60 yr old male first starting hgh

[Stretch]

You argue like you're trying to sell something as well Jim. Others have taken notice and asked you this question and you've denied it so I won't bring it up again. Everyone knows I sell generic GH, not the RIPS or HYGES that I promote because I think that would be deceitful. But again, I won't censor my honest opinion on the matter to avoid appearing disingenuous. I've argued this topic long before I had an interest in selling GH. And my opinion hasn't changed.

Are you going to post results? Or just keep alluding to all the tests you ran in the past?


I just want to know the truth. Clearly I need to spend the money on Pharm grade and log the results. That will give me the clarity I seek. There are plenty of guys who have ran both and believe as I do. Generics may be unreliable, and a risk, but I'll take $2/iu over $8-$10/iu all day long.

Now let's see those 20 or so test results please.

I just want to clarify, that I am not saying that Jim HAS an agenda. I am only saying that he, like me, argues passionately when he genuinely believes something. And this has led to more than one person to accuse us of being disingenuous.

 

[Dr JIM]

Ive answered your questions already Stretch.

No I won't post results Stretch since you have already made it clear "they aint shit and prove nothing", inherently denying their validity.

But then again I have nothing to prove since I don't sell any form of PEDs, especially GH, that I would content is your obligation as an admitted GH salesman.

So how about you answer the questions I posed earlier before we pursue "legitimacy" any further?

Here I'll add a few more.

Have you ever used Pharm Grade GH?
Do you know who makes the GH you sell?
Is it possible your product is from Asia?
Did the distributors provide any data it's GTG or did you believe them outright?
Do you have ANY form of evidence, excluding ancedotal use, the stuff you sell is even close to a fully concentrated product?
Has your GH ever been formally tested?

Providing you answer these questions I'll make you an offer you can't (or shouldn't) refuse.

JIM

 

[johnnyBALLZ]

I think I know what the offer is!!

 

[Dr JIM]

Stretch you are most certainly NOT disingenuous, to the contrary your about as candid as they come, IMO.

 

[Stretch]

..

Have you ever used Pharm Grade GH?
no
Do you know who makes the GH you sell?

YES. I've met my distributor face to face in China. And personally toured the facility. I am going back in September, and I am going make a biologic sign, and place it on some of the 1,000,000 dollar pieces if equipment that are contained inside. What would you like to sign to say? If I don't follow through, I am a dirty fucking liar, and shouldn't be trusted.

Is it possible your product is from Asia?

Yes. China.


Did the distributors provide any data it's GTG or did you believe them outright?

They wined and dined. Had multiple HPLCs which I frankly told them I would just as soon, wipe my ass with since they are routinely faked, and I would have no way to spot the difference between a fake or legitimate test result..

Do you have ANY form of evidence, excluding ancedotal use, the stuff you sell is even close to a fully concentrated product?

No. But not for lack of trying. I have sent out vials and payment. Only to have my "CHEMIST" disappear on me. Fucking bitch.

Has your GH ever been formally tested?

NO.

 

[Dr JIM]

Shit now we are getting somewhere! How about the answers to my earlier post queries?

Specifically how much does someone need to spend to obtain a fully concentrated (3IU/mg) product as is dollars/IU?

Jim

 

[Stretch]

Shit now we are getting somewhere! How about the answers to my earlier post queries?

Specifically how much does someone need to spend to obtain a fully concentrated (3IU/mg) product as is dollars/IU?

Jim

Now we are getting into language that I hate. But transparency demands it so here we go.

I was sickened by what this distributor told me. And it should be scary to potential purchasers of generic GH.

He said he will put into the vials any number of IU I desire. 15iu. 10iu. 0iu. 3iu. WHATEVER. And many times he is asked by other customers for 0iu kits. According to him all the underground GH comes from a few manufacturers, and get this...the labels... IE hyge..rip...kig...are produced by a separate company. So I could potentially brand the GH as anything I chose. How true this is, I don't know. I personally asked for my GH to be done @ 13iu and paid accordingly. Anecdotal reports have been great when comparing my GH to the HYGES from THE P.

Answering the specific cost/iu I am not comfortable with doing in the open, as that would be to reveal my profit margin, and therefore subject me to price match...."since you only pay $X couldn't you discount it for me please?"

I can hear it now.

Let me go back and find your other questions. If you mean the post you wrote yesterday outlining what specific questions one should ask a distributor. I forwarded that post to my distributor via email within 5 minutes of you posting it

 

[Dr JIM]

What someone else says does not answer my question.
Why of course it can be concentrated Stretch, that the very point I've been attempting to make.

Such that by the time many customers get their GH it's been stepped on there is barely any GH left.

Sounds a lot like the illicit recreational drug trade doesn't it.

My question specifically applies to how someone defines "Pharm Grade". The WHO defines PG as a concentration of no less than THREE IU/ MG, which has NOTHING to do with how much product can be stuffed into a vial.

The former is infinitely quantifiable while the other is NOT.

 

[Stretch]

What someone else says does not answer my question.
Why of course it can be concentrated Stretch, that the very point I've been attempting to make.

Such that by the time many customers get their GH it's been stepped on there is barely any GH left.

Sounds a lot like the illicit recreational drug trade doesn't it.

My question specifically applies to how someone defines "Pharm Grade". The WHO defines PG as a concentration of no less than THREE IU/ MG, which has NOTHING to do with how much product can be stuffed into a vial.

The former is infinitely quantifiable while the other is NOT.

So....what's the question?

 

[Dr JIM]

How much should someone expect to pay for the fully concentrated PG product at 3IU/MG?

 

[Stretch]

How much should someone expect to pay for the fully concentrated PG product at 3IU/MG?

Are you asking on a retail or wholesale level?

 

[Dr JIM]

Retail.

This distinction is important because I suspect some generics have a certain quantity of GH contained in each vial.

Heck I'm told some Kigs may have had as much as one IU per vial even though they were listed as having TEN.

The latter was the distributors extrapolation from the weight of the enclosed "wet GH" into IU.

 

[Stretch]

Right around $2-$3/iu retail. Any cheaper than that, and something subversive is going on from what I understand of the market.

I know more than most "bros" having taken that trip. But I am confident Pandoras his will open more and more on each subsequent visit.

 

[Dr JIM]

Understand I'm simply trying to endure we are comparing apples to apples in this discussion because ultimately what determines the effectiveness of GH is it's biologic activity, measured in IUs and standardized to a weight based formula, in milligrams.

This standardization is very important because it ensures each company approved for GH sales (no generics are) by the WHO is selling the same product based on efficacy.

In that regard China has been chastened several times for selling "diluted" product throughout the world and two to three Chinese companies lost their license as a consequence.

So it's just not Dr Jim and a few local BB whom have had problems with Asian GH, especially generic, it's also those organizations which maintain the pharmaceutical standards of GH.

Since it takes somewhere between 3-4 dollars per IU to manufacture (Lilly estimate for Humatrope) there is no way someone will obtain a fully concentrated product for the cost of it's production.

(Granted China may reduce that cost to some extent because of lower wages in that country)

If you want a fully concentrated GH product expect to pay at least $5/ IU, and IMO, if your paying less your getting less.

Jim

 

[Stretch]

Understand I'm simply trying to endure we are comparing apples to apples in this discussion because ultimately what determines the effectiveness of GH is it's biologic activity, measured in IUs and standardized to a weight based formula, in milligrams.

This standardization is very important because it ensures each company approved for GH sales (no generics are) by the WHO is selling the same product based on efficacy.

In that regard China has been chastened several times for selling "diluted" product throughout the world and two to three Chinese companies lost their license as a consequence.

So it's just not Dr Jim and a few local BB whom have had problems with Asian GH, especially generic, it's also those organizations which maintain the pharmaceutical standards of GH.

Since it takes somewhere between 3-4 dollars per IU to manufacture (Lilly estimate for Humatrope) there is no way someone will obtain a fully concentrated product for the cost of it's production.

(Granted China may reduce that cost to some extent because of lower wages in that country)

If you want a fully concentrated GH product expect to pay at least $5/ IU, and IMO, if your paying less your getting less.

Jim

Have i answered all your questions?

Ive tried to be way more upfront than I have seen, or probably ever will see, anyone else be.

 

[johnnyBALLZ]

Let's hear the offer Dr. Jim!!

 

[Dr JIM]

Yep indeed you have and in exchange I'm willing to test your product and post the results on Meso for nothing.

The tests will define exactly what is in the vials and the concentration providing it's above one percent.

Jimmy

 

[Stretch]

You would agree that anyone would be a fool, to blindly trust some figure they met online, and don't know in person yes? This is the reason for all the precautions you take with your identity....per our email conversations right?

So you have openly told me you don't have implicit trust in me.

I don't have a concrete reason not to trust you. But you have demonstrated an ability, like myself, to be extremely argumentative and stubborn in the past. Not an insult. Its your personality, and I emulate the same characteristics.

What assurances can you give me that the results provided will not have been Doctored in any way, shape, or form.

And I don't care if MG/IU concentration is off.

It could be 10mg/iu as long as there is 100mgs in the vial. That's why I care about.

 

[biggerben69]

Jim, post them up. You do talk a lot about having tested so many so let's see them.

We're talking about the Doc posting old labs on generic gh? If we are, what's the point?
To the point....you need to and have to trust your source. It's that simple. professionalmuscle has proved that the only thing tests on generic gh does is cost a lot of good people their hard earned money. Thieving fuckers.

 

[biggerben69]

Shit now we are getting somewhere! How about the answers to my earlier post queries?

Specifically how much does someone need to spend to obtain a fully concentrated (3IU/mg) product as is dollars/IU?

Jim

I know a guy that sells a few kits of serostim each month and he gets $5 and change per IU. Most others get $6.50- $7.50 per iu.