How important is protein

[malfeasance]

To go further on his last sentence, essential amino acids are amino acids that the body cannot create through biochemistry. They must be eaten. The body also does not store them for later use. If you need them, you must have eaten them relatively recently. Better to eat a surplus of them and have then available whenever needed.

Your body uses essential amino acids for all body tissues, not just muscles. It will literally pull amino acids from the muscle if needed for more important organs. Better to have eaten them and have them available than to have them robbed from the muscle.

Steroids help you retain muscle, as does insulin. Nevertheless, muscles breakdown (catabolism) and are rebuilt constantly, in small amounts, everyday. You need sufficient essential amino acids available every day.

https://journals.physiology.org/doi/full/10.1152/japplphysiol.91375.2008

 

[MuscleFreak]

Don’t carbs store more water than fat? Shouldn’t it be the other way around where less carbs means more dryness?

Yes they do,but water inside the muscle.. electrolytes play the big part and also don't spill over too much

 

[malfeasance]

I am glad BigRed91 asked this question back in April. Now we have 4-5 pages of excellent material, research results, real world experience of bodybuilders, and courteous exchanges of ideas and information.

If only everything on the internet were like this thread.

 

[LiftAR]

When people ask me how much protein I consume I wanna smack them one. Cause its not about protein.. Its about CALORIES.

I know morons who waste so much money trying to eat 300-400g of protein a day and make NO CHANGE. Because in reality 300G of protein is only 1200 calories..

I cut on 120g protein and 2300 calories and lost fuck all muscle. I bulk on 4000 and I wouldn't even know how much protein I eat because I don't need to count it, because this "1- 2g per lb" or "300-400g ed " is fucking broscience.

My buddy won a powerlifting meet, all natty, 475lb deadlift RAW @ 164. Eating nothing but 3 cups of oatmeal a day and 3 tablespoons of olive oil with each meal.. Not much protein? He got leaner and stronger. Dont get me wrong, I guess it all works together... But in the end.. Calories Calories Calories.

 

[malfeasance]

When people ask me how much protein I consume I wanna smack them one. Cause its not about protein.. Its about CALORIES.

I know morons who waste so much money trying to eat 300-400g of protein a day and make NO CHANGE. Because in reality 300G of protein is only 1200 calories..

I cut on 120g protein and 2300 calories and lost fuck all muscle. I bulk on 4000 and I wouldn't even know how much protein I eat because I don't need to count it, because this "1- 2g per lb" or "300-400g ed " is fucking broscience.

My buddy won a powerlifting meet, all natty, 475lb deadlift RAW @ 164. Eating nothing but 3 cups of oatmeal a day and 3 tablespoons of olive oil with each meal.. Not much protein? He got leaner and stronger. Dont get me wrong, I guess it all works together... But in the end.. Calories Calories Calories.

You might want to review what has already been posted in the thread, broscience and non-broscience alike prior to making such declarations. Nobody here is suggesting bulking on only 1200 calories. Nor is this thread devoid of actual science.

 

[MuscleFreak]

When people ask me how much protein I consume I wanna smack them one. Cause its not about protein.. Its about CALORIES.

I know morons who waste so much money trying to eat 300-400g of protein a day and make NO CHANGE. Because in reality 300G of protein is only 1200 calories..

I cut on 120g protein and 2300 calories and lost fuck all muscle. I bulk on 4000 and I wouldn't even know how much protein I eat because I don't need to count it, because this "1- 2g per lb" or "300-400g ed " is fucking broscience.

My buddy won a powerlifting meet, all natty, 475lb deadlift RAW @ 164. Eating nothing but 3 cups of oatmeal a day and 3 tablespoons of olive oil with each meal.. Not much protein? He got leaner and stronger. Dont get me wrong, I guess it all works together... But in the end.. Calories Calories Calories.

So 1200kcal coming from protein is the same like 1200 coming from fat? I would say big bs.
Yes it's all energy but body use them differently. Carbs will be stored as glycogen, protein will be stored as muscle when protein synthesis happens or glycogen if we eat too much,fats will be stored as fat.

 

[Mac11wildcat]

You do you, I guess. Can’t teach those that don’t want to be taught.

 

[Cdave.aol]

You do you, I guess. Can’t teach those that don’t want to be taught.

What do you think about @Andrew Rutter post?

 

[Mac11wildcat]

What do you think about @Andrew Rutter post?

That’s what I was replying to. I’ve seen it with clients. Cals are not it. Cals are the base of the pyramid. If that’s all you can control, do it. But macros make a difference. Period.

 

[LiftAR]

If I were to eat 6 McDouble cheeseburgers ONLY for a day, which lets say comes to around 2700kcal and I was to eat 2700kcal of chicken breast, veggies and rice. There would be NO difference in my body composition. I would get shredded with either diet. I'd just be lacking micronutrients, obviously.. Diet means nothing besides health.

You don't need anywhere near as much protein as you think, ESPECIALLY when running AAS. Ronnie Coleman, Pro BBers or even people on here with high credentials would still get shredded eating foods like honey buns, pizzas, McDonald's etc. Because of the amount of drugs these guys run, some even cut on 3500-4000 calories a day due to certain compounds and the nutrient partitioning lol.

You can be eating 50+ grams of protein per meal, you can prioritise your carbs, you can be anal about your fats, sip your eaa's all day, eat 12x a day.. Whatever the fuck. But guess what? Keep doing all of that and drop the steroids and peptides and watch yourself shrink like a dying weed because non of that shit works any better than just eating what you want.

Bodybuilding is all about genetics, training, hormones and controlling calories. It's not a sport, it's a beauty contest. A pretty easy one at that, it's just the bro turds and sell outs and crap coaches that make it all sound complicated.

 

[Cdave.aol]

That’s what I was replying to. I’ve seen it with clients. Cals are not it. Cals are the base of the pyramid. If that’s all you can control, do it. But macros make a difference. Period.

Someone in this thread mentioned about high fat diets being detrimental to body composition. Why is that?

 

[Bumpygooch]

Please don’t feed the troll

 

[LiftAR]

Please don’t feed the troll

Shut up.

 

[Mac11wildcat]

Someone in this thread mentioned about high fat diets being detrimental to body composition. Why is that?

Probably because fat is twice as calorie dense as the other two macros

 

[Sampei]

The thread is interesting but have you seen Patrick Tuor athletes, some are fucking huge and ripped and they have won quite a lot.... The guy knows is shit and yes he prefer medium-low protein and very high carb at least compared to the many suggestions of 350-500 p a day. He is against insulin use as well, I have been two few of his seminaries, don't think he is the truth walking on earth but he definitely knows what's he is doing or his athletes wouldn't do so well I guess...

So where the truth lay?

 

[Mac11wildcat]

The thread is interesting but have you seen Patrick Tuor athletes, some are fucking huge and ripped and they have won quite a lot.... The guy knows is shit and yes he prefer medium-low protein and very high carb at least compared to the many suggestions of 350-500 p a day. He is against insulin use as well, I have been two few of his seminaries, don't think he is the truth walking on earth but he definitely knows what's he is doing or his athletes wouldn't do so well I guess...

So where the truth lay?

Every body is different. However, if you think Patrick is telling you everything he does in an e-seminar you’re being led astray. Visually on his clients, I definitely doubt he doesn’t use slin.

the end of the day y’all need to experiment. Implementing a plan from a well known coach built for someone else could be useful or be the worst possible design for your body. Get consistent and start to modulate variables and see how it goes.

perhaps the most important point here: you’re pretty much only ever going to see a coach‘s most successful clients. I don’t dislike that, it’s exactly what I’d do. But you are not seeing everything and a coach like PTuor is grabbing ELITE talent. Take that into consideration.

 

[Sampei]

Every body is different. However, if you think Patrick is telling you everything he does in an e-seminar you’re being led astray. Visually on his clients, I definitely doubt he doesn’t use slin.

the end of the day y’all need to experiment. Implementing a plan from a well known coach built for someone else could be useful or be the worst possible design for your body. Get consistent and start to modulate variables and see how it goes.

perhaps the most important point here: you’re pretty much only ever going to see a coach‘s most successful clients. I don’t dislike that, it’s exactly what I’d do. But you are not seeing everything and a coach like PTuor is grabbing ELITE talent. Take that into consideration.

I mostly believe there are different approaches maybe both would work well maybe not.

About having elite talent I do agree, probably most of those athlete would do good anyway ahaha

 

[Mac11wildcat]

I mostly believe there are different approaches maybe both would work well maybe not.

About having elite talent I do agree, probably most of those athlete would do good anyway ahaha

Exactly.

 

[Sampei]

Exactly.

Do you have cheat day during bulking? I have seen your carb cycling approach and I wonder how do you manage your weekly calories intake during bulk, do you cheat or not? Or do you try to fit the cheat meal/day into the daily calories?


I always had this doubt during bulk, during cut its easy, you starve yourself kinda during the week and you can do one or two cheat meal depends of your goals etc. (Not talking about getting ripped for a competition of course).

But during bulk you are already in a surplus so cheat meal/day could drastically increase the weekly calories and they are not really needed for the body (you are not in a deficit, no refeed needed) but are mostly done for my mental sanity.

 

[Mac11wildcat]

Do you have cheat day during bulking? I have seen your carb cycling approach and I wonder how do you manage your weekly calories intake during bulk, do you cheat or not? Or do you try to fit the cheat meal/day into the daily calories?


I always had this doubt during bulk, during cut its easy, you starve yourself kinda during the week and you can do one or two cheat meal depends of your goals etc. (Not talking about getting ripped for a competition of course).

But during bulk you are already in a surplus so cheat meal/day could drastically increase the weekly calories and they are not really needed for the body (you are not in a deficit, no refeed needed) but are mostly done for my mental sanity.

I have a family so I do eat off plan fairly regularly unless I’m in prep. I don’t think cheats are any more necessary in dieting than on bulking. They’re primarily a mental break from the monotony of the same food every meal every day. Physique wise, a single meal serves very little purpose.

the best offseason I ever had was just as strict as my prep though.
they should be less of a derailment bulking than dieting as people tend to binge when cutting, not stuffing their face to grow.