Chase Irons' 5g and 18iu ED of GH

[Type-IIx]

The people who perma are going to be bigger then those who do not, type 2x just posted a written assesment on the longer and more you grow on aas the more they will be effective because the muscle has more ability to use the dosage, and that someone who is bigger will actually respond better to lower doses then someone smaller because of the muscle being able to utilize the AAS. I believe this was the out one of his statements, i may have worded it poorly.

Sorry to rehash this or make you feel singled out or anything bro, I just want to clarify for anyone reading that the data shows that someone bigger still needs to take higher doses than a smaller person because the relative dose needed per increased lb/kg body weight far outpaces the increased AR number (rate of up-regulation).

I'll quote the two relevant posts here:

Q&A:


Yep, because concentrations (mg/mL) depend on volume (1 mL = 1 cm³), such that the more mass that you hold, the higher the dose needed to reach a given (e.g., blood) concentration.

Then, too, skeletal muscle contains AR that we care about for these concentrations to activate. Muscle mass is related to dose (mg/mL) in the same manner.

The primary manner of AR regulation that occurs by AAS dose is an increased translational capacity, meaning that ribosome number increases, the μg RNA/mg muscle increases (increased ribosomal density), in turn, increasing the absolute rate of translation of AR proteins for every kg of muscle you carry. But this rate of increase in AR # is far from exponential like the increase to requirements for doses to hit a given concentration as you gain mass (for changes in body or muscle mass vs. AAS dose needed to maintain a given concentration, think a plot or graph of y = X³), rather this rate of increase is merely logarithmic (think a plot or graph of y = log(X)).

To illustrate, visualize the rate or degree of change needed in mg dose of AAS per mL (volume) of your 3-dimensional muscle mass as you grow as the green curve below. Visualize the rate of increase in AR number per mg increase in mg dose of AAS as the purple curve below:

View attachment 271403

See original post for embedded image (graph plotting y₁=X³ vs. y₂ = log(X))

Right, exactly. Also, as you grow, you need to increase dose at an increasing rate (up the dose significantly and, assuming continuous growth, continuously) for the 600 mg equivalent when you started at say 85 kg growing even to 90 kg.

The AR upregulation thing is a little more complex, but basically, AAS do the opposite of street drugs. They actually increase responsiveness with dose increase. However, this increased responsiveness does not keep pace with the fact that you are growing in size, and so practically you do still need to up the dose to get the same effect because of that.

 

[ChaseIrons]

The footage from the eliteFTS SWIS Symposium are now live for purchase on the eliteftsswis website. Here’s a clip from it that I think sums me up pretty well. A lot of people like to compare me to Bostin…


View: https://youtu.be/vgdUScWAk5o

 

[jJjburton]

Sorry to rehash this or make you feel singled out or anything bro, I just want to clarify for anyone reading that the data shows that someone bigger still needs to take higher doses than a smaller person because the relative dose needed per increased lb/kg body weight far outpaces the increased AR number (rate of up-regulation).

I'll quote the two relevant posts here:

See original post for embedded image (graph plotting y₁=X³ vs. y₂ = log(X))

Ahh thank you, no hard feelings

 

[Juicedhead]

I just watched chases podcast with steve.. went over bloodwork. igf-1 was 230 something on 18iu pharma? and total t was 6k roughly? that was on 3 grams of test?

 

[Juicedhead]

wow that is crazy to me as i had igf-1 990 on 10iu of gerneric blue tops and my total t was 5500 on 1 gram test. makes no sense

 

[ChaseIrons]

I just watched chases podcast with steve.. went over bloodwork. igf-1 was 230 something on 18iu pharma? and total t was 6k roughly? that was on 3 grams of test?

That is correct
As i have said before my systemic igf regardless of how much gh i take sits between 180-220. Still get great gains out of it though like the other guys do. in my opinion systemic igf1 doesn’t mean much.

yes that was on 3500 test and 1400 mast for the over 6k total test.

wow that is crazy to me as i had igf-1 990 on 10iu of gerneric blue tops and my total t was 5500 on 1 gram test. makes no sense

It makes perfect sense to me. A guy with less muscle.. less blood.. is not going to be able to utilize/dilute the testosterone they inject the same as a big guy will.

We hear all the time about guys on their first cycle taking 500 test and their total test levels are 3000+ or something. When a big guy says they cruise or trt on 300-500, their total test is likely between 1000-1500 depending on how massive they are.. but then get judged by smaller dudes that have no fucking clue what the big guys ng/dl are.

What we need to understand is, WE ALL RESPOND DIFFERENTLY. This is why you do not copy what anyone else is doing. You do not judge what anyone else is doing because you don’t know their story and how they are metabolize things compared to you or anyone else.

 

[Mongo966]

It makes perfect sense to me. A guy with less muscle.. less blood.. is not going to be able to utilize/dilute the testosterone they inject the same as a big guy will.

That's a good point. More blood means lower ng/dl for the bigger guy at a given dose compared to the smaller guy. I never thought of it that way for some reason.

 

[ChaseIrons]

Shit. That's a good point. I never thought of that for some reason.

Squirt 1ml of red dye (testosterone) into a 1 quart glass of water (200lb bodybuilder) vs a 1 gallon glass of water (300lb bodybuilder). Which one is going to have the stronger concentration?

 

[Mongo966]

Squirt 1ml of red dye (testosterone) into a 1 quart glass of water (200lb bodybuilder) vs a 1 gallon glass of water (300lb bodybuilder). Which one is going to have the stronger concentration?

Yeah it makes total sense. It's actually funny to me that I never thought of it.

 

[ChaseIrons]

Yeah it makes total sense. It's actually funny to me that I never thought of it.

I know it’s not THAT simple.. but it’s a huge part of it. You add in androgen receptor density and that takes it to another level… a guy that’s been on gear for decades vs a guy that been on for 5 years. The decades guy is gonna have waaaay more androgen receptors

So you take a guy like me, been blasting for 15 years straight basically and is 275 pounds lean…. Ya that guys gonna have to use a lot to get significant ng/dl

 

[Juicedhead]

I know it’s not THAT simple.. but it’s a huge part of it. You add in androgen receptor density and that takes it to another level… a guy that’s been on gear for decades vs a guy that been on for 5 years. The decades guy is gonna have waaaay more androgen receptors

So you take a guy like me, been blasting for 15 years straight basically and is 275 pounds lean…. Ya that guys gonna have to use a lot to get significant ng/dl

yeah i guess but i was in the 250s when i pulled the 5500 and the 990. granted i was 27 years old and have been blasting gear for about 4 years at the time. liver king i know was on an assload of pharma gh and his igf was in the 200s still. fucking weird how that works. liver health might have something to do with it? would explain how some guys get almost no sides on high amounts of gh but when i push past like 5-6 iu i start geting unbearable tiredness and hand issues. makes sense how youre able to handle that much test in my opinion and handle that much gh.

 

[ChaseIrons]

yeah i guess but i was in the 250s when i pulled the 5500 and the 990. granted i was 27 years old and have been blasting gear for about 4 years at the time. liver king i know was on an assload of pharma gh and his igf was in the 200s still. fucking weird how that works. liver health might have something to do with it? would explain how some guys get almost no sides on high amounts of gh but when i push past like 5-6 iu i start geting unbearable tiredness and hand issues. makes sense how youre able to handle that much test in my opinion and handle that much gh.

That solidifies my point even more. I have 25-30 pounds more muscle and a decade longer of androgen receptor density. I know a lot of guys that get no systemic igf changes that have perfectly healthy livers. Even Steve is one of them and he cured his fatty liver disease and it changed nothing about his systemic igf1 levels.

Yes i have heard there is a connection between systemic igf levels and side effects from gh which would very much help explain why i have no trouble with 18iu a day and guys like Paul Barnett and Kurt Havens get crippled by 9iu a day

 

[Juicedhead]

so if you pull higher numbers on less gear that would mean you have more receptors or less?

 

[ChaseIrons]

so if you pull higher numbers on less gear that would mean you have more receptors or less?

Well if what we know is that the longer you are on gear and the higher doses both lead to more androgen receptors density… then one pulling higher numbers on less gear would likely be smaller would have less androgen receptors

 

[ChaseIrons]

All the 160-180 pound guys in my forum sharing bloodwork all think they are hyper-responders cause they’ve got massive ng/dl on cycles under a gram running the same brand gear i run… until i break all this down for them

 

[Juicedhead]

All the 160-180 pound guys in my forum sharing bloodwork all think they are hyper-responders cause they’ve got massive ng/dl on cycles under a gram running the same brand gear i run… until i break all this down for them

so the longer youre on gear the more receptors you would have leading to more free test being able to bind leaving a lower reading on a blood test basically

 

[AlexDavis43]

And that's what I meant by "gotta get that AR Upregulation"....
And that's why I posted this Myostatin thingy.
It all points to one simple fact that has been effective but others are scared to venture or admit.... for fear of ridicule because they will be called liars, crazy, and careless... "think of the children.."
So we stick to the shadows, permablasting our lives away... and to what end?
It's a selfish existence.

I say permablast because coming down to 400mg Test is considered a blast to many...
And some only come down to 600.
Some more...

You know some motherfuckers are getting follistatin treatments now. Nasal or IV viral follistatin expression vectors (or something like that), taking a bite into myostatin signaling to influence muscle hypertrophy.

 

[Juicedhead]

You know some motherfuckers are getting follistatin treatments now. Nasal or IV viral follistatin expression vectors (or something like that), taking a bite into myostatin signaling to influence muscle hypertrophy.

those motherfuckers. follistatin is THE SHIT bro i ran it at a 1mg a day for 10 days and fucking unreal muscle growth and fat loss. made me eat everything in sight. hurts like a bitch to pin it. god damn were going to start seeing freakazoids in the future with follistatin starting to become a thing.

 

[Mongo966]

those motherfuckers. follistatin is THE SHIT bro i ran it at a 1mg a day for 10 days and fucking unreal muscle growth and fat loss. made me eat everything in sight. hurts like a bitch to pin it. god damn were going to start seeing freakazoids in the future with follistatin starting to become a thing.

10 whole days. You're a savage, bro.

 

[ChaseIrons]

so the longer youre on gear the more receptors you would have leading to more free test being able to bind leaving a lower reading on a blood test basically

It’s definitely way more complex than this.. but this is how my simple meathead brain makes sense of it.