old people who have had these issues? Please share your background that gives you such insight into this topic which directly disputes the studies and research I shared above.
 
Yeah, tell that to the millions of patients on long term/permanent glucocorticoid therapy. More are on long term therapy than short term therapy. Go dig for the statistics. They are out there.
Dude, wtf. How about you dig for them. I just spent dug up and read through multiple full text studies and a couple more abstracts and find ZERO implications of what you're talking about.

So how about you stop asking others to do your work for you and YOU provide some evidence to back up YOUR unsubstantiated claim.

I would disagree about "splitting hairs". Dependce and addiciton are entirely different disorders, with different symptoms, and one requires a mental health professional to diagnose whereas the other could be diagnosed by a PCP. These patients you speak of are not ADDICTED. You probably encountered some people who saw a shitty doctor that had them on prednisone for a few months. HPA axis suppression can occur in as little as 4 weeks of use, bam, they are dependent. They probably couldn't get off it because it alleviated their pain or other symptoms, not because they felt so amazing and loved the bloated, always hungry, moon face, jittery, anxious feeling of being on prednisone or whatever GC they were on and that caused them to chase the drug and compulsively expend massive amounts of effort trying to get more and more or it.

It is okay to admit you are wrong. Seriously. You'll get far more respect for admitting you were wrong than continuing to back up a point with zero evidence and with as much counterevidence as I provided above.

Edit: I found TWO studies referencing "Addiction" to prednisone. They are from 1958 and 1973. Before drug dependence and addiction were properly distinguished as separate, as they are today.
 
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You're on ignore now too. All you do is spam walls of text, containing absolute garbage methed out superficial research with zero filter.

You're on meth auto pilot.
lmfao dude you are a piece of work. At least I provided SOMETHING. You haven't done shit except make bullshit claims with zero evidence. If you want people to actually BELIEVE YOU, then you need to back up your case. At this point you just look like an overly emotional child, blocking everyone who says anything you don't like, even if it cites four separate studies that made claims against what you say. You don't even glance at them because you don't want to change your mind. So you're overly emotional child AND you're a stubborn asshole.

Good luck with life bro. You're gonna need it.
 
I know many, especially the elderly, who have for example, "gone blind" because they couldn't wean down and come off the corticosteroids. They were warned that their eyesight was going going be gone most likely and it's time to abandon the Corticosteroids, but they simply couldn't do it. Does that satisfy the destructive element that your definition of addiction requires?
No, it doesn't, because you are just spouting out claims with no evidence.

Then the doctor would likely put them on a forced taper and the patients would need to oblige. If that doesn't work then they would be referred to a rehab facility that could manage this for them. You obviously don't know how these things work at all.

Just as a note...I can't find anything about GCs causing blindness either.

All I found was them PREVENTING blindness in some indications: over, GCs are also used, either alone or in combination with antiangiogenic therapy, to inhibit pathological ocular neovascularization that might lead to vision loss if left untreated.

Are you sure you're even talking about the correct drug class here?
 
That's too bad. @Cridi887 is a great guy and very knowledegable.
Meh. Not a loss. I have reviewed plenty of medication on patients and I have never seen someone in long term steroids (more than 3 months).. Maybe the ones with idiot doctors of people already on their death bed.

It's possible I have seen one and I didn't recall it. I do know of some patients that have it on hand ready to go just in case of auto immune flare ups.
 
Yeah, tell that to the millions of patients on long term/permanent glucocorticoid therapy. More are on long term therapy than short term therapy. Go dig for the statistics. They are out there.
Oh, I don’t doubt for a moment that there are unfortunate people with conditions that require long term usage… but if you look up dosing recommendations on Archimedes and other dosing bibles created for physicians… long term use is discouraged for multitudinous reasons. (Caveat… I have no idea what the world outside the USA does. This could be more prevalent. My knowledge doesn’t extend beyond)
 
Meh. Not a loss. I have reviewed plenty of medication on patients and I have never seen someone in long term steroids (more than 3 months).. Maybe the ones with idiot doctors of people already on their death bed.

It's possible I have seen one and I didn't recall it. I do know of some patients that have it on hand ready to go just in case of auto immune flare ups.
I meant to say "or people already on their death bed". At that point it doesn't matter but quality of life/palliation.
 
Meh. Not a loss. I have reviewed plenty of medication on patients and I have never seen someone in long term steroids (more than 3 months).. Maybe the ones with idiot doctors of people already on their death bed.

It's possible I have seen one and I didn't recall it. I do know of some patients that have it on hand ready to go just in case of auto immune flare ups.
Transplant patients.
For crohns they try to keep it under 12 weeks.
 
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