Can turinabol cause gynecomastia or not?

[G0ld]

Can someone give me a correct answer to my question? If turinabol is a non-aromatizing steroid, why do some people say it can still cause gynecomastia?

If it's a non-aromatizing steroid, wouldn't that mean it doesn't externally add testosterone to the body, meaning there won't be any extra testosterone to be converted to estrogen, causing elevated estrogen levels?

As far as I know, turinabol suppresses natural T production, meaning hCG is needed during the cycle to prevent testosterone from becoming too low, leading to less aromatization and less estrogen, osteoporosis, etc...

Is my understanding correct? I already asked similar questions a few times, but I only got some jokes and people didn't take me seriously.

I want to make my first steroid cycle but I don't want to risk gynecomastia yet.

 

[I6JQdr06]

Why is he a broccoli head? He asked a question that apparently provokes a societal psychosis on Meso.

It wasn’t his question that people had a problem with. It was the fact that every time someone tried to answer, they were patronised by the OP who very clearly suffers from an advanced case of Dunning Kruger.

He repeatedly told the forum he knows what he’s doing and we don’t need to worry. This left everyone scratching their heads and wondering why he would need to make such an obviously confused post in the first place.

 

[Type-IIx]

But orals do cause suppression? Obviously not as much as a full test cycle and exposure time is worth noting, but it's still going to negatively effect natural hormone production? Or are you saying simply because of the lesser suppression and exposure time the hpg interruption and subsequent fertility concerns are less of an issue?

It's a very perilous myth that has been promulgated that all AAS are equal in suppressive potency or that in order to reduce the harms of suppression you should choose testosterone.

Most orals are actually virtually nonsuppressive at moderate doses, Dbol is however quite suppressive, but less so than testosterone per-mg. 15 mg Dbol (metandienone) is as suppressive as 150 mg Anadrol (oxymetholone).

Nonaromatizable orals vary in suppressive potency.

But none are as suppressive as testosterone. Only MENT is known to be more suppressive than testosterone; that's why it's been trialled (but given up on for a host of reasons) as a potential male contraceptive.

Oral Turinabol (dehydrochloromethyltestosterone) is remakably nonsuppressive at a dose of 20 mg/d, it only decreases LH & FSH by about ~10%, reflecting a minimal decrement in HPG axis functioning.

Anyway, I'm not trying to lecture you bro. I just want to make sure some readers are aware that the current practice of starting with a test cycle is merely axiomatic, something that makes sense for most, but not necessarily every individual case. To be clear, it's what I did 500 mg test, as my first.

Not a valid excuse in me opinion.

Right, but do you see how all of this is really an application of your opinion rather than factual? You are judging an oral only cycle through the lens that everyone wants to be a competitive bodybuilder. But that might not be the case.

Valid for those that compete in non tested events but aren't interested in the long term effects of bore comprehensive cycle design.
Fair point.

Valid I guess for your photo shoot example

I'm against all forms of doping, so I don't consider this a valid excuse on those grounds.
But it's a fair point since you're right, this is the route we commonly see professional athletes taking.





My statement was overly generalized.
I should have said
"There's zero reason for a man to run an oral only cycle for hypertrophy/bodycomp/gym performance purposes."

I respect your opinion, anyway bro! I just did want to interject, that there are in fact some reasons for avoiding an injectable in your cycle.

 

[bigboy420]

I just think these kids just dont wanna pin. The only reason this cycles are even a thing. The point is they are not gonna get as much muscle as they think. The gains will be very small. 3 months after they jump on the pinning. Type-llx is in every thread with orals only and is the only guy supporting.

 

[BigTomJ]

It's a very perilous myth that has been promulgated that all AAS are equal in suppressive potency or that in order to reduce the harms of suppression you should choose testosterone.

Most orals are actually virtually nonsuppressive at moderate doses, Dbol is however quite suppressive, but less so than testosterone per-mg. 15 mg Dbol (metandienone) is as suppressive as 150 mg Anadrol (oxymetholone).

Nonaromatizable orals vary in suppressive potency.

But none are as suppressive as testosterone. Only MENT is known to be more suppressive than testosterone; that's why it's been trialled (but given up on for a host of reasons) as a potential male contraceptive.

Oral Turinabol (dehydrochloromethyltestosterone) is remakably nonsuppressive at a dose of 20 mg/d, it only decreases LH & FSH by about ~10%, reflecting a minimal decrement in HPG axis functioning.

I can respect all that.

And yeah obviously every anabolic agent has a varying level of impact at varying stages, so thats all fair, I just wasn't sure if you were suggesting that there are potential oral only cycle regimen that are entirely non-supressive. Which would have been something I'd never heard of.

When you weigh in on a subject and it sounds wrong to me, I assume I am wrong or am misunderstanding your meaning.
Understanding one limitations in ones understanding is important for greater understanding.

Anyway, I'm not trying to lecture you bro. I just want to make sure some readers are aware that the current practice of starting with a test cycle is merely axiomatic, something that makes sense for most, but not necessarily every individual case. To be clear, it's what I did 500 mg test, as my first.

I figured, I respect the discussions we get to have when they come up.

Right, but do you see how all of this is really an application of your opinion rather than factual? You are judging an oral only cycle through the lens that everyone wants to be a competitive bodybuilder. But that might not be the case.

I respect your opinion, anyway bro! I just did want to interject, that there are in fact some reasons for avoiding an injectable in your cycle.

All fair and good, I spoke in literal absolutes given the general context of the post, and forum in general (we don't see much real sport doping or short term cosmetic talk here that I've seen, it seems like 90% gym bros and 10% bb/pl/strength sports guys) and neglected in considering the niche cases we don't see very often.

 

[Type-IIx]

It wasn’t his question that people had a problem with. It was the fact that every time someone tried to answer, they were patronised by the OP who very clearly suffers from an advanced case of Dunning Kruger.

He repeatedly told the forum he knows what he’s doing and we don’t need to worry. This left everyone scratching their heads and wondering why he would need to make such an obviously confused post in the first place.

It has been my observation that most of what you contribute to this board is motivated by animus, directed variously but with consistent volatility. I haven't been following OP's posts as closely as you have, but he hasn't irritated me in the least.

 

[Spaceman Spiff]

It has been my observation that most of what you contribute to this board is motivated by animus, directed variously but with consistent volatility. I haven't been following OP's posts as closely as you have, but he hasn't irritated me in the least.

This kid is beyond help, doesnt want to listen to anyone.

This is why this is irritating. causes people to waste time

 

[dafqu1]

Feels like everyone that comes in here under 25 has a high chance of being a broccoli head.

Even Sam Sulek(Even though I like him, seems like a good guy/kid)

The Broccoli head Broccoli head emperor
View attachment 271711

anyone as big as sam no longer counts as a broccoli head lol ya this guys great. its crazy how big hes gotten on youtube almost like theres some force pushing him for ulterior motives

 

[laclark89]

It's a very perilous myth that has been promulgated that all AAS are equal in suppressive potency or that in order to reduce the harms of suppression you should choose testosterone.

Most orals are actually virtually nonsuppressive at moderate doses, Dbol is however quite suppressive, but less so than testosterone per-mg. 15 mg Dbol (metandienone) is as suppressive as 150 mg Anadrol (oxymetholone).

Nonaromatizable orals vary in suppressive potency.

But none are as suppressive as testosterone. Only MENT is known to be more suppressive than testosterone; that's why it's been trialled (but given up on for a host of reasons) as a potential male contraceptive.

Oral Turinabol (dehydrochloromethyltestosterone) is remakably nonsuppressive at a dose of 20 mg/d, it only decreases LH & FSH by about ~10%, reflecting a minimal decrement in HPG axis functioning.

Anyway, I'm not trying to lecture you bro. I just want to make sure some readers are aware that the current practice of starting with a test cycle is merely axiomatic, something that makes sense for most, but not necessarily every individual case. To be clear, it's what I did 500 mg test, as my first.

Right, but do you see how all of this is really an application of your opinion rather than factual? You are judging an oral only cycle through the lens that everyone wants to be a competitive bodybuilder. But that might not be the case.

I respect your opinion, anyway bro! I just did want to interject, that there are in fact some reasons for avoiding an injectable in your cycle.

Is dbol the most suppressive oral because its make up, like how it was designed for trt and can act like test and fulfill some of the functions that it does? Or how does that work,

If that's true then in theory u can have a kick ass liver toxic af cycle. Say dbol for ur test base and and anavar or anadrol on top.

 

[Type-IIx]

Is dbol the most suppressive oral because its make up, like how it was designed for trt and can act like test and fulfill some of the functions that it does? Or how does that work,

If that's true then in theory u can have a kick ass liver toxic af cycle. Say dbol for ur test base and and anavar or anadrol on top.

Dbol (metandienone) is basically equivalent to methyltestosterone (MT) in suppressive potency. The two are sterically hindered in vivo (reducing aromatization rate) to the tune of ~65% by the presence of the 17α-methyl group. As such, they only aromatize at ~35% the rate of testosterone (which aromatizes to E2) to 17α-methyl-estrogen (17α-methyl-E).

 

[G0ld]

This isn't that complicated then.
listen to THEM. Do oral only.

Seems like all these posts of oral only thats all what you want to do.

Stop making threads covering over the same topic. You are acting like a little kid bouncing between mommy, daddy, and other adults looking for the answer you want.

I'm trying to determine who is right and who is wrong and what is the right thing to do.

Some people tell me it's ok to do oral steroids only while other people tell me it's not ok. I don't know who is right.

If the main concern is about hepatoxicity, I don't think a cycle of 4 or 8 weeks is long enough to cause significant damage to the liver. Also, the liver is regenerative, which will solve any damage once the cycle ends.

I thought you had all the answers so we don’t have to worry?

I know many of the things, but not all.

You just reminded me, and I should clarify.

There is zero reason for a MAN to use oral only.

I have a reason. Since I will buy steroids from the black market, my fear is that there may be contamination. If I buy injectable with contamination, it will go directly in my bloodstream. If I use contaminated orals, contamination will be neutralized by metabolism and stomach acids.

Also, orals have a shorter half-life, which will help my body get rid of them quickly if something go wrong. With injectables, the half-life is much longer than 8 hours, it could be a whole week.

Turinabol cannot cause gynecomastia.

It can't cause gynecomastia, because it doesn't cause it directly through aromatization. But can it induce certain hormonal imbalances and cause indirectly gynecomastia?

 

[G0ld]

That said, given the post history of the OP, his Tbol is likely fake and actually Dbol.

In for update in 3 weeks when OP has boobies.

I still haven't bought anything. Before I buy something from supposedly legit sources, I want to be sure I'm not about to fuck myself up.

I, personally, do not give two fucks about this poster.

I'm just answering the question. Without downloading my own opinions, convictions, and bullshit onto it.

You are not rude enough. Try harder.

Nah, because it doesn't meaningfully suppress testosterone and therefore estradiol.

If my testosterone levels are average (around 500-700 ng/dL), how much reduction will be caused by 40 or 80 mg of T-bol for 4 or 8 weeks?

I haven't been following OP, I think he's the same guy that asked a question a few days ago I answered.

If he starts repeating himself, he's probably an outright troll, or just became one because it was so easy to provoke this apoplectic response.

But the answer might benefit someone else, is my view.

I'm not a troll... I'm just trying to better my understanding before I proceed to use steroids. I don't want to do the wrong thing and regret later.

The way he types is sus. I dont think i belive his age to be honest

Why? I'm not lying about my age.

I agree with you 100%. But the moment he lied about his age (his profile says 24, he posted 23) and a brief look into his post history, my desire to help went out the window, as he won't listen to a damn word of it lol.

Oral only T bol cycle, or 500mg Testosterone per week, neither is right for OP. He has a hell of a lot more reading to do. I used to spoon feed, till they threw up all over because they didn't actually listen and learn.

In general, I am all for oral only cycles if someone wants to do them. We use to have some beasts on PHF forums back in the day, oral only cycles for legality predominately but plenty of guys who just didn't want to stick a needle in their leg either. No problem with that.

OP needs to read, read some more, make an informed decision on how he wants to proceed and why. If this post even exists, he is not where he needs to be to make that decision.

I'm actually 23 years old, but I usually choose 1999 as a birth year when I create accounts on forums.

As for the informed decision, I'm already familiar with all side effects steroids can cause. There are 2 side effects I'm not ok with, and they are the ones I want to avoid: gynecomastia and osteoporosis. That's why most of my posts are focused on exactly these issues.

 

[BigTomJ]

Okay that's enough.

OP;
Can you run oral only?
Sure you can.

Will you get good results from oral only?
No, you will not.

Is your concern about infection valid?
Yes, is it realistic? No.
So long as you're selecting a reliable source with a good track record and plenty of testing, the chances of you getting an infection due to manufacturing/sterility issues is almost zero. 9/10 infections are a result of user error and not following safe and sterile injection practices.

You won't get gyno from tbol.
You won't gain any noticable muscle from your planned oral only cycle.


Every single one of your questions and concerns has been answered ad nauseum at this point. You are clearly a kid looking for validation rather than advice, so listen to what information you've been told or don't. Regardless if you continue to push the subject, then you're just trolling.

 

[jJjburton]

Okay that's enough.

OP;
Can you run oral only?
Sure you can.

Will you get good results from oral only?
No, you will not.

Is your concern about infection valid?
Yes, is it realistic? No.
So long as you're selecting a reliable source with a good track record and plenty of testing, the chances of you getting an infection due to manufacturing/sterility issues is almost zero. 9/10 infections are a result of user error and not following safe and sterile injection practices.

You won't get gyno from tbol.
You won't gain any noticable muscle from your planned oral only cycle.


Every single one of your questions and concerns has been answered ad nauseum at this point. You are clearly a kid looking for validation rather than advice, so listen to what information you've been told or don't. Regardless if you continue to push the subject, then you're just trolling.

Agreed

 

[lukiss96]

OP you're ungrateful and spoiled kid. Guys genuinely try to help you even if you ask dumb questions. At least be thankful, didn't nobody teach you some manners?

 

[Spaceman Spiff]

It can't cause gynecomastia, because it doesn't cause it directly through aromatization. But can it induce certain hormonal imbalances and cause indirectly gynecomastia?

You are right. @Type-IIx is a moron. He doesn't know what he is talking about.

Dont use tbol. It will cause gyno.

Just run nolvadex 20mg solo and go workout. You won't get gyno for sure.


That's clearly what you want to hear

 

[lukiss96]

Just run nolvadex 20mg solo and go workout. You won't get gyno for sure.

Man you just told him the biggest meso secret...

 

[Dmiran84]

Just do your labs and adjust accordingly and you should never really have any issues that can't be forseen

 

[I6JQdr06]

OK dude. I’m going to spell it out for you.

Tbol might shut down your HPTA after a few weeks, it might after a few years of constant use, and it might not at all. You could be fine or you could stop producing testosterone (and therefore Estrogen and DHT), altogether. Nobody can tell you what will happen.

As far as I’m aware there haven’t been any relevant studies in the public domain on Tbol’s effect on the HPTA so we can only go on what other androgens do. Some are very suppressive and some are less so but they’re all to some extent a risk. I know @Type-IIx is adamant that Tbol won’t shut you down but unless I’ve missed something, he hasn’t cited any sources to back up his claim; it’s just an appeal to authority.

If after your extensive research you’re still not confident about taking steroids safely, then I’d hold off for a decade or so and use them when you actually need them.

 

[MindlessWork]

The OP may well be trolling or just plain ignorant, considering he has several threads on tbol. @Type-IIx has a great answer and he's very knowledgeable. This is just another thread worth 10 facepalms.

 

[Type-IIx]

If my testosterone levels are average (around 500-700 ng/dL), how much reduction will be caused by 40 or 80 mg of T-bol for 4 or 8 weeks?

I wish I could predict this, but I cannot say how dose scales with changes to T, whether it is linear, etc.

I do believe however that if you took a dose of 20 mg daily, that your TT levels would be maintained in the eugonadal range around 450 ng/dL.