TSL LABS

[Docd187123]

It wasn't even 24 hours, but that's a shame. I should've known better than to pin. I really wanted to know my base levels.

Like RogerRabbit said, as soon as you inject, your body starts hydrolyzing the ester so it can be active in circulation. With a 500mg pin I'd expect much higher than 11XX that you got so it probably released enough to raise your levels over baseline but not enough for a true peak reading.

 

[Roger rabbit]

But OGH's bloods don't prove what you're saying. You don't have a baseline lab showing lower or higher free test with the corresponding lower or higher total test. His one lab doesn't prove anything in regards to our discussion.

The testosterone that's been attached to the AR is not spent up. Once testosterone binds to the AR and transcription takes place, the testosterone molecule dissociates from the AR and is then free to go back into the cell's cytosol for further activity or go back into circulation and attach to another cell. It's not spent once it binds. It gets spent once it's metabolized in the liver.

Then there's the issue that raising testosterone has a blunting effect on SHBG which then in turn raises free test which partially shows that you can increase free T without decreasing total.

If the test isn't bound up, correct me if I'm wrong, but the test will get metabolized faster.

 

[Urrsher]

Like RogerRabbit said, as soon as you inject, your body starts hydrolyzing the ester so it can be active in circulation. With a 500mg pin I'd expect much higher than 11XX that you got so it probably released enough to raise your levels over baseline but not enough for a true peak reading.

It's nice to see you come back down to earth and not make every statement so matter of fact.I'm sorry I mean this as a compliment, it's just the best I can do.

 

[Roger rabbit]

It's nice to see you come back down to earth and not make every statement so matter of fact.I'm sorry I mean this as a compliment, it's just the best I can do.

Doc is cool man. I've learned a lot from this dude. We always get into good convos when we see each other.

 

[Docd187123]

Doc is cool man. I've learned a lot from this dude. We always get into good convos when we see each other.

I like you bc we can both shoot the shit and no one gets personal. If I'm wrong I'll more than gladly admit it to you and you'd do the same as well. I've got mad love, both hetero and homo, for ya lol!

 

[Docd187123]

If the test isn't bound up, correct me if I'm wrong, but the test will get metabolized faster.

I believe you are correct that while testosterone is bound it's metabolized slower. I've seen no evidence to suggest it's enough to significantly skew total test results though.

To go back to OGH's results a bit since I converted the numbers to more commonly used units here:
he had 473ng/dl total test with 119.6pg/ml free test. What's being attributed to his total test being low is that the free test Is high. But the reference range for free test in pg/ml is 35-155 pg/ml on many ranges and converted to ng/dl he has free test levels of 11.96ng/dl where many ranges are 3.5-15.5ng/dl. As you can see his free test isn't really high (although being closer to the higher end) and we're talking about having only ~12ng/dl of free test in his blood.

 

[Roger rabbit]

I believe you are correct that while testosterone is bound it's metabolized slower. I've seen no evidence to suggest it's enough to significantly skew total test results though.

To go back to OGH's results a bit since I converted the numbers to more commonly used units here:
he had 473ng/dl total test with 119.6pg/ml free test. What's being attributed to his total test being low is that the free test Is high. But the reference range for free test in pg/ml is 35-155 pg/ml on many ranges and converted to ng/dl he has free test levels of 11.96ng/dl where many ranges are 3.5-15.5ng/dl. As you can see his free test isn't really high (although being closer to the higher end) and we're talking about having only ~12ng/dl of free test in his blood.

This is exactly what my point was this entire time my man.

You just have a more elaborate way to express what I'm saying.

I don't think it skews the entire test greatly, but can result in a lower result on bloods than one feels it should come back at.

The analogy that I used is like bound test is like the bank, free test is like a withdrawal.. frees it up and will utilized more efficiently, ( or possibly metabolized faster) this can result in a lower number than what you thought the number should come back at.

Now do I believe it will change it by thousands? Na, don't think that, but will have some effect.

 

[Docd187123]

This is exactly what my point was this entire time my man.

You just have a more elaborate way to express what I'm saying.

I don't think it skews the entire test greatly, but can result in a lower result on bloods than one feels it should come back at.

The analogy that I used is like bound test is like the bank, free test is like a withdrawal.. frees it up and will utilized more efficiently, ( or possibly metabolized faster) this can result in a lower number than what you thought the number should come back at.

Now do I believe it will change it by thousands? Na, don't think that, but will have some effect.

But my point is, I believe it affects it so little, so insignificantly, that you won't even be able to tell this difference from a normal variation such as if you tested bloods exactly at peak times vs maybe 3 hours after peak time. I guess that technically what you're saying is correct although I don't think we'd even be able to distinguish the difference bc it would be so small...maybe like 50ng/dL or something (I pulled that 50 number out my ass lol. It's not based on any studies or anything)

 

[TSud]

@Docd187123 @Roger rabbit Is there a way to lower your SHGB, and as a result raise your free t levels?

 

[Docd187123]

@Docd187123 @Roger rabbit Is there a way to lower your SHGB, and as a result raise your free t levels?

You can raise free test levels even if SHBG stays the same simply by raising total test levels. To answer your question though, yea you can. Masteron, winny, and proviron are all commonly known to reduce SHBG but a simple heightened androgen level from using any AAS can also lower SHBG.

 

[Roger rabbit]

You can raise free test levels even if SHBG stays the same simply by raising total test levels. To answer your question though, yea you can. Masteron, winny, and proviron are all commonly known to reduce SHBG but a simple heightened androgen level from using any AAS can also lower SHBG.

Don't forget to not drink alcohol [emoji23] so many people drink alcohol, total mistake.

 

[Roger rabbit]

But my point is, I believe it affects it so little, so insignificantly, that you won't even be able to tell this difference from a normal variation such as if you tested bloods exactly at peak times vs maybe 3 hours after peak time. I guess that technically what you're saying is correct although I don't think we'd even be able to distinguish the difference bc it would be so small...maybe like 50ng/dL or something (I pulled that 50 number out my ass lol. It's not based on any studies or anything)

Lol, well we had a good meeting of minds as usual and always fun to talk to you. Until our next pow-wow you stay safe my man[emoji106][emoji51][emoji106]

 

[Johne71]

I take Danazol prescribed by trt doc...supposed to lower SHBG.

 

[Docd187123]

Lol, well we had a good meeting of minds as usual and always fun to talk to you. Until our next pow-wow you stay safe my man[emoji106][emoji51][emoji106]

ill have homemade brownies for our next pow-wow. Brownies and ice cream.... Nomnomnomnomnomnom

 

[Roger rabbit]

I take Danazol prescribed by trt doc...supposed to lower SHBG.

Do you go to a trt clinic? Think most of the time this is prescribed off label ?

 

[Johne71]

Definitely off Lable. The Danazol is compounded as a troche. I haven't had the second blood follow up yet. That gets done 7 months from starting (I like the sound of this).

 

[Roger rabbit]

Definitely off Lable. The Danazol is compounded as a troche. I haven't had the second blood follow up yet. That gets done 7 months from starting (I like the sound of this).

Keep us posted man. I'd be interested in seeing those bloods for sure and see what it does for lowering shbg. I would think the doc would do a more frequent blood test to see how it is affecting your body until you get it dialed in.

Have you thought about getting them sooner than what your doc says to do? Like going through lab corp or anything?

 

[T-Bagger]

Like RogerRabbit said, as soon as you inject, your body starts hydrolyzing the ester so it can be active in circulation. With a 500mg pin I'd expect much higher than 11XX that you got so it probably released enough to raise your levels over baseline but not enough for a true peak reading.

Thanks for the input and info. So I could be using under dosed stuff, my base could be super low or since it hadn't been a full 24 hours, it didn't have time to fully peak? Anything else to possibly consider?

 

[Weston]

@Docd187123 and @Roger rabbit thanks for letting me eaves drop on your conversation. It's an interesting topic

 

[Docd187123]

Thanks for the input and info. So I could be using under dosed stuff, my base could be super low or since it hadn't been a full 24 hours, it didn't have time to fully peak? Anything else to possibly consider?

Could be it hasn't peaked yet or underdosed but you can't say definitively just yet. Wait 4-6wks before testing again. You can't tell if your baseline is low or not from these labels.