1st cycle of testosterone C. Too much conflicting advice on PCT. Need advice.

[Trekka106]

Hello everyone,
I've been a long time lurker on this site and others trying to gain as much knowledge as I can before I start sticking needles in my ass 2x a week.

Before we dive into it, here are my stats:

Age: 25
Height: 6'1
Weight: 210 LBS
Body Fat: 15%
Fittness level: Athlete

Goal: phase1,To gain 15 pounds of muscle during a 10 week bulking phase with proper diet and exercise with the support of supplements and AAS (Test C.) Phase 2, coming off Test C with proper PCT, cut calories and eat low carb high protein high fat on weekdays and switch to a high carb high protein low fat on weekends to eventually drop 20-30 pounds of fat to achieve 8 % body fat. and of course followed by a structured exercise routine.

The problem is I've read so many different opinions on how to do a proper PCT. Some saying you need Nolva and Clomid, others saying that you only need HCG and Arimidex, others swearing by these OTC products that have high reviews on amazon, others saying that you can slowly ween yourself off the juice alone, ect. So as you can see as a beginner new to training with gear, I want the straight facts on how to do this correctly and not harm my body and keep the gains I worked hard for.

So straight up advice would be much appreciated. I'm just running a 10 week cycle of Test C at 500 mg. So I assume this should be fairly simple.

What do I need to do this correctly?

Thanks

 

[Juced]

Hello everyone,
I've been a long time lurker on this site and others trying to gain as much knowledge as I can before I start sticking needles in my ass 2x a week.

Before we dive into it, here are my stats:

Age: 25
Height: 6'1
Weight: 210 LBS
Body Fat: 15%
Fittness level: Athlete

Goal: phase1,To gain 15 pounds of muscle during a 10 week bulking phase with proper diet and exercise with the support of supplements and AAS (Test C.) Phase 2, coming off Test C with proper PCT, cut calories and eat low carb high protein high fat on weekdays and switch to a high carb high protein low fat on weekends to eventually drop 20-30 pounds of fat to achieve 8 % body fat. and of course followed by a structured exercise routine.

The problem is I've read so many different opinions on how to do a proper PCT. Some saying you need Nolva and Clomid, others saying that you only need HCG and Arimidex, others swearing by these OTC products that have high reviews on amazon, others saying that you can slowly ween yourself off the juice alone, ect. So as you can see as a beginner new to training with gear, I want the straight facts on how to do this correctly and not harm my body and keep the gains I worked hard for.

So straight up advice would be much appreciated. I'm just running a 10 week cycle of Test C at 500 mg. So I assume this should be fairly simple.

What do I need to do this correctly?

Thanks

stop ai atleast a week into PCt IMO.
PCT:
4-5 weeks of:
35-50mg clomid ed and 20mg tamox ed

use HCG the last 4-5 weeks of cycle leading up to BUT NOT into PCT if you want some extra help, i like 50iu 2x a week for this.

 

[Trekka106]

stop ai atleast a week into PCt IMO.
PCT:
4-5 weeks of:
35-50mg clomid ed and 20mg tamox ed

use HCG the last 4-5 weeks of cycle leading up to BUT NOT into PCT if you want some extra help, i like 50iu 2x a week for this.

Thanks for the response. My next problem is finding a reputable source for some PCT.
I've spoken with the rep here for European Pharmaceuticals and he seems to be legit, but doesn't have Nolva in stock. Can I get away with using just Clomid and HCG? Or do I need both?

Also, I'd like your opinion on the post from a user @ elitefittness.com here is the link below.

http://www.elitefitness.com/forum/anabolic-steroids/very-best-pct-2010-right-here-712121.html

Do you think what he says is legit? Or is he full of it?

Thanks again, look forward into hearing from you.

 

[Jeremiahflex]

Thanks for the response. My next problem is finding a reputable source for some PCT.
I've spoken with the rep here for European Pharmaceuticals and he seems to be legit, but doesn't have Nolva in stock. Can I get away with using just Clomid and HCG? Or do I need both?

Also, I'd like your opinion on the post from a user @ elitefittness.com here is the link below.

http://www.elitefitness.com/forum/anabolic-steroids/very-best-pct-2010-right-here-712121.html

Do you think what he says is legit? Or is he full of it?

Thanks again, look forward into hearing from you.

Juced gave you solid advice. Most members won't throw up a source for you (easy to find on your own) Also seems nobody here has love for elite fitness so be careful linking stuff from them.

 

[Dr JIM]

1) I've been a long time lurker

2) gain 15 pounds of muscle during a 10 week bulking

3) coming off Test C with proper PCT, cut calories and eat low carb high protein high fat on weekdays and switch to a high carb high protein low fat on weekends to eventually drop 20-30 pounds of fat to achieve 8 % body fat..

4) Some saying you need Nolva and Clomid, others saying that you only need HCG and Arimidex, bla, bla, bla

5) So straight up advice, ..... to do this correctly?

Thanks

1) and the decision to "lurk" rather than actively participate has led to much of YOUR "confusion"

SUCH AS;

2) gaining 15 pounds of muscle in TEN WEEKS, just won't happen!

3) reducing calories during PCT is an excellent means of LOSING those gains achieved while cycling and whomever concocted this weekday off and weekend on dietary changes is about as lost as you are

4) just more BS that shows how truly limited your fund of knowledge is preferring to lurk and be spoon fed, rather than spending the time REQUIRED to read and understand any number, of AAS related, evidence based data on Meso alone.

5) as an aside with respect to the Elite Fitness "source" who laments we are legit?
Hello, what do you expect ANY SOURCE to say; no dude our products aren't worth a crap, lol!

6) Oh and you believe AAS can be rum wo "harming your body". Who's Koolaid are you drinking, as ALL AAS have adverse effects and WILL negatively impact male hormonal functioning!

FINALLY, for the "straight up advice" you requested.

YOU ARE NOT EVEN CLOSE TO BEING READY TO CYCLE AAS "CORRECTLY"!

 

[Trekka106]

1) and the decision to "lurk" rather than actively participate has led to much of YOUR "confusion"

SUCH AS;

2) gaining 15 pounds of muscle in TEN WEEKS, just won't happen!

3) reducing calories during PCT is an excellent means of LOSING those gains achieved while cycling and whomever concocted this weekday off and weekend on dietary changes is about as lost as you are

4) just more BS that shows how truly limited your fund of knowledge is preferring to lurk and be spoon fed, rather than spending the time REQUIRED to read and understand any number, of AAS related, evidence based data on Meso alone.

5) as an aside with respect to the Elite Fitness "source" who laments we are legit?
Hello, what do you expect ANY SOURCE to say; no dude our products aren't worth a crap, lol!

6) Oh and you believe AAS can be rum wo "harming your body". Who's Koolaid are you drinking, as ALL AAS have adverse effects and WILL negatively impact male hormonal functioning!

FINALLY, for the "straight up advice" you requested.

YOU ARE NOT EVEN CLOSE TO BEING READY TO CYCLE AAS "CORRECTLY"!

Geez, seems I struck I nerve eh? Do you see why someone new would have a hard time wanting to participate when all the person gets is scorned and ridiculed by members like you? I obviously do have a lot to learn and I'm willing to admit that. I will do the work and gain the knowledge so I can do this correctly and effectively. The purpose of my first post was to clear the confusion because there is a good amount of conflicting information out there, even on this site.

So please, instead of scolding me like a kid, I would appreciate constructive criticism so I may learn and become an effective member to this forum like you are.

If you could point me in the right direction, I'd be very greatful for your advice.

Thanks

 

[Dr JIM]

stop ai atleast a week into PCt IMO.
PCT:
4-5 weeks of:
35-50mg clomid ed and 20mg tamox ed

use HCG the last 4-5 weeks of cycle leading up to BUT NOT into PCT if you want some extra help, i like 50iu 2x a week for this.

I understand some still use two SERMS regardless of what was cycled but I believe such an approach is overkill and only increases the possibility of SERM related adverse effects, especially when a cycle only involves TT.

50IU of HCG is approaching homeopathy, based on existing TRT evidence.

 

[Trekka106]

Juced gave you solid advice. Most members won't throw up a source for you (easy to find on your own) Also seems nobody here has love for elite fitness so be careful linking stuff from them.

Thanks for the reply,

I'm still learning quite a bit and will continue doing so for quite a while before I start. I'll stay clear of elitefittness. I was very skeptical reading that site.

I plan on participating with the community as much as I can. I really want to learn about AAS and how to benefit from them.

If you could point me in the right direction, I'd very much appreciate it.

Thanks again

 

[Dr JIM]

Geez, seems I struck I nerve eh? Do you see why someone new would have a hard time wanting to participate when all the person gets is scorned and ridiculed by members like you? I obviously do have a lot to learn and I'm willing to admit that. I will do the work and gain the knowledge so I can do this correctly and effectively. The purpose of my first post was to clear the confusion because there is a good amount of conflicting information out there, even on this site.

So please, instead of scolding me like a kid, I would appreciate constructive criticism so I may learn and become an effective member to this forum like you are.

If you could point me in the right direction, I'd be very greatful for your advice.

Thanks

Fella that was constructive criticism, as I told you what was wrong and how to correct it, but you refuse to acknowledge it as such bc you simply want to cycle.

The latter is something you're NOT ready for and your comments/questions unequivocally prove that point IMO.

But you're like most noobs who post a "help me" but refuse to accept the opinions of those who
know better.

So you want to do this "correctly", something YOU emphasized from the outset, then that BEGINS by reading to understand AAS related evidence, rather than asking for A SOURCE, on this your FIRST thread!

The NEXT STEP is to obtain PRE-AAS labs!

So if you really want to do this correctly, develop a new mindset, one that emphasizes the notion, MUSCLE CAN WAIT!

Unfortunately there are MANY noobs who elected NOT to listen to such "reason" and quite a few have developed both long and short term complications that are anything but desirable.

Good Luck

 

[Juced]

I understand some still use two SERMS regardless of what was cycled but I believe such an approach is overkill and only increases the possibility of SERM related adverse effects, especially when a cycle only involves TT.

50IU of HCG is approaching homeopathy, based on existing TRT evidence.

my apologies i meant 500iu not 50iu, my bad.

 

[Juced]

stop ai atleast a week into PCt IMO.
PCT:
4-5 weeks of:
35-50mg clomid ed and 20mg tamox ed

use HCG the last 4-5 weeks of cycle leading up to BUT NOT into PCT if you want some extra help, i like 50iu 2x a week for this.

I mean 500iu here!! My mistake!

 

[Juced]

Thanks for the response. My next problem is finding a reputable source for some PCT.
I've spoken with the rep here for European Pharmaceuticals and he seems to be legit, but doesn't have Nolva in stock. Can I get away with using just Clomid and HCG? Or do I need both?

Also, I'd like your opinion on the post from a user @ elitefittness.com here is the link below.

http://www.elitefitness.com/forum/anabolic-steroids/very-best-pct-2010-right-here-712121.html

Do you think what he says is legit? Or is he full of it?

Thanks again, look forward into hearing from you.

just go with the sponsor here (CEM-Meso) they are of good quality and i use them too over many years now, no HCG though.

EF is a JOKE now just look into anything you read there more in depth before deciding.
Elitefitness taken over by Evolutionary and AG guys shills?

 

[Juced]

Fella that was constructive criticism, as I told you what was wrong and how to correct it, but you refuse to acknowledge it as such bc you simply want to cycle.

The latter is something you're NOT ready for and your comments/questions unequivocally prove that point IMO.

But you're like most noobs who post a "help me" but refuse to accept the opinions of those who
know better.

So you want to do this "correctly", something YOU emphasized from the outset, then that BEGINS by reading to understand AAS related evidence, rather than asking for A SOURCE, on this your FIRST thread!

The NEXT STEP is to obtain PRE-AAS labs!

So if you really want to do this correctly, develop a new mindset, one that emphasizes the notion, MUSCLE CAN WAIT!

Unfortunately there are MANY noobs who elected NOT to listen to such "reason" and quite a few have developed both long and short term complications that are anything but desirable.

Good Luck

^^ Something some dont do and its a shame, you should ALWAYS have pre-cycles bloods, specially before first cycle so you know where you are at and can compare to post PCT bloods

 

[Dr JIM]

^^ Something some dont do and its a shame, you should ALWAYS have pre-cycles bloods, specially before first cycle so you know where you are at and can compare to post PCT bloods

IME pre-cycle bloods are an unfortunate afterthought for the majority of Mesos noobs.

They pin first and ask questions later (after adverse effects have raised their ugly head) and wo an objective baseline for comparison, the guessing only continues.

 

[grey]

They pin first and ask questions later (after adverse effects have raised their ugly head) and wo an objective baseline for comparison, the guessing only continues.

I think the excitement of finally pulling the trigger plays a pretty big role in skipping those first blood tests.

 

[Dr JIM]

Although there are several ASTHETIC adverse effects due to the use of AAS, none are more troubling than the development of GCM IME

It's for that reason, and others, I strongly believe there is no substitute for FDA approved PHARMACEUTICAL ancillaries SERMS and/or AIs in particular.

It is MUCH easier to prevent the progression of GCM at its onset, especially compared the regressive or abortive therapy for established disease, as the latter often REQUIRES surgical intervention to achieve a "cure".

 

[Dimentio]

Nolvadex 40/40/20/20 -Or- Clomid 50/50/25/25 are standard options.

Whether you run HcG or not is up to you based on your thoughts after learning it's purpose. I'd recommend it though, and would echo Juced's advice on dosing.

 

[Maver]

@Dr JIM as always speaks in valyrian, I can read it but hardly understanding it lol

 

[Trekka106]

Fella that was constructive criticism, as I told you what was wrong and how to correct it, but you refuse to acknowledge it as such bc you simply want to cycle.

The latter is something you're NOT ready for and your comments/questions unequivocally prove that point IMO.

But you're like most noobs who post a "help me" but refuse to accept the opinions of those who
know better.

So you want to do this "correctly", something YOU emphasized from the outset, then that BEGINS by reading to understand AAS related evidence, rather than asking for A SOURCE, on this your FIRST thread!

The NEXT STEP is to obtain PRE-AAS labs!

So if you really want to do this correctly, develop a new mindset, one that emphasizes the notion, MUSCLE CAN WAIT!

Unfortunately there are MANY noobs who elected NOT to listen to such "reason" and quite a few have developed both long and short term complications that are anything but desirable.

Good Luck

Dude, I'm not going to jump the gun and just start shooting my ass full of steroids and hope for the best. I'm actually going to a Hormone clinic and do receive periodic blood tests to insure healthy levels are maintained. I've received testosterone cypionate to "treat" my low T. I'm in like the 300's or something like that. Anyways, point is I do have bloodwork.

Thanks

 

[Trekka106]

I think the excitement of finally pulling the trigger plays a pretty big role in skipping those first blood tests.

I would agree, but I'm not diving into it without know what to do. That's why The test has literally been sitting in vials for 2 months while I prepare.