Tobacco

Did this get off topic? LOL.. I'm game. I just wanted to point out that I wonder how they QUALIFY subjects to study? I pretty much like 2-6 drinks per day. Less lately, but rarely ever ZERO. My point is that I am the definition of a full blown alcoholic. The stuff really calls me if I try to go a few days. Now a month or so if force and all is forgotten. Been a while for that.

But if it is genetic, then whats the TRIGGER. I recall that first beer at 13 given by an uncle. Not another till 16. Poundin 12 packs of cheap beer one or two friday nights a month in late high school. Every weekend in college. Still, I did not start drinking daily till late twenties, and for self medicating job stress. Now, I get pretty damn stressed without it daily, and especially with work related issues. But also of course it now transposes over the being a dad stress, crazy wife stress, and all stress. Or just a wind down at the end of the day. BUT THERE IS NO QUESTION IT CALLS ME..

FIRST - So the definition of an alcoholic is someone who needs a drink on a regular basis, even if a small amount, right?

SECOND - So why does it matter to scienceof there is a gene causing addiction to alcohol anyway, when clearly ANYONE can become addicted to it!?!?

Polically it appears to be a MASS STONING potentially setting up. Further it woul appear an attempt to QAULIFY folks unfairly. So then will next they agree I am not an alcoholic, but I am a GENE @#$%$##@ which is characterized by COMPULSIVE BEHAVIOR, or a gene that is characterized by HIGH STRESS.

The problem with this kind of science in REALITY is that it sets up for MASS FAILURE in the civil and criminal court systems. So now a person has 3,4, or more TECHNICAL REAL REASONS for a certain behavior that may have contributed to a crime or civil tort, by which they can now not be held accountible OR even make unfair recoveries from other parties. So finally you would have a drunk that runs over and kills someone's child who gets off the hook for an unforseen medical condition, who the turns around and sues his doctor for not diagnosing him, the manufacturer of the booze he drank, the Pharma Company that makes the drug to negate his condition, the federal and state regulating authorities, and the parents for allowing their child to walk on the street unsupervised for the STRESS of the event caused to him which is now caused an official diagnosis of the stress gene.... LOL

Just sayin/;):D
 
The tobacco-specific carcinogen NNK induces DN... [J Clin Invest. 2010] - PubMed - NCBI

The tobacco-specific carcinogen NNK induces DNA methyltransferase 1 accumulation and tumor suppressor gene hypermethylation in mice and lung cancer patients.
Lin RK, Hsieh YS, Lin P, Hsu HS, Chen CY, Tang YA, Lee CF, Wang YC.
SourceDepartment of Pharmacology, National Cheng Kung University, Tainan, Republic of China.

Abstract
DNA methyltransferase 1 (DNMT1) catalyzes DNA methylation and is overexpressed in many human diseases, including cancer. The tobacco-specific carcinogen NNK also induces DNA methylation. However, the role of DNMT1-mediated methylation in tobacco carcinogenesis remains unclear. Here we used human and mouse lung cancer samples and cell lines to determine a mechanism whereby NNK induced DNMT1 expression and activity. We determined that in a human lung cell line, glycogen synthase kinase 3beta (GSK3beta) phosphorylated DNMT1 to recruit beta-transducin repeat-containing protein (betaTrCP), resulting in DNMT1 degradation, and that NNK activated AKT, inhibiting GSK3beta function and thereby attenuating DNMT1 degradation. NNK also induced betaTrCP translocation to the cytoplasm via the heterogeneous nuclear ribonucleoprotein U (hnRNP-U) shuttling protein, resulting in DNMT1 nuclear accumulation and hypermethylation of the promoters of tumor suppressor genes. Fluorescence immunohistochemistry (IHC) of lung adenomas from NNK-treated mice and tumors from lung cancer patients that were smokers were characterized by disruption of the DNMT1/betaTrCP interaction and DNMT1 nuclear accumulation. Importantly, DNMT1 overexpression in lung cancer patients who smoked continuously correlated with poor prognosis. We believe that the NNK-induced DNMT1 accumulation and subsequent hypermethylation of the promoter of tumor suppressor genes may lead to tumorigenesis and poor prognosis and provide an important link between tobacco smoking and lung cancer. Furthermore, this mechanism may also be involved in other smoking-related human diseases.
 
I recall some dumbshit from a tobacco distributor tossed me a couple of cans of some cheap nasty shit one morning when I was leaving the gas station. I told him no thanks, "I only dip the good stuff". He advised me "it was all the same as made by the same". I advised him, "whatever..!".... And "retard"(under my breath)....

So from this page - http://www.healthline.com/health-blogs/freedom-smoking/carcinogens-smoking-and-smokeless-tobacco-use-1

Secondly, smokeless tobaccos vary enormously in the amount of toxins (including carcinogens) they deliver, and (not surprisingly) the ones containing higher concentrations of toxins (like carcinogenic tobacco-specific nitrosamines, or benzo(a)pyrene), appear to be more likely to have adverse health effects. To give an idea of the range of concentrations of toxins, Professor Brad Rodu at University of Louisville published data on the concentration of carcinogenic Tobacco-Specific Nitrosamines (TSNAs) in various smokeless tobacco products. Some examples are as follows (the units of measurement are parts per million based on dry weight):

Ariva (new powdered tobacco lozenge): <0.1 ppms
Ettan (Swedish snus): 2.0 ppms
Red Man (US chewing tobacco): 1.8 ppms
Copenhagen (leading US moist snuff): 12.1 ppms
Red Seal (US dry snuff): 1096 ppms


FIRST it should be noted that the Copenhagen is relatively close to the levels in the Swedish SNUS. But look at the red seal shuff (not to be confused with their "dip"..
 
D.C. Circuit Affirms District Court Decision Striking Down FDA Regulation Requiring Graphic Warnings on Cigarette Packages
FDA Law Blog: D.C. Circuit Affirms District Court Decision Striking Down FDA Regulation Requiring Graphic Warnings on Cigarette Packages

A divided three-judge panel of the D.C. Circuit affirmed U.S. District Judge Richard Leon’s grant of summary judgment to plaintiffs in R.J. Reynolds et al v. FDA et al. In brief, Judge Leon had applied strict scrutiny to FDA’s regulation requiring the display on cigarette packages of graphic warnings intended to dissuade would-be smokers, and concluded that the regulation was not “narrowly tailored to achieve a compelling government interest.” The D.C. Circuit agreed with the district court’s result, but for reasons different than those expressed in the district court decision.
 
BBC,

What is your opinion of the anti depressant benefits of tobacco? Do you think the dopamine kick from tobbaco is enough to give a real relief from daily maladies?

I know booze is your poison of choice but where do you rank tobbaco?

Also how many cigarettes would one have to smoke to "sustain the buzz" as I know a tolerance builds up......


Thnx
.
 
Smoking is an MAOI inhibitor IIRC.

An interesting finding. Schizophrenics are notorious for their high rates of smoking but have lower rates of lung cancer.
 
We discussed this before. And actually - NICOTINE - Is my #1 Drug of choice. All day long. I can live without alcohol, but I cant imagine an intoxiated moment without some nicotine....:eek:!

I suspect nicotine is the #1 self-help drug for bipolar and schizaphrenic type behavior. Its total self medication with a pretty strong dopamergenic drug. Period. I suspect that the people who use it gravitated there because the had a subliminal self-notification that it was productive for them. I think there is a critical loss period in those that go bat shit and never found it prior as the behavior ONSET is irreversible as DAMAGE incurred - Is suspect. The illusion of "not knowing what crazy really feels like" may be a benefit of the drug. Make no mistake that I am certain that some folks are just wired too fucking crazy for nicotine to mitigate successfully, however, most of them never dosed high enought really to know when you consider a dip is about a min of 10mgs of nicotine as to 1/2mg in a light cigarette. No to mention youll just gas yourself out trying to smoke at that rate. THEY SHOULD DO A STUDY TO FIND OUT WHAT THE MENTAL ILLNESS RATE DIAGNOSED IN DIPPERS IS....

I cant tell you have SEDATING nicotine is for me, whether it be the beginner high where I just got overloaded with it and sitting there in a nicotine induced fever-sweat, OR to obtain it when systems are low. But its a sedation - Period. And perhaps too much. I used to used more as "celebratory" and "when the work was done" other than the occasional maintenance on the way, but there was somewhere down the line when I just rean straight thru with it which I believe contributes to "Lazy" behavior. Thats all I got...

BBC,

What is your opinion of the anti depressant benefits of tobacco? Do you think the dopamine kick from tobbaco is enough to give a real relief from daily maladies?

I know booze is your poison of choice but where do you rank tobbaco?

Also how many cigarettes would one have to smoke to "sustain the buzz" as I know a tolerance builds up......


Thnx
.
 
Yeah we did discuss nicotine before.... i tried the nicotine patch and it was ok, but i am drawn to cigarettes for some reason. Are you saying that cigarettes are not the way to go but to use patch type systems ?

You say 10mg's versus 1/2mg in light cigarette. So I am assuming you are using and advocating nicotine in a non-cigarette form. What is the typical amount of nicotine in a standard cigarette? Infact let me look it up now.... about 2.5mg apparently.

From my research nicotine not only directly boosts dopamine, but it also works on MAO-B which is used in the metabolism of dopamine....

Of course tolerance must be an issue which is why people move up from a pack a week to pack a day smokers.

We discussed this before. And actually - NICOTINE - Is my #1 Drug of choice. All day long. I can live without alcohol, but I cant imagine an intoxiated moment without some nicotine....:eek:!

I suspect nicotine is the #1 self-help drug for bipolar and schizaphrenic type behavior. Its total self medication with a pretty strong dopamergenic drug. Period. I suspect that the people who use it gravitated there because the had a subliminal self-notification that it was productive for them. I think there is a critical loss period in those that go bat shit and never found it prior as the behavior ONSET is irreversible as DAMAGE incurred - Is suspect. The illusion of "not knowing what crazy really feels like" may be a benefit of the drug. Make no mistake that I am certain that some folks are just wired too fucking crazy for nicotine to mitigate successfully, however, most of them never dosed high enought really to know when you consider a dip is about a min of 10mgs of nicotine as to 1/2mg in a light cigarette. No to mention youll just gas yourself out trying to smoke at that rate. THEY SHOULD DO A STUDY TO FIND OUT WHAT THE MENTAL ILLNESS RATE DIAGNOSED IN DIPPERS IS....

I cant tell you have SEDATING nicotine is for me, whether it be the beginner high where I just got overloaded with it and sitting there in a nicotine induced fever-sweat, OR to obtain it when systems are low. But its a sedation - Period. And perhaps too much. I used to used more as "celebratory" and "when the work was done" other than the occasional maintenance on the way, but there was somewhere down the line when I just rean straight thru with it which I believe contributes to "Lazy" behavior. Thats all I got...
 
10mgs referring to a dip of a good moist snuff like copen or kodiak. A regular cig is still only 1mg...

I will give you the patch is a shitty feel. But if you recall I pointed that I would suspect failure of the product for behavioral disorder due to the stability of the dosing, and the delay in release as well. Plus it just dont hit the same. Havent figured that one out yet, but something is still missing in the replacement deals.

See my recent post on European SNUS. Apparently they are researching in Sweeden and finding no medical issues, which I suspect is the case for smokless here )short of the cheap shit). KNOCK ON WOOD... But the SNUS has up to 20mgs per gram or PINCH and will flat out blow the black of your head out!!!!!! For that matter, just go get your self some copenhagen long cut (just like said no other concoctions), or Kodiak wintergreen probably preferable. Cause you havn't had a fair sampling of smokeless tobacco experience if you have not tried one of these.

Pop in a SMALL dip. If yur not sittin down scratch yur head within a couple of minutes, then you MAY have issues. LOL But then report back on the seditive qualities.. LOL

Yeah we did discuss nicotine before.... i tried the nicotine patch and it was ok, but i am drawn to cigarettes for some reason. Are you saying that cigarettes are not the way to go but to use patch type systems ?

You say 10mg's versus 1/2mg in light cigarette. So I am assuming you are using and advocating nicotine in a non-cigarette form. What is the typical amount of nicotine in a standard cigarette? Infact let me look it up now.... about 2.5mg apparently.

From my research nicotine not only directly boosts dopamine, but it also works on MAO-B which is used in the metabolism of dopamine....

Of course tolerance must be an issue which is why people move up from a pack a week to pack a day smokers.
 
Ya know, speaking of carcinogenic tobacco-specific nitrosamines as a potential source for cancer, I am starting to have my doubts. Now, be clear that I am not sure the source and only speculate its a byproduct of the heat/kiln.smoke dry process where the plants are hung and dried. BUT I AM NOT SURE.

So check out the lowest rating in the post I quote. Its like 1000 or something for the dry snuff like granny sniffed. That 100 times more that moist copenhagen !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!. So there would not be a sould that did not die of cancer if that were the case, and a lot of people snorted that crap.

So I am starting to suspect the pulonium route is the problem. And the other by products of amonia based fertilizer as it DEGRADES... Like Cadmium too apparently.... So the industry likes to tell you about all these chemicals in the tobacco, but they just kinda die off silently after the bark. So why is that.?? ITS BECAUSE ITS THE SAME DAMN FERTILIZER WE GROW ALL CROPS WITH.. Uncle U-NO-HOO would not like them going around advertising that the soil is stackin up with radioactive by-products now would he...?!

For a smokeless user, I can only hope that its the combination of FIRE with these chemicals that is complicating matters and that I remain somewhat safer. I HOPE. I TELL MYSELF. Whatever... I may stil get on the SNUS wagon here even though its levels are not much less that copen. Really I think the issue of fertilizer based derivatives soil-to-plant is now what needs to be examined on the snus decision... Still who fuckin knows the radioactive rates inherent to Sweeden considering the fucking Russian sub burning on the bottom of the ocean off the coast of Norway and Chernobyl. Its a shitty world we've fucked ALL UP.... Hopefully its just all going somewhere DEEP and at the equator and degrading peacefully... AND NOT IN MY TUNA DAMNIT.. LOL


I recall some dumbshit from a tobacco distributor tossed me a couple of cans of some cheap nasty shit one morning when I was leaving the gas station. I told him no thanks, "I only dip the good stuff". He advised me "it was all the same as made by the same". I advised him, "whatever..!".... And "retard"(under my breath)....

So from this page - http://www.healthline.com/health-blogs/freedom-smoking/carcinogens-smoking-and-smokeless-tobacco-use-1

Secondly, smokeless tobaccos vary enormously in the amount of toxins (including carcinogens) they deliver, and (not surprisingly) the ones containing higher concentrations of toxins (like carcinogenic tobacco-specific nitrosamines, or benzo(a)pyrene), appear to be more likely to have adverse health effects. To give an idea of the range of concentrations of toxins, Professor Brad Rodu at University of Louisville published data on the concentration of carcinogenic Tobacco-Specific Nitrosamines (TSNAs) in various smokeless tobacco products. Some examples are as follows (the units of measurement are parts per million based on dry weight):

Ariva (new powdered tobacco lozenge): <0.1 ppms
Ettan (Swedish snus): 2.0 ppms
Red Man (US chewing tobacco): 1.8 ppms
Copenhagen (leading US moist snuff): 12.1 ppms
Red Seal (US dry snuff): 1096 ppms


FIRST it should be noted that the Copenhagen is relatively close to the levels in the Swedish SNUS. But look at the red seal shuff (not to be confused with their "dip"..
 
10mgs referring to a dip of a good moist snuff like copen or kodiak. A regular cig is still only 1mg...

I will give you the patch is a shitty feel. But if you recall I pointed that I would suspect failure of the product for behavioral disorder due to the stability of the dosing, and the delay in release as well. Plus it just dont hit the same. Havent figured that one out yet, but something is still missing in the replacement deals.

See my recent post on European SNUS. Apparently they are researching in Sweeden and finding no medical issues, which I suspect is the case for smokless here )short of the cheap shit). KNOCK ON WOOD... But the SNUS has up to 20mgs per gram or PINCH and will flat out blow the black of your head out!!!!!! For that matter, just go get your self some copenhagen long cut (just like said no other concoctions), or Kodiak wintergreen probably preferable. Cause you havn't had a fair sampling of smokeless tobacco experience if you have not tried one of these.

Pop in a SMALL dip. If yur not sittin down scratch yur head within a couple of minutes, then you MAY have issues. LOL But then report back on the seditive qualities.. LOL

I just had a few cigarettes. What I like about the smoking ritual, it is sort of like a "pause button" on life. Unfortunately the cost of smoking will probably keep me from taking up this habit. But i will buy an occasional pack and smoke whenever i feel like it.
 
Rigotti NA. Strategies to Help a Smoker Who Is Struggling to Quit. JAMA. 2012;308(15):1573-1580. JAMA Network | JAMA: The Journal of the American Medical Association | Strategies to Help a Smoker Who Is Struggling to QuitStrategies to Quit Smoking

Tobacco use is the leading preventable cause of death worldwide. Stopping tobacco use benefits virtually every smoker. Most of the 19% of US residents who smoke want to quit and have tried to do so. Most individual quit attempts fail, but two-thirds of smokers use no treatment when trying to quit. Treating tobacco dependence is one of the most cost-effective actions in health care. With a brief intervention, physicians can prompt smokers to attempt to quit and connect them to evidence-based treatment that includes pharmacotherapy and behavioral support (ie, counseling). Physicians can link smokers to effective counseling support offered by a free national network of telephone quit lines. Smokers who use nicotine replacement therapy (NRT), bupropion, or varenicline when trying to quit double their odds of success. The most effective way to use NRT is to combine the long-acting nicotine patch with a shorter-acting product (lozenge, gum, inhaler, or nasal spray) and extend treatment beyond 12 weeks. Observational studies have not confirmed case reports of behavior changes associated with varenicline and bupropion, and these drugs' benefits outweigh potential risks. A chronic disease management model is effective for treating tobacco dependence, which deserves as high a priority in health care systems as treating other chronic diseases like diabetes and hypertension.
 
Do Electronic Cigarettes Really Help Smokers Quit?
The results of the first trials on the efficacy of e-cigarettes are due this year, offering new hope for a stubborn addiction
Do Electronic Cigarettes Really Help Smokers Quit?: Scientific American

Everyone knows that cigarettes are bad for you. Yet 45 million Americans smoke, a habit that shaves a decade off life expectancy and causes cancer as well as heart and lung diseases. Nearly 70 percent of smokers want to quit, but despite the deadly consequences, the vast majority of them fail.

Going cold turkey works for fewer than 10 percent of smokers. Even with counseling and the use of aids approved by the U.S. Food and Drug Administration, such as the nicotine patch and non-nicotine medicines, 75 percent of smokers light up again within a year. “We need better treatments because the current ones just aren’t working all that well,” says Jed Rose, director of the Duke Center for Smoking Cessation.

To create treatments that are more up to snuff, researchers are tinkering with combinations of existing drugs, looking at the role genetics plays in who gets hooked and turning to social media as a counseling platform. What’s more, a new smoking cessation medicine could be approved this year: electronic cigarettes, which have existed for a decade but only recently become the focus of efficacy trials.
 
Chantex made my wife want to kill me no bs and gave me migraine headache for 6 wks F that crap.
After 25 years I quit tobacco cigs in one instant my wife also and about 18 other coworker and friends. Our FIX vapor e cigs is just like smoking the hit, sensation, nicotine need, flavor its great. Its a little battery operated pipe with a small fluid chamber that holds your fake smoke. The fluid is 4 things h20, food glycol, flavor and nicotine . the nicotine comes in 4 mg's 24, 18, 12, 6. There's hundreds of flavors I smoked Newport lights and the match is great. Beside regular tobacco flavor there's things like mint, cookie, cf cheese cake On and on. We have save $350 per month and will soon be completely tobacco and vapor nicotine free.
Can't see another way to quit and after 25 years this is it. Its not one of those electronic e cigerattes at 7/11. They suck and set my sister pocket on fire, funny right. Its a huge thing in Florida now and a very practical way of quitting . and cheap. The thing I believe was $50 and the small eye drop bottle fluid size vapor things are $3 which equals 1 carton of smokes. Just do it . there's actual Vapor Stores and those mall kiosks selling them. Good luck . in all honesty I wasn't looking to quit but more support my wife I'm lucky she brought it home.
 
I've started having a few cigarettes in the evening between 8pm-10pm.

It's sort of a ritual and i enjoy it. Some days I will skip it just to know I can.

My father smoked for about 7 years and then just quit cold turkey when he wanted to. I am similar to him as I quit alcohol cold turkey when I wanted to and i didnt have any issues with it.

I dont find that tobacco has sort of a calming effect. I also like the ritual of it.

It's nice to be out having a cigarette and then seeing a cute girl who is also smoking a cigarette. I dunno what it is but i find cute girls smoking to be fucking sexy. I know i know it's bad blah blah blah but when i see a cute girl sucking down a cigarette i get turned on.

I dunno i enjoy it but a pack for me lasts about a month so by no means am i a hardcore smoker or plan to be.
 
Smoked tons of weed until 3 years ago. Stopped completely. Quit actual smoking after 20 years ish 3 months ago. Just went out for a few beers and had one. Wont be having another, tastes like shite!
 
Smoked tons of weed until 3 years ago. Stopped completely. Quit actual smoking after 20 years ish 3 months ago. Just went out for a few beers and had one. Wont be having another, tastes like shite!

Does it taste like shite? Or does it taste delicious? You know you want that delicious nicotine flooding your system and hitting your dopamine receptors ;) lol

I'm messing with ya. Good on you for quitting. My plan is to smoke for a yr and then quit. I only have a few cigarettes a day and some days (like today probably) i will have none. My achilles heel or weakness seems to be when I see a hot girl smoking. I just get this intense urge to have one. This doesnt happen when I see dudes smoking. lol

I havent seen any cute girls smoking today so i probably wont have one! :)
 
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