Perrin Aybara
Master
I wouldn't let the reps get grindy, deload if you need it, no need to get hurt.
MESO-Rx
Anabolic Steroids
Meso Powerlifting Corner
- Thread starter jaymaximus
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I've read some if his stuff but what in particular interests you? What are you looking to read about?
bhog
New Member
I hit the gym as its my stress relief but there's times when I just go half assed and end up calling it a day. I'm on my feet all day and have a pretty strenuous job( carpentry) so if I don't take something to get me going I don't have much left in the tank.
Perrin Aybara
Master
@RodgerThat you didn't get where you are being lazy. You know your body and your training well enough to know if you should push on through or take a step back. Risk versus reward. As long as it's not an excuse to slack there's no shame in it.
A few weeks back my shoulder was killing me and I took a week off bench. The very next training day after deciding this I hurt my knee doing high bar squats. This was around eight weeks into cycle, too, gains were coming on strong and it was hard to take a week off both lifts. I did though and pretty much did chin ups and deadlifts that whole week. I'm still hitting massive PRs on all lifts now. Had I tried to push it I may have ended up out of commission for weeks or months. Or I might not have, not worth the risk to me though.
A few weeks back my shoulder was killing me and I took a week off bench. The very next training day after deciding this I hurt my knee doing high bar squats. This was around eight weeks into cycle, too, gains were coming on strong and it was hard to take a week off both lifts. I did though and pretty much did chin ups and deadlifts that whole week. I'm still hitting massive PRs on all lifts now. Had I tried to push it I may have ended up out of commission for weeks or months. Or I might not have, not worth the risk to me though.
TANGO.ECHO.KILO
Member
I'm trying to get a better understanding of autoregulation in velocity based training and some of his work is just really complicated. I see the value, but I'm struggling to understand practical application in regards to development of different types of strength. I see all the numbers, the science is there, but it's just way over my head..
Where do you start when you are attempting to measure/track analytics on your own? Should I just pickup a Gymaware and go for it?
I'm trying to get a better understanding of autoregulation in velocity based training and some of his work is just really complicated. I see the value, but I'm struggling to understand practical application in regards to development of different types of strength. I see all the numbers, the science is there, but it's just way over my head..
Where do you start when you are attempting to measure/track analytics on your own? Should I just pickup a Gymaware and go for it?
http://www.jtsstrength.com/articles/2015/02/16/use-velocity-based-training-programming-performance/
http://www.strengtheory.com/complete-guide-to-bar-speed-trackers/
RodgerThat
New Member
Thanks man it's a good point, I'm not looking for an excuse or to be lazy just a bit difficult to keep my mind on task right now. I'll go for a Deload week and just try and use the gym for purely enjoyment for the next couple weeks and get back into training once everything rolls over. Appreciate the words of wisdom man.
TANGO.ECHO.KILO
Member
Have used the gymaware system? Pricey set-up..Just to get a single system after the ipad, licensing, and shipping you got a tag of about $2300
Have used the gymaware system? Pricey set-up..Just to get a single system after the ipad, licensing, and shipping you got a tag of about $2300
I'll likely try that system out after winning the lotto or selling a kidney lol. I'm going to do some searching around here and see if any training facilities have something similar. That's a fuckload of money though.
The second link offers some cheaper alternatives. I'm sure they don't include all the bells and whistles but unless you have a coach well, WELL versed in this you won't need such luxuries for the most part lol
TANGO.ECHO.KILO
Member
I actually read that guide when I was exploring options.
Do you believe periodization as we know it is antiquated? This is the future no? This technology is not new by any means, it's existed on campuses and military bases for some time now. But the interfaces, compact equipment, and portability have become much more user friendly and now are at least in the realm of availability from an economical standpoint.
weighted chinup
Well-known Member
For top level athletes this seems like where training should go moving forward, assuming it's not already been realized by coaches in different sports. But the average athlete who isn't at the top caliber of his sport or potential probably doesn't need or substantially benefit from such an extremely personalized approach to training that regulates variables based on feedback / computer analysis of their performance.
Just look at how many lifters and athletes can still make gains off traditional linear periodization programs, despite LP being considered antiquated ever since the soviets started using mixed qualities training in the 70's or earlier.
I do think better auto-regulation techniques in training is something the majority of lifters can benefit from and more programs should implement techniques the athlete can use to auto-regulate that can be taught or learned easily, but having that level of analytics and feedback is probably not necessary for the vast majority of lifters.
I believe VBT can be an important component of a periodized training program. It can't antiquate periodization bc all it is is another way to periodize training.
Is it the future? It sure has the potential to be if utilized intelligently. Much more research needs to be done though as it still is relatively new compared to our other styles of periodization. I don't think it can replace a good coach but put this tool in a competent coach's hands and you will have the makings of a world class athlete IMO.
Just check the link doc. That some pretty cool stuff.
It's def an interesting field. I hadn't thought about it for a while now until TEK brought it up again.
weighted chinup
Well-known Member
I agree. I think when people refer to periodization being out-dated they are referring to a basic non personalized approach to a high level athletes training or they are referring to the fact that the traditional LP model is outdated, which it is, but that is the old non-concurrent approach to training qualities by Matveyev that most people don't really follow anymore from what I've seen.
This idea is nothing new at all and the flaws with how periodization is commonly implemented in programs for athletes in sport have been known about for a very long time.
Verkoshansky;
http://www.salisbury.edu/sportsperformance/Articles/THE END OF PERIODIZATION - VERHOSHANSKY.pdf
The only difference is the new tech available that gives more analysis / feedback. The soviets thought of the rest.
TANGO.ECHO.KILO
Member
right! This is where I'm at...I guess maybe my original question was too wordy. So do you have any ideas/references/reading material where one could start to delve into incorporating these methods into programming WITHOUT the expensive of spending a small fortune to set up a system of this caliber?
The upside is...should one bite the bullet and go in that direction with a system like the gymaware. You could save/archive/upload your data and send it to whomever/wherever virtually instantaneously...this is very attractive for someone like me that routinely trains alone or has to travel long distances to train with other resources. Especially now that I'm settling back in to my very rural setting
TANGO.ECHO.KILO
Member
exactly.I agree. I think when people refer to periodization being out-dated they are referring to a basic non personalized approach to a high level athletes training or they are referring to the fact that the traditional LP model is outdated, which it is, but that is the old non-concurrent approach to training qualities by Matveyev that most people don't really follow anymore from what I've seen.
This idea is nothing new at all and the flaws with how periodization is commonly implemented in programs for athletes in sport have been known about for a very long time.
Verkoshansky;
http://www.salisbury.edu/sportsperformance/Articles/THE END OF PERIODIZATION - VERHOSHANSKY.pdf
The only difference is the new tech available that gives more analysis / feedback. The soviets thought of the rest.
Wow thank you for that, that's a way more well phrased explanation than I would have mustered. I was kinda referring to the fact that at least in my background, basically everything I ever learned/accepted to be true was the eastern bloc methodologies. I mean this was the gold standard at the time no? I'm not very knowledgeable on this side of it, I've been spoon fed everything from day 1. But recently as I've been trying to expand my horizons I really started noticing that much of what I was taught all comes from those old school mentality type trainers/coaches. It's effective for sure, but I want to learn what else is out there to make sure I'm not shortchanging myself by just sticking in the same old habits. I mix it up a little bit, but truthfully my training has changed much in the course of a decade.
right! This is where I'm at...I guess maybe my original question was too wordy. So do you have any ideas/references/reading material where one could start to delve into incorporating these methods into programming WITHOUT the expensive of spending a small fortune to set up a system of this caliber?
The upside is...should one bite the bullet and go in that direction with a system like the gymaware. You could save/archive/upload your data and send it to whomever/wherever virtually instantaneously...this is very attractive for someone like me that routinely trains alone or has to travel long distances to train with other resources. Especially now that I'm settling back in to my very rural setting
Are you asking about training protocols using the technology or about the technology itself and where to get it cheaper than that $2300 setup?
weighted chinup
Well-known Member
right! This is where I'm at...I guess maybe my original question was too wordy. So do you have any ideas/references/reading material where one could start to delve into incorporating these methods into programming WITHOUT the expensive of spending a small fortune to set up a system of this caliber?
The upside is...should one bite the bullet and go in that direction with a system like the gymaware. You could save/archive/upload your data and send it to whomever/wherever virtually instantaneously...this is very attractive for someone like me that routinely trains alone or has to travel long distances to train with other resources. Especially now that I'm settling back in to my very rural setting
There are techniques out there for auto-regulating training variables that don't require a shit load of analysis / information. Some simply go by how you feel.
For strength training you can use the RPE scale instead of strict percentages. This is new to me but it's pretty genius.
I'm sure there are other auto-regulating techniques for different kinds of sport specific training like for sprint training for example that can be learned fairly easily that aren't incredibly complex, but unfortunately I'm not aware of any.
I'm not sure about auto regulating for the oly lifts, if you mange weekly volume wisely by using something like Prilepin's chart it might not be necessary, but if you're training has other components like yours than auto-regulation might become neccesary since you have other stresses involved as well in training. I'm not aware of any specific techniques. I would imagine a lot of oly lifting programming techniques is based on Russian methodology, where you have a certain percentage of 1rm to do and if you don't get it because you're tired, low on calories, feel like shit, then it was pretty much a pointless workout.
Still is.
I would imagine the ideas that became available after the Soviet union fell and all of that knowledge became available for the rest of world is still easily or somewhat recognizable in the training of top level athletes, in some form or another. These guys pretty much wrote the books on biomechanics in sports / athletes, so hey....TANGO.ECHO.KILO
Member
Boom. There it is...
I set a 1 rep max and then programming is done from usually 90-150 days based on said maxes. On a 5 month program usually halfway I will re-establish my standards but still. This seems like a potential pitfall? Besides like you mentioned this doesn't account for other stressors some as simple as sleep, work, school, life, emotional well being etc. So if in 3-4 weeks your 1rm has not increased, yet the bar speed has significantly improved, how do you measure and account for this progress? this is where the analytics come in?
I've been going on "feel" for a long time. Although I'm making progress everyone's goal is to make the most significant improvements for the amount of work/effort put in
I simply do not know, what I don't know...I wanna see what else is out there.
If you guys were to design a mutli-faceted program to increase power and improve athletic performance... how would you start to establish the balance between your strength training based workouts and speed/agility training? I think this is where I'm most interested in exploring auto-regulation and how it could potentially fit into this model. Idk if this makes any sense at all but maybe if I laid out kind of a proposed plan of at least the elements involved.
Say you runa push/pull split.
Do you have 1 push day a week/1 pull day a week with strength emphasis training in the 1-3 rep range. Then incorporate 2 platform days for your speed/explosiveness working in the 5 rep range?
M Push
Tu Platform
Th Pull
Fri Platform
Or do you do 2 push days/2 pull days but you incorporate your olympic lifts into the appropriate days?
M Push /OHP/jerk/squat/bench
Tu Pull /rows/clean/pullup/snatch/DL
etc.....
Now you gotta through one day a week in for plyos/heavy stretching/sport specific training/HIIT cardio. I've always made it Weds with an optional accessory day Sat....
sorry if I'm rambling. I don't have enough knowledge to accurately convey the questions I'm trying to ask.
Imma go read the rest of the internet..brb
