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Anabolic Steroids

Why MESO is tough on sources

@biggerben69 your posts are always well articulated, and you asked some very good questions. Although you didn't ask, and some of your questions may have been rhetorical, i'd like to give my .02 on em.

Q) What would happen, hypothetically, if it came to be known that the owner of the board was also the owner of one of most popular ugl's on the board?
A) i wouldn't care if everything was on par as far as testing

Q) What if one of the mods was the brewer of that same ugl?
Collect board fees and then own a source that he could have his staff steer members to?
A) I guess when i hear the word staff i think of employee, and an employee would be doing his / their part in steering business their direction, again i wouldn't care

Q) Maybe he's doing the right things where testing is concerned? Does that make it ok?
A) Yes for me it makes it ok.

Q) Is it unfair to the other sources paying to be there?
A) Honestly i would say no it is not unfair, reason being those other sources have reps and their "job" is to steer business their direction

Q) Owning the board and hiring staff members who may or may not be rewarded for steering business to the bosses brand?
A) I think again thats what the staff members / reps do, steer business, and receive payment via product, discounts on products, or $ for doing their job

Q) Maybe only certain staff members would be aware?
A) I think all staff members should be made aware, if not posing security threats to said board owner

Q) Would it be fair if it was made known that the board owner was himself a player?
A) If it was made known to staff that he (owner) was a player himself there would be no issue obviously. Cause the owner is being fully transparent. Now, if the owner chooses to not tell anyone and later is found out to be a player, could pose an issue, Maybe he was concerned about other labs leaving or having to justify his actions, or for security reasons. I guess if said owner / player was known to be a thorough guy, then what ever reason given for his actions should be accepted by the community.

Again for me personally if the forum / board owners lab is testing product, just like other labs are, I am completely fine with buying from them. And if the rep is a brewer, I am ok with that as well.
 
You definitely seem to know your shit.
I didn't even know Karius was still around. I remember him from a long time ago. He was one of my favorites.
biggerben69 said:
I'd like to take this time to thank HFO3 for his taking the time to listen to my/our side of the story where @Cakedup aka bigmills is concerned. He's been more than receptive and cordial and for that, I thank you.
It just so happened that the cakedup/bigmills situation mixed into the thread we're discussing here because cakedup happen to see custom running his mouth talking shit to @Jswole220 and without bothering to read the entire thread to see what was going on thought he would pile on and ran his mouth.
Cakedup, as usual, looked like the fucking mope that he is when members told him he had no idea what he was talking about, etc.

Now, I'd never spoken to HFO3 before he sent me a pm at asf. I can't say that I've seen him anywhere else over the years, either. One of the other reps, Montego, I've seen elsewhere over the years but have never spoken to him and know nothing about him either.

I think its important for our members here to understand that though staff at ASF may meet in a staff thread to discuss different issues that come up that require them all be aware of whats going on, that may be the only interaction that they have with each other.
What I'm saying, is while there may be certain staff members on a board, any board, on the take it doesn't mean that they all are. It doesn't mean that one staff member is privy to what other staff members are up to.

As far as this particular rep is concerned and how he compares to other reps for other ugl's let's take a quick look; Reps, for the most part and from what I've seen, are present to run interference for the source(To be blunt).
Having a rep gives the illusion of the source being among the people. Though we can't literally see them, I imagine them with a phony smile talking up the brand and answering questions that any member who took the time to look around could find the answer on their own.
Reps aren't privy to inside info as far as what's going on with a source and again basically serve as a buffer between the members and the source he reps.

Reps have been used as pawns to set up exit scams. One that sticks out in my mind is Imporium who employed Concrete Guy as a rep, among others. CG was well known and respected. He was used like a $10 whore when Imporium advertised their final sale that turned out to be an Exit scam. All CG could do was hang his head and say he felt badly. He should've taken out a 2nd mortgage on his home and pay back members he helped lull into a false sense of security.
He had no clue the exit scam was going to happen.
What he was aware of was that Imporium's big lie that they shoved down everyones throat was that they used Raws from Russia which they claimed were a higher quality than the Chinese raws everyone else was using.
I don't know how a guys rep recovers from something like that? I see concrete over at anasci as a moderator.

With custom and Prae its as if custom is more than your average rep? I read that he may be taking over the reigns and buying the ugl?
These people like to play us as if we buy every little thing they say. Custom is head mouthpiece of the outfit he reps. He acts as if he is one of the owners of the ugl. Has to be. He was shooting off at the mouth unchecked. If he was working for someone else he's be shitcanned for the way he handled himself and the ugl's business. He wasn't taking orders from some owner he has been in the drivers seat from the beginning.
No other rep anywhere would still have a job. Reps, for the most part are paid with product. Custom is so entrenched with Prae there's no chance he is making his little salary in product. He's in this because he pays his bills from members $$.

Finally, we only know what the staff and owner want us to know. There are times when they say too much. Thankfully there are members who pay attention to these things. They'll read something a staff member or admin posts only to find that its been deleted and gone forever. At times they reveal things they shouldn't when anger has hold of them and they let go of info that when brought up later on makes sense and reveals truths.

@BIG74 and @BigBaldBeardGuy, you guys bring up and list some of the things that ASF could do...or would have to do in order to prove that the board is indeed a member first spot dedicated to harm reduction etc. What would happen, hypothetically, if it came to be known that the owner of the board was also the owner of one of most popular ugl's on the board? What if one of the mods was the brewer of that same ugl?

Would the entire board be built on a lie, then? Who do you trust then? Let's say that some of the staff has nothing to do with the operation? I've seen it before. Its going on today. How could it not? Its the perfect...if not perfect...its the natural move to make when purchasing a board.
It was suggested that meso was running this way...anyone remember? Last Summer or Fall. A no good son of a bitch source, @kai(I don't know his handle here to tag him without going back and trying to find it. I won't lose any momentum I may have to look, I apologize)
some how got into the private emails of a member that has scammed some members here. Kai had been engaged in some shady shit of his own. Kai jumped on board claiming he was scammed along with meso members. Kai had no business bringing his issues with the member her pretending to be scammed same way as our members had.
As an international source who accepts bitcoin for payment, kai was using @Ryno3516 (is this the correct ryno?) to launder bitcoin. Ryno must've decided to get everyone for as much as he could because he laundered the bitcoin and instead of keeping his agreed upon fee kept all the bitcoin.
Understandably upset kai somehow hacked or otherwise got into ryno's emails and thought it a good idea to share them with certain members as well as a source TGI.
Rumors were started going around that @Millard Baker, @StanfordPharma, and myself were conspiring to rid meso of tgi as well as selling recs. These were baseless rumors that were started to piss off or humor those involved.

Its a business model that has been followed since the first forums went online and continues to this day.
Let's name of few; juicedmuscle.co* is has been around many, many years. Its owned by the folks that bring you Napsgear.or*. Naps, one of the original selective scamming entities.
Anabolicboard.i*(new domain) was purchased back in the early 2000's by karius to serve as a platform for his legendary lineup of ALP gear. Karius didn't stack the deck in his favor by any means as far as keeping real competition out. AB has been home to some of the best known and most respected sources the Community has ever seen.
Karius also quietly led by example and was ahead of his time testing every batch of raws and posting results of the HPLC testing. I've seen ALP be out of a product because test results weren't back on more than one occasion.
Karius also had some of the most respected staff of all time. Karius has been a friend of the Community as well as a leader. There's only one karius. Anabolicboard is a board I've been a member of since 2007.
You have boards like eroids where they have found a way to maximize profits being a paid source board without the owner actually starting a ugl of his own.
They eroids Top Ten(or whatever its called) sell the top spots to the highest bidder of to whomever is willing to pay the price tags on the top spots.
It was published when one of the sources was busted. It showed payments made with cryptocurrency for the right to be the #1 source at eroids. There are no votes or set of criteria a source must meet to claim that title. Cut a check and be done with it.

Hardcore-Underground and D-red. D-RED owns the board and at least one of the ugl's that sells openly on the board. Not one to be concerned with a federal indictment, D-red posted bond and had some new labels printed up to throw over the goldline name. The Community continues to pay his way without a care in the world.

The spotlight happens to be on ASF at the moment as far as meso is concerned for whatever reason. What model is asf following? Does admin/owner have a ugl to maximize profits. Collect board fees and then own a source that he could have his staff steer members to?
Maybe he's doing the right things where testing is concerned? Does that make it ok? Is it unfair to the other sources paying to be there? Owning the board and hiring staff members who may or may not be rewarded for steering business to the bosses brand?
Maybe only certain staff members would be aware? Would it be fair if it was made known that the board owner was himself a player?

The owner is certainly opening himself up to a different kind of heat if he were to open a ugl to compete for member money.
Owning a board where there is illegal business being conducted through or because of its existence is different than owning a website with the specific intent of operating an illegal business on it. Where do members fit in and should they be informed consumers knowing what ugl is owned by the board owner? What if a moderator for arguments sake and hypothetically speaking is the brewer of the owners ugl? Is it dirty pool not making it known? For their personal safety is it ok to keep such things secret?
Click to expand...
 
Test_Subject said:
To the point that many international sources won't ship here... and those that do don't offer reships.
Click to expand...

100%
I've lost track of how many sources state:

"No reships for Canada, Norway, Sweden"

We roll the dice whenever we use international.
BUT Considering domestic Pharma prices are absolutly fucking insane (I've seen guys paying 180 CAD for Abdi Ibrahim T3)

I'll just fucking order 10 packs internationally.

If fucking 1 makes it through, I'll break even lol
 
Welp, Lab4Tox posted a “forged report” that PSL, another “flagship source” at ASF, was using.

This is absolutely why 3rd party testing is always pushed here at MESO. It’s why guys should ONLY buy tested UGL gear and why we should all do our own testing also.
 
Gbro said:
But @hfo369 said everything was up and up over there! How could this be?!
Click to expand...

To be fair he likely wouldn't know a source is posting fake test results.
He also posted some fire ass natty levels from a member running 500 a wk from whatever that lab that's about to rebrand is called.
 
Wow, ffs, are you that numb in your brain that you don’t see why I posted the labs?
For clarity .... I posted the shit results for members to see the shit results and draw the conclusion of 1+1=2
 
As far as PSL “forged certs” thread goes, here’s what I have to say about that, before we hang a well documented source out to dry, let’s figure things out.
Question: who is “lab4tox” the member?
Question: How do we know he is legit or if he has a a agenda?
Answer: We do not know who he is.
or if he has a a agenda.

Now is the time we gather facts and proof of claims for both sides. Believing one unproven post after the next is the equivalent of Putting All your eggs in one basket, it’s foolish. I won’t do that and neither should anyone else.

The take away is nothing has happened atm, other than accusations, so hold off on the judgments
 
hfo369 said:
Wow, ffs, are you that numb in your brain that you don’t see why I posted the labs?
For clarity .... I posted the shit results for members to see the shit results and draw the conclusion of 1+1=2
Click to expand...

If that was directed at me since you didn't quote. Are you that numb not to recognize obvious sarcasm in the post. Its obvious why you posted those levels in the pit and good on you for doing it.

Feel free to re read my original post again and recognize the post was defending you or don't.
 
hfo369 said:
As far as PSL “forged certs” thread goes, here’s what I have to say about that, before we hang a well documented source out to dry, let’s figure things out.
Question: who is “lab4tox” the member?
Question: How do we know he is legit or if he has a a agenda?
Answer: We do not know who he is.
or if he has a a agenda.

Now is the time we gather facts and proof of claims for both sides. Believing one unproven post after the next is the equivalent of Putting All your eggs in one basket, it’s foolish. I won’t do that and neither should anyone else.

The take away is nothing has happened atm, other than accusations, so hold off on the judgments
Click to expand...



This is where we will differ with you. That’s what you can do over at ASF. You can stay in your own lane with that. Here at MESO we blame the source immediately and then ask stupid questions later.

Lab4Tox the member? That’s the spin you guys are putting on it? Agenda? Talking about fucking drama. Come on. You guys over there think everyone is out to screw your beloved sources. And instead of realizing most sources are out to fuck everyone each way to Sunday, you PROTECT them. You guys need to stop that, you’re losing credibility. It’s obvious that Praetorian has a lot of fucking issues and now PSL. I’d bet over half the sources there would test badly. Why? Because no one has ever held them accountable. They’re like spoiled brat kids.

Outside of ASF, where people can speak freely, PSL and specifically Eurochem is known as a selective scammer.

The MESO community has already known for years that PSL is a questionable source. This is merely further confirmation.
 
Sp2.0 said:
If that was directed at me since you didn't quote. Are you that numb not to recognize obvious sarcasm in the post. Its obvious why you posted those levels in the pit and good on you for doing it.

Feel free to re read my original post again and recognize the post was defending you or don't.
Click to expand...

yeah I read that too fast and I took your post wrong. My apologies.
 
BigBaldBeardGuy said:
This is where we will differ with you. That’s what you can do over at ASF. You can stay in your own lane with that. Here at MESO we blame the source immediately and then ask stupid questions later.

Lab4Tox the member? That’s the spin you guys are putting on it? Agenda? Talking about fucking drama. Come on. You guys over there think everyone is out to screw your beloved sources. And instead of realizing most sources are out to fuck everyone each way to Sunday, you PROTECT them. You guys need to stop that, you’re losing credibility. It’s obvious that Praetorian has a lot of fucking issues and now PSL. I’d bet over half the sources there would test badly. Why? Because no one has ever held them accountable. They’re like spoiled brat kids.

Outside of ASF, where people can speak freely, PSL and specifically Eurochem is known as a selective scammer.

The MESO community has already known for years that PSL is a questionable source. This is merely further confirmation.
Click to expand...

I’ll post where ever i want to post. Read it or don’t read it I could not care less.

The “protection” of sources you claim im doing is the exact opposite of that. I am not protecting sources it’s called “investigation” to get the truth. That is why I posted praetorians other lab results by another member so other members can make their own decisions based on the information at hand and not my opinion, Does that make sense?


The facts are you judge people with no proof, you judged me for scamming and being on the take just because I’m a mod, how foolish are you? I’ve never taken a dime for anything even resembling a scam or something dishonest. I’ve been i this game a long ass time, I am a mod for specific reasons, a couple of which to help my bro’s in iron have a platform to talk and get quality gear. Not for Jr high school drama like you are causing with unverified claims.

Who is the gullible one? You for believing a random new members post claims?
or am I gullible for believing in my actual blood work and the physical proof of my physique ? I use PSL tren ace and hex, both were high quality so yeah I want proof of the allegations made against them.

Now you-say “I bet half of the sources would test badly” you’re gossiping and nothing more man, so you do you and I’ll do me. Let see where this ends up .... Let’s leave it at that.
 
hfo369 said:
Now you-say “I bet half of the sources would test badly” you’re gossiping and nothing more man, so you do you and I’ll do me. Let see where this ends up .... Let’s leave it at that.
Click to expand...

You’re doing the classic commenting out of context just like CNN.

My full quote was “I’d bet over half the sources there would test badly. Why? Because no one has ever held them accountable. They’re like spoiled brat kids.”

So you can get defensive and say “oh it’s not a scam. Me and my mod buddies are benevolent and just want to help out.”

Or you can take action, just like I said in a previous post to this thread, and say “yo, you little bitch sources, us badass mods want to truly help the community so we’re going to implement random product tests.”

But no one will do that because over half your sources will pull their sponsor fees and run to a different source board.

I will apologize if I ever left the impression that you got paid as a mod. I don’t think that.

But I do think that you’ve all received your fair share of “product samples”.
 
BigBaldBeardGuy said:
...we’re going to implement random product tests.”

But no one will do that because over half your sources will pull their sponsor fees and run to a different source board.
Click to expand...

That's exactly the problem with paid boards: accountability only flies until it's affecting their bottom line.

That's why sources are allowed to moderate their own forums and delete negative comments. That's why mods flock to the negative posts on other subforums to do damage control. They're protecting their cash cows. Too much scrutiny is bad for business. That's why you'd basically have to have a video of a source taking a shit in their batch of tren for them to actually be held accountable. The burden of proof is purposely skewed in favour of the sources.

Bad test results are Jano's fault. Bad blood results are "low responders." If someone has an issue with customer service or shipping, people come out of the woodwork to say how great their experience was and discredit the negative review...

Harm reduction is a tertiary concern at best.
 
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