Planning a cycle for a fuck load of mass (health is not an object here)

[Eddie.]

I am really trying to picture this....

Don't be so hard on yourself.
I know you guys get a little obsessive with this stuff, but you have done so amazing, so far.
I am not sure what the much lusted after sub 10% would mean for you, in reality.
Maybe it's like a challenge. But how relevant is to the way you perceive yourself?

Honestly, in terms of physique change and improvements i'm totally happy. I'm about to just fall in the bodyfat trap that everyone's talking about, like the sub 10% is the only way to go in bulk and if you can't start from there you're just a lazy fakk with diet problems. Anyway, i think i already spent too much energy on what other's opinion is about this, in 2 weeks i'm ending my cut and i'm gonna enjoy my cruise. Cheers

 

[Enjoythements]

I recommend aiming for high singles or 10% bf for several reasons. Firstly, many people tend to underestimate their body fat, often thinking they are around 9-10% when they are actually closer to 15%. It's more about body composition than just body fat, but mentioning body fat provides a simpler reference point.

Starting lean offers significant advantages. When someone begins at 15% body fat, they have less room to gain fat, thus keeping their "growth phase" short.

Additionally, there are numerous benefits to starting lean as @BigTomJ mentioned, such as reduced inflammation, improved insulin sensitivity, better cardiovascular health, fewer side effects from AAS/HGH, improved digestion, easier differentiation between fat and water weight, better nutrient partitioning, ...

From personal experience, starting lean versus chubby or fat makes a substantial difference. Both approaches can yield results, but starting lean is generally more effective, which is why many coaches ensure their athletes maintain low double-digit body fat percentages. Keep in mind that there's a clear distinction between being bloated and being fat.

Paraphrasing Justin Harris, he said that this is one reason why bodybuilders make significant gains once they turn pro. They compete in several shows per year, stay lean, and maximize the rebound phase, unlike amateurs who might only compete once a year.

 

[BigTomJ]

Nice brother, appreciate the feedback. I just can't deal with all that stuff being said about not being healthy if you're trying to grow at 12-14% bf.

Assuming you monitor e2, blood pressure, insulin sensitivity and all the health markers, what's so different between bulking at 8% vs 14% except that you'll end up a little chubbier?

I mean, i get it..bodybuilding is based primarily on how you look, and if you get chubbier this negates the purpose to some extend but if you're not planning to permabulk and after a slighty cruise you start cutting again, what's so wrong?

I asked some experts and honestly i was expecting a more detailed response. Or maybe they're right and i need to diet harder on 1500cals and 90 minutes cardio per day to get there lol

I respect kurts opinion and stance, hes far more knowledgeable than i am and hes been doing it for a long time.

I agree there really isnt any real reason to be above single digits, but i also dont believe there is any real harm in low teens.

Ive tried maintaining single digits in the past and while i looked great and grew well, my day to day wellbeing just didnt feel as comfortable as 12-13%.
I am not someone who has a really strong appetite, so being hungry is never an issue, but i have found that my gym performance was slightly less when i maintained a leaner bodyfat than i am now and i was getting minor injuries and tweaks more often.

like i said, ive tried single digits, ive tried force feeding and really pushing the food up to the mid-high teens bf, and 12-13ish% just seems to be the sweet spot where everything seems to click the best to grow.

its also worth noting that my position is that of a bodybuilder on an extended offseason (several years) to make targeted improvements.
If i was seasonally competing i would prefer to maintain a lower bf just to make the prep less extreme.

 

[Goingstronger]

Trenbolone in doses exceeding 1g per week along with sports TRT doses will elicit transcriptional lasting changes in size, body composition and body definition that remain unmatched by any other compound.

You only have to endure a Tren permablast for 12 to 24 months and choose to never use it again if you will.

I see it with most my clients, such a regimen with progressive overload and muscle periodization will catalyze permanent mutations.

 

[Liter O' Test]

Trenbolone in doses exceeding 1g per week along with sports TRT doses will elicit transcriptional lasting changes in size, body composition and body definition that remain unmatched by any other compound.

You only have to endure a Tren permablast for 12 to 24 months and choose to never use it again if you will.

I see it with most my clients, such a regimen with progressive overload and muscle periodization will catalyze permanent mutations.

Gonna pass on that. Don't wanna cover my windows in tin foil

 

[BigTomJ]

Trenbolone in doses exceeding 1g per week along with sports TRT doses will elicit transcriptional lasting changes in size, body composition and body definition that remain unmatched by any other compound.

You only have to endure a Tren permablast for 12 to 24 months and choose to never use it again if you will.

I see it with most my clients, such a regimen with progressive overload and muscle periodization will catalyze permanent mutations.

this might be crazy of me to say, but im going to completely disregard any information coming from someone unironically advocating for 1g+ of tren for any period of time, much less two years straight.

 

[youwhat?]

Trenbolone in doses exceeding 1g per week along with sports TRT doses will elicit transcriptional lasting changes in size, body composition and body definition that remain unmatched by any other compound.

You only have to endure a Tren permablast for 12 to 24 months and choose to never use it again if you will.

I see it with most my clients, such a regimen with progressive overload and muscle periodization will catalyze permanent mutations.

Wtf

 

[29trt]

Trenbolone in doses exceeding 1g per week along with sports TRT doses will elicit transcriptional lasting changes in size, body composition and body definition that remain unmatched by any other compound.

You only have to endure a Tren permablast for 12 to 24 months and choose to never use it again if you will.

I see it with most my clients, such a regimen with progressive overload and muscle periodization will catalyze permanent mutations.

definetly elicits permanent changes at those doses and duration... like permanent kidney damage and liver tumors and permanent early death in some individuals

definetly gonna try it next blast, on 450mg I was already heating my house during the winter from excessive body heat, 1g I will shovel snow with no shovel

 

[narta]

1g I will shovel snow with no shovel

Coffee just went off from my nostrils mfkr!

 

[Goingstronger]

this might be crazy of me to say, but im going to completely disregard any information coming from someone unironically advocating for 1g+ of tren for any period of time, much less two years straight.

Your loss

 

[Goingstronger]

permanent kidney damage

You must be thinking of Mtren

liver tumors

You are definitely thinking of Mtren

definetly gonna try it next blast, on 450mg I was already heating my house during the winter from excessive body heat, 1g I will shovel snow with no shovel

Let me know how it goes

 

[Jsdaking1]

1g tren and beyong is totally moronic, and for all I know, for a bunch of gym rats that don't even compete. But who cares honestly, how much time you got in this planet right? Better be looking huge walking around costco

 

[DECLAN]

1g tren and beyong is totally moronic, and for all I know, for a bunch of gym rats that don't even compete. But who cares honestly, how much time you got in this planet right? Better be looking huge walking around costco

I don’t understand why those who compete can use that much? Do they suddenly magically tolerate it better than a regular joe blow or a powerlifter ?

Why do people always parrot this notion? Do trying to win a plastic trophy or a fake gold medal give you special rights to use steroids?

Just asking here, nothing more.

 

[Juicedhead]

I don’t understand why those who compete can use that much? Do they suddenly magically tolerate it better than a regular joe blow or a powerlifter ?

Why do people always parrot this notion? Do trying to win a plastic trophy or a fake gold medal give you special rights to use steroids?

Just asking here, nothing more.

1 gram of tren is nutty. But Nathan de Asha did a a and a and he said he cruises on 1 gram tren.

 

[DECLAN]

1 gram of tren is nutty. But Nathan de Asha did a a and a and he said he cruises on 1 gram tren.

One gram is definitely crazy, some can’t even handle even 100mg per week. But I’m still amazed why competitors are given a pass to use this harsh compound because they are chasing a throphy.

 

[Sector]

Yeah 1g tren isn't worth it. I've done it before. Not worth it. The sides are just brutal, mentally, physically. Plus the health factors.

I like it at 350-525 a week on ace, or 400-600 a week with enanthate (accounting for ester weight). Sides still suck, but not nearly as much suck as 1g

Training takes a nose dive too when you're on higher tren, especially with hgh in the mix. You're not sleeping well, add in gh lethargy, and it's just rough.

 

[iris]

One gram is definitely crazy, some can’t even handle even 100mg per week. But I’m still amazed why competitors are given a pass to use this harsh compound

What about your compatriot C Bum and his kidneys condition?
He didn’t shy away from taking it, over the years he has been competing.
I often wondered how on earth he could manage all the drug taking in relation to that, as a lot of these substances could cause more damage/issues to the autoimmune disease he has.
Obviously, they have access to medical care and screening that we mere mortals lack.
Was it something he was born with or do you think it is possible he developed it later in life, maybe after being exposed to peds?

 

[youwhat?]

I don’t understand why those who compete can use that much? Do they suddenly magically tolerate it better than a regular joe blow or a powerlifter ?

Why do people always parrot this notion? Do trying to win a plastic trophy or a fake gold medal give you special rights to use steroids?

Just asking here, nothing more.

I’m right there with you. I think it’s a dumb argument. I also believe it’s stupid all around lol. For me, a gram of tren would be a nightmare in a vial, not so much mentally but the toll it takes on the body. It’s simply not worth it to me. I have a little boy I need to be healthy for for years to come.

I don’t think competitors get a pass per se, but rarely are they ever truthful about what they’re actually using lol. When a pro talks about their doses, triple it. I give a tiny bit more leeway to people who make a living out of this, but not too much. Can’t enjoy the money if you can’t function properly.

 

[Juicedhead]

Yeah 1g tren isn't worth it. I've done it before. Not worth it. The sides are just brutal, mentally, physically. Plus the health factors.

I like it at 350-525 a week on ace, or 400-600 a week with enanthate (accounting for ester weight). Sides still suck, but not nearly as much suck as 1g

Training takes a nose dive too when you're on higher tren, especially with hgh in the mix. You're not sleeping well, add in gh lethargy, and it's just rough.

Yeah i noticed I am lazy in the gym and just more lazy overall on tren. Its weird I dont get insomnia or night sweats tho, just more mental issues with my mood and energy. I know most guys will end up tapping on tren due to the sleep issues.

 

[Juicedhead]

I don’t understand why those who compete can use that much? Do they suddenly magically tolerate it better than a regular joe blow or a powerlifter ?

Why do people always parrot this notion? Do trying to win a plastic trophy or a fake gold medal give you special rights to use steroids?

Just asking here, nothing more.

I know ive always been wondering the same thing. I meet guys who cant wait to start prep so they can get on tren dude told me he pushes up to 1 gram on prep and was excited about it. Idk if its something to do with being in a deficit but I think its something to do with how the body metabolizes gear when youre on prep, doing tons of cardio, and are in a deficit. I could be completly wrong here but it seems guys push doses higher and are able to handle more on prep. Obvious reasons to push higher but idk how they are able to tolerate that shit. Like chase irons dude literally runs grams and grams of gear and can somehow function in his day to day WITH like 20iu pharma growth. Insane to me.