buzzingonaas
Well-known Member
Agreed on that, I was dealing with bp that got into the 150s/160s, came off reset, went back on and am taking a good bit more than before and bp has never gotten over 130s and rhr has remained better
MESO-Rx
Anabolic Steroids
ChaseIrons
Member
About 8 years ago the first time i got blood pressure checked when i was on cycle it was 200/120… i was so oblivious. No idea how long it was high or even that high, but it makes sense to me how guys are trashing their health. If you never check it’s really hard to just go by feel. Tren used to be my fav
Do you honestly believe that it's really worth for a gym rat like we are almost all here the difference of a few thousands each month to take pharma gh over a regular generic from a source that has test the products and let's say even you test on more time to be sure?
A pen of genotropin is 75 $ and that is 16 i.u. 160 i.u of generic is around 80$. So almost 10 times more.
In a month the cost for pharma geno is 2250$ and the cost of generic is 240$.
Let's say you get a discount for pharma somehow and you now pay 1900$.
Does pharma make a 1660$ difference or almost 20k in a year of taking the better stuff?
A pen of genotropin is 75 $ and that is 16 i.u. 160 i.u of generic is around 80$. So almost 10 times more.
In a month the cost for pharma geno is 2250$ and the cost of generic is 240$.
Let's say you get a discount for pharma somehow and you now pay 1900$.
Does pharma make a 1660$ difference or almost 20k in a year of taking the better stuff?
Spaceman Spiff
Well-known Member
Some people have money to spend.
Im down to spend the money. My source needs to eat too, atleast I make it easy on them.
Horror Cock
New Member
If you're already soaked in androgens, what is GH supposed to do in addition? Is recovery not good enough on 3 grams a week?
And for those not blasting, the science is there, it's not worth the money if you're chasing gym gains:
Short-term growth hormone treatment does not increase muscle protein synthesis in experienced weight lifters - PubMed
One year of insulin-like growth factor I treatment does not affect bone density, body composition, or psychological measures in postmenopausal women - PubMed
https://www.physiology.org/doi/abs/10.1152/ajpendo.1992.262.3.E261
Effect of growth hormone and resistance exercise on muscle growth and strength in older men - PubMed
Lack of effect of recombinant human growth hormone (GH) on muscle morphology and GH-insulin-like growth factor expression in resistance-trained elderly men - PubMed
GH administration changes myosin heavy chain isoforms in skeletal muscle but does not augment muscle strength or hypertrophy, either alone or combined with resistance exercise training in healthy elderly men - PubMed
(60+ year olds! Minor benefits simply from restoring levels from deficient to normal, not to supraphysiological.) Growth hormone increases muscle mass and strength but does not rejuvenate myofibrillar protein synthesis in healthy subjects over 60 years old - PubMed
The only scenario I can imagine GH resulting in gains is if you only use a preworkout AAS but keep physiologic doses 20 hours of the day outside of the workout to minimize cardiovascular risk. Exercise on AAS to push really far, recovering not on AAS, maybe peptides will matter then with the DOMS and everything.
And for those not blasting, the science is there, it's not worth the money if you're chasing gym gains:
Short-term growth hormone treatment does not increase muscle protein synthesis in experienced weight lifters - PubMed
One year of insulin-like growth factor I treatment does not affect bone density, body composition, or psychological measures in postmenopausal women - PubMed
https://www.physiology.org/doi/abs/10.1152/ajpendo.1992.262.3.E261
Effect of growth hormone and resistance exercise on muscle growth and strength in older men - PubMed
Lack of effect of recombinant human growth hormone (GH) on muscle morphology and GH-insulin-like growth factor expression in resistance-trained elderly men - PubMed
GH administration changes myosin heavy chain isoforms in skeletal muscle but does not augment muscle strength or hypertrophy, either alone or combined with resistance exercise training in healthy elderly men - PubMed
(60+ year olds! Minor benefits simply from restoring levels from deficient to normal, not to supraphysiological.) Growth hormone increases muscle mass and strength but does not rejuvenate myofibrillar protein synthesis in healthy subjects over 60 years old - PubMed
The only scenario I can imagine GH resulting in gains is if you only use a preworkout AAS but keep physiologic doses 20 hours of the day outside of the workout to minimize cardiovascular risk. Exercise on AAS to push really far, recovering not on AAS, maybe peptides will matter then with the DOMS and everything.
I don't know how many gym bros have 20k extra to spend on something useless or almost useless. If they can get the same for 8 times less money.
Even if I would have the extra 20k to pay I would use for cocaine and prostitutes than to pay for nothing. Or gamble that money recklessly. Or give to the homeless. Or church. Or basically anything else.
Average gym guy isn't a rich guy as those guys don't have this hobby that has taken to this magnitude to take 16 i.u of gh and a lot of aas.
Spaceman Spiff
Well-known Member
I completely agree.
Cost vs benefit ratio is in the favor of generics.
It's a luxury that isn't needed. However it is a luxury I would spend.
I think my takeaway from this is there is more to it than simply "purity" by testing.
I hate to say even if I stop serostim(I am sure I eventually will, I just stated). I am gonna run it for atleast a year(7k)
I may go off of feels more than anything for subsequent kits.
buzzingonaas
Well-known Member
obviously he believes it’s worth it otherwise he wouldn’t be taking it and talking about it so much lol, the question is, is it worth it to you? For me personally it’s not, so i’ll take as much generics as I can handle
Very good
buzzingonaas
Well-known Member
I think just putting that number down emphasizes that cost:benefit even more. For 7k, that’s over 20iu daily of some pretty good grey tops. I’m guessing for that 7k youre looking at 4-6ius?
Plate Smacker
Well-known Member
Not that you would do this... but I know some are doing it. I've done it. (Don't do this if your reading this, be smarter)
2g of Test E, but no primo or Mast. for estro control.
I was at 6mg ED Aromasin. Didn't want to thrash my estro, as it helps build mass, but didn't want it sky high. I literally adjusted by nipple sensitivity. Not even blood work. (Silly I know).
Only thing is, if I took 12mg ED of aromasin, I was flat, too dry.(good for a trip to the beach). But also not as strong and pumped. No cushion in bottom of lifts just dried out.
So 6mg Aromasin ED was a good spot. (again, not per bloodwork).
However, stomach bloat was only under control if I ran 12mg Aromasin ED.
Anyone else have that issue when running high Test, with only an AI? Is that why you started running Mast or Primo?
The stomach bloat was tolerable, but not a good look. Uncomfortable at times.
PS: I have Mast Enanthate now, but haven't ran up to 2g in awhile. I ran 1.8g quite awhile back. I have a thread about it.
Once I get back around 245 at lower bodyfat, going to do a 2.4g Test D run with 600 Deca and 600 Mast E.
Test D will be brewed at 400mg/mL. So 3mL E4D (2.4g total in 8 days) I am aware ester weight makes it less potent than Enanthate. Test D is painless.
I will run this about 16 weeks... along with prescribed and other ancillary needed. Actual bloodwork if I do.
But No GH... and that is the kicker. I know GH is next level. I know someone who's kids use GH, norditrope, for their condition, but alot goes to waste. They have like a $3k cap deductible or something for the year. So if I needed some I could get norditrope. Not really a GH guy though. Not even going to pretend like I know much about GH use.
2g of Test E, but no primo or Mast. for estro control.
I was at 6mg ED Aromasin. Didn't want to thrash my estro, as it helps build mass, but didn't want it sky high. I literally adjusted by nipple sensitivity. Not even blood work. (Silly I know).
Only thing is, if I took 12mg ED of aromasin, I was flat, too dry.(good for a trip to the beach). But also not as strong and pumped. No cushion in bottom of lifts just dried out.
So 6mg Aromasin ED was a good spot. (again, not per bloodwork).
However, stomach bloat was only under control if I ran 12mg Aromasin ED.
Anyone else have that issue when running high Test, with only an AI? Is that why you started running Mast or Primo?
The stomach bloat was tolerable, but not a good look. Uncomfortable at times.
PS: I have Mast Enanthate now, but haven't ran up to 2g in awhile. I ran 1.8g quite awhile back. I have a thread about it.
Once I get back around 245 at lower bodyfat, going to do a 2.4g Test D run with 600 Deca and 600 Mast E.
Test D will be brewed at 400mg/mL. So 3mL E4D (2.4g total in 8 days) I am aware ester weight makes it less potent than Enanthate. Test D is painless.
I will run this about 16 weeks... along with prescribed and other ancillary needed. Actual bloodwork if I do.
But No GH... and that is the kicker. I know GH is next level. I know someone who's kids use GH, norditrope, for their condition, but alot goes to waste. They have like a $3k cap deductible or something for the year. So if I needed some I could get norditrope. Not really a GH guy though. Not even going to pretend like I know much about GH use.
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brutalbuilt
Member
uhmmm its called hyperplasia... do more research bud
Mostly people take mast or primo nowadays because is something that is in trend,goes in fashion. Not for estrogen.
Like 5-7 years ago was tren,then only deca cycle, then dnp,then ment and now is primo or mast. 5-7 years ago no one took primo.
For test d I take 10% more than I would with test c or e to be like I take test c but pin less oil. That's how I calculate my dosage on test d.
For the future I want to give test iso a try as is 74 mg/ml compared to test d 62 mg/ml and theoretical can be brew at 300 or 350 mg but I don't know how pip is at that concentration. And shorter esters I feel them differently but the end results are the same.
connoristiny
New Member
solid point for discussion
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connoristiny
New Member
what u runnin now? still blasting?
AlexDavis43
Member
Thanks for taking the time to post that. Appreciated.
ChaseIrons
Member
Makes sense. Gh sucks. Everyone should stop taking it.
Horror Cock
New Member
The list of links was mostly copied from someone else's post. And what meant with the PWO AAS of course could only be no esters, either intravenous or intranasal and sublingual for the shortest onset and elimination which I'm really trying to develop a technique with.
Plate Smacker
Well-known Member
Most likely placebo effect. Cell-tech was the real driving force behind mass monsters. Worked so well, now it's the big secret nobody mentions. IYKYK
5-7 years ago no one took primo? Not sure about that. I've been using it since the days of the Schering Spain Primo amps. The reason its so popular now is because it works, and its readily available without the number of counterfeits there used to be. Years ago there were no UGL's that had real primo, and that isn't the case today.
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