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Strength Training Thread

Ozzy619 said:
Doc this is more than enough and exactly what I was looking for. Ive been looking online but you know how that goes, theres a million choices out there, most of which are bs. Since you actually compete, know my stats and my general range Im glad you offered your advice. Most of these programs Ive never heard of to be honest.
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In my head I have it pictured how I wanted it to read but it didn't come out as pretty as I wanted lol

These are philosophies and methodologies that bit everyone hears about for sure. They each have pros and cons depending on you the individual.

Right now Sheiko is my top pick, you had me at Russian. But I will look into daily undulating and block periodization as well. Ill put together a routine on here and feel free to critique whenever you have the time. I know people pay top dollar for this type of advice so know that your tims is very appreciated.
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Words aren't needed Ozzy. Enough Thanks will come when you post your progress in the future. There in lies the satisfaction, watching someone succeed and get better.

DUP is the new comer to the block you could say. Doesn't mean it's worse just that it hasn't been as popular before as it is now. InsertnameHere probably has the most experience of all if us with this type of programming. It's pretty easy to set uo but can be time consuming to come uo with percentages and volume measurements.

Block periodization is what I'm doing now with coach. Actually it's a modified version adding in the RPE system and auto-regulation. This would be the most time consuming to set up but allow you freedom like DUP but with a larger lift selection most likely.

If you decide with Sheiko, there really isn't coming up with a program. The templates are made up already and following them is your best bet. You could add in auto regulatory features like RPE to take the place of having Sheiko coach you but the programs are for all intents and purposes set in stone.

Any of you of strong guys are free to critique as well. Insertnamehere, weightchinup, brutus, rukin and anyone else I left out. Glad to see this thread is getting some action, hopefully it will be a solid base for guys interested in strength. Im going to sticky your post doc for future reference.
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Docd187123 said:
Ozzy:

1) linear progression program like Texas Method by Rippetoe. Excellent program for general strength gains. Can be used for powerliftng but probably not the best for it. First time through you run the basic lifts several times a week: squat, bench, press, deadlifts, and very few others besides that. After a few cycles under your belt you can begin playing with the program and adjust to keep it working for you or to alter the training goal. You'll be in the gym 3 days a week, you might be able to get a 4th day in but it would not be a taxing day. More like GPP, conditioning work, fluff stuff, stc. A good but tough program.

2) Wendler 5/3/1: good program but progression is too slow for my tastes although there are tricks to speed it up. The average intensities worked are pretty low though. Don't mean to sound like in bashing it as it is a good program but I'm just not a staunch supporter of it and I know the least about it of all the others i mention.

3) westside....enough said. It works and it has the strongest ppl in the world using it but without a knowledgeable team and specialty equipment you won't make the most out of it. It lacks specificity and you rarely do the actual competition lifts outside of a meet. You'd be lifting 4days a week and you could add more time but conditioning wise, rehab/prehab work, MOB work, etc. Not lifting the 5th day.

4) sheiko: one of the winningest coaches in the world and coached some of the best Russian lifters ever. Well best lifters anywhere really lol. Very specific, highly detailed 3-5 days in gym depending in the cycle, and gains in strength will be bad. Good for powerlifting too. Problem is to get the most you'd need sheiko himself to tailor the program but ppl still have great success regardless. A coach is supposed to regulate the programming based on fatigue but we all can't have sheiko lol. One of my top choices for you. You'd be doing a limited variety of lifts, really the competiton lifts and their variants, with a few others thrown in.

5) DAILY UNdulating periodization: similar to what Insertnamehere is running. Very good program and another top choice. Can't go wrong with it. 3-4 lifting days a week, small lift selection but highly specific, good for PLing etc.

6) block periodization another awesome programming philosophy. Great for PL'ing. Great for strength in general too. Will allow you more lift selection and 3-4 days in gym. You go through different blocks of training. Blocks are accumulation phase, transmutation phase, and realization phase. Complicated but another top choice for you.

7) rts style programming like Mike Tuscherer does. Very auto regulatory, allows a lot of freedom. Specificity is there. Great for strength and PL'ing. Very effective.

Sorry I didn't go into as much detail as I wanted to but feel free to ask any questions or look into them more. I'll answer whatever I can. If you need help choosing we'll go from there but think it over and do some digging. If anything pops out at you as "I want to do tbat" let me know and well design something around hat philosophy for you.
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I was leaning towards 5/3/1 myself. Now I may have to rethink it.
 
Ozzy619 said:
Thanks weighted, your advice is always appreciated very knowledgeable. Im interested in the sheiko template and will most likely do it before any other routine. I can tell you that my half assed approach to strength training has already left me sore as hell so i can only imagine what a real routine will be like. I will stick to 4, maybe 5 days if Im able to keep up. I should have laid off the gym today but what can I say.
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A real routine will challenge you in ways you'll never have experienced yet. I'm confident in saying you will push yourself harder than you ever have before while doing less amount if lifts. It's almost contradictory but trust me, several weeks into any of these templates and you begin to feel run down. Weeks later you're pushed even harder. Peaking for a mock meet or actual meet means you will never be at 100%. You'll be constantly fighting the effects if fatigue day in day out. A common phrase in PLing is if you feel 100% during oeaking you're doing it wrong. Nothing will prepare you for how hard it gets besides actually going through with it.

If you do Sheiko you'll be in the gym 3-4x a week. Some templates of his may have a 5th day but those are very rare. If you want a 5th day I suggest It only be conditioning work that helps your endurance and cardio respiratory fitness, extremely light work to promote blood flow, MOB work and maybe hitting one or two weak areas with low weight and moderate volume. You will not be abke to do more than this and if you try it will handicap the actual program.

The PPL was an excellent run and I contemplated running it before starting this thread. It gave me great overall strength and I recommend It all the time. Hopefully the sheiko template can get me past a few of my plateaus. My biggest problem is getting out of the bb mindset and dropping all the accessory lifts. I did a great job recomping and losing a lot of fat with the fst 7. Now Im looking to add a little mass and man strength. Feel free to give me any advice, Ive been more of a gym rat and open to all criticisms as I progress.
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Many programs allow accessory lifts. Sheiko does not except for some ab work, lat work, chest flies, good mornings and small things like that.

I'm currently studying RTS/Mike. Tuscherer style programming with RPE/load drops, rep drops/repeats/fatigue percentages/etc. I think it to be one if the smartest ways to lift. It can be applied to other programs. There's even a modified Sheiko program that utilizes this!
 
jaymaximus said:
I was leaning towards 5/3/1 myself. Now I may have to rethink it.
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It's not a bad program no matter how much it may sound that way. I just think it not optimal for true powerlifting and there are faster progressing templates out there. It's great for older and injured guys I'd imagine bc of the slower progression. Also, I'm the masochistic type in the gym. I enjoy lifting heavy percentages and find my neuromuscular system to benefit greatly from it. 5/3/1 bases it's percentages off 90-95% of your 1RM so you're two percentages away from your max and most work is ~60-80% 1RM I think. For maximal strength and especially powerlifting there's just not enough work over the 90% zone.
 
Ozzy619 said:
Thanks weighted, your advice is always appreciated very knowledgeable. Im interested in the sheiko template and will most likely do it before any other routine. I can tell you that my half assed approach to strength training has already left me sore as hell so i can only imagine what a real routine will be like. I will stick to 4, maybe 5 days if Im able to keep up. I should have laid off the gym today but what can I say.

The PPL was an excellent run and I contemplated running it before starting this thread. It gave me great overall strength and I recommend It all the time. Hopefully the sheiko template can get me past a few of my plateaus. My biggest problem is getting out of the bb mindset and dropping all the accessory lifts. I did a great job recomping and losing a lot of fat with the fst 7. Now Im looking to add a little mass and man strength. Feel free to give me any advice, Ive been more of a gym rat and open to all criticisms as I progress.
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Always glad to help.

As far as accessory lifts go, I wouldn't think of it as having too little accessory lifts, but rather a more focused exercise selection. I am an advocate for a more focused / reduced exercise selection no matter what and I train for bodybuilding primarily. All of the routines posted so far have ample amounts of accessories imo.

I would rather get strong as fuck at a FEW movements instead of getting moderately stronger at a lot of movements, so I always keep exercise selection focused in my routines even though they are bodybuilding oriented. As always, your physique will reflect the new poundages you are capable of pushing assuming RE method gets trained and you're allowing your scale weight to go up. Yes, variety plays a role but not as big as once thought and many routines take excess variety way too far imo.

Your goal on such a routine should be to get stronger at your main movements. This will facilitate size gains no matter what as long as total tonnage is adequate and it most certainly is on a Sheiko template. The best way to do this is not with excess exercise selection but to simply spend more time practicing these movements. It gives structure and purpose to your training in a way that no typical bodybuilding routine or bro split can compare, you are actively trying to get better at something and you accomplish that by doing it more and focusing on that. It's an excellent approach, you should get acclimated to this training style very quickly because I know you've used a somewhat similar approach when you ran the PPL routine.
 
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Docd187123 said:
It's not a bad program no matter how much it may sound that way. I just think it not optimal for true powerlifting and there are faster progressing templates out there. It's great for older and injured guys I'd imagine bc of the slower progression. Also, I'm the masochistic type in the gym. I enjoy lifting heavy percentages and find my neuromuscular system to benefit greatly from it. 5/3/1 bases it's percentages off 90-95% of your 1RM so you're two percentages away from your max and most work is ~60-80% 1RM I think. For maximal strength and especially powerlifting there's just not enough work over the 90% zone.
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Ill just keep at it. Im still not going all in until around the 1st. So far ive just taken certain days trying out different methods. Its hard to know whats best from such a small sample size though. Ill have to do some more research on Sheiko.
 
Come Monday I will be following the Sheiko Template #29. Im going to take the weekend off so I can be fresh for monday. Below I provided a link that does a very good job explaining every aspect of this program as well as a link to the templates.

http://www.powerliftingtowin.com/sheiko/
@Doc187123 I live right by the Olympic Training Center and have a lot of aspiring athletes that train at the same time as me. Its humbling but this 19 year old kid kinda took me under his wing as far as watching my form and showing me some accessories for strength. He is currently training for comp.

He is 198lbs and his lifts are
Squat 365
DL 415
Bench 245
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Ozzy619 said:
Come Monday I will be following the Sheiko Template #29. Im going to take the weekend off so I can be fresh for monday. Below I provided a link that does a very good job explaining every aspect of this program as well as a link to the templates.
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Ozzy a quick suggestion:

I would start the Sheiko #29 not this week but next week. Between now and then, try to deload yourself a little and test maxes for each of the main lifts. A week should be enough time for you to get maxes on all the lifts. The more accurate your maxes the more accurate the program will be.

Of you want help deloading and testing maxes just let me know.

Regardless, your journey is about to begin. Get ready for it. There will be dark times ahead. Very dark and trying times. Sheiko is known for running ppl into the ground. You're going to have to want it badly enough to succeed. You're going to have to be thirsty for it. Get your mind where it needs to be, find your zone your spot where you rule. You're gonna need that in the coming weeks
 
Docd187123 said:
Ozzy a quick suggestion:

I would start the Sheiko #29 not this week but next week. Between now and then, try to deload yourself a little and test maxes for each of the main lifts. A week should be enough time for you to get maxes on all the lifts. The more accurate your maxes the more accurate the program will be.

Of you want help deloading and testing maxes just let me know.

Regardless, your journey is about to begin. Get ready for it. There will be dark times ahead. Very dark and trying times. Sheiko is known for running ppl into the ground. You're going to have to want it badly enough to succeed. You're going to have to be thirsty for it. Get your mind where it needs to be, find your zone your spot where you rule. You're gonna need that in the coming weeks
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I can wait another week to deload. I was trying different stuff out this week and testing maxes but am already very taxed so sure I can add a little more to my current maxes, especially on bench and squats.

I can already imagine the dark times, Im already sore and tired everyday from my half assed approach at strength training. Im going to do 3x a week only, I can already see that I need time to rest and heal. I have a good idea of where my percentages are and this weekend Ill chart it all out on a spreadsheet.
 
Docd187123 said:
Ozzy a quick suggestion:

I would start the Sheiko #29 not this week but next week. Between now and then, try to deload yourself a little and test maxes for each of the main lifts. A week should be enough time for you to get maxes on all the lifts. The more accurate your maxes the more accurate the program will be.

Of you want help deloading and testing maxes just let me know.

Regardless, your journey is about to begin. Get ready for it. There will be dark times ahead. Very dark and trying times. Sheiko is known for running ppl into the ground. You're going to have to want it badly enough to succeed. You're going to have to be thirsty for it. Get your mind where it needs to be, find your zone your spot where you rule. You're gonna need that in the coming weeks
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"There will be dark times ahead. Very dark and trying times."

I agree with this but I would add one or two more 'verys'. Maybe even three. :D
 
insertnamehere said:
"There will be dark times ahead. Very dark and trying times."

I agree with this but I would add one or two more 'verys'. Maybe even three. :D
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insertnamehere said:
"There will be dark times ahead. Very dark and trying times."

I agree with this but I would add one or two more 'verys'. Maybe even three. :D
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Im a glutton for self punishment. So this only scares me a little bit lol. Im tired of being another bro split guy in the gym and turning my wheels while going no where in the strength department. This will be the first time I will be strict to a program and keeping records of my lifts. Ill try and take some videos too for critique.
 
Ozzy619 said:
Im a glutton for self punishment. So this only scares me a little bit lol. Im tired of being another bro split guy in the gym and turning my wheels while going no where in the strength department. This will be the first time I will be strict to a program and keeping records of my lifts. Ill try and take some videos too for critique.
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Sounds good, Ozzy. You seem motivated and determined to give the strength aspect of training an honest try. I think you'll be happy that you did. There's nothing quite like the challenge and satisfaction of continuously adding more weight to the bar - its addicting! And you'll always want more! More! MORE! Consider yourself warned. :)

Additionally, since your feeling so motivated, I would greatly appreciate if you would find that girl in your avi and mail her to me. I have an excellent place all set up for her to visit (my face), she'll love it. Thanks, buddy. I'll PM you my address.
 
insertnamehere said:
Sounds good, Ozzy. You seem motivated and determined to give the strength aspect of training an honest try. I think you'll be happy that you did. There's nothing quite like the challenge and satisfaction of continuously adding more weight to the bar - its addicting! And you'll always want more! More! MORE! Consider yourself warned. :)

Additionally, since your feeling so motivated, I would greatly appreciate if you would find that girl in your avi and mail her to me. I have an excellent place all set up for her to visit (my face), she'll love it. Thanks, buddy. I'll PM you my address.
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When I find her Ill be sure to send her over as soon as Im finished ;) just keep giving ne input as I progress and Ill post some good pics for you guys.
 
Ozzy619 said:
When I find her Ill be sure to send her over as soon as Im finished ;) just keep giving ne input as I progress and Ill post some good pics for you guys.
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Deal!

As you mentioned in a previous post, take some video of your lifts if you can. Its one of the best ways to help yourself work on form and technique. And if you're able to protect your identity, post them up for us to critique.
 
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