I don't want to get off

[Rido]

See I’m at week 17 almost 18 and I feel no more tired then I usually do. But only 500 test and 500 dhb so both “relatively” safe and moderate doses and I don’t need an ai or anything at 500.
Might go down to 300/300 as a cruise dose or swap the dhb for mast or primo or something.
Mind, fatigue and side effects at least feels side effects are almost non existent. Except with the Anadrol I’m just always pumped and the shoulder pumps are extremely painful

I think what has been killing me was the sleep. I feel like I get super hot from nandrolone even at 300mg when I sleep. My wife gets pissed how I have the room temp set to South Pole. I have never perspired as much in my life until I started NPP.

 

[Deleted member 123722]

Genuine question: I think you had mentioned before that you were married. What does your wife think about this? Does she ask you/worry about the health implications?

She doesn't get paid to think lol. No, she of course thinks I dont' need to take anything, but she knows I'm going to do what I want, anyway. She also konws my medical records, since her former boss is our family practitioner, so she knows I'm in good health.

Isn’t slin supposed to lead to a lot of negative outcomes, more so than AAS?

Also about the tren at 200mg for 6 months, aren’t there studies that show the longer you are on tren the more at risk you are to cardiovascular maladaptations, something like after 6 weeks? & correct me if I’m wrong but I think i recall something similar about nandrolone. is there any legit science that backs up the claim that 24 months with essentially the same mgs of a 12 week blast would in any way reduce harm or be beneficial for gains?

No idea; it just seems logical to me, and my bloodwork showed I was fine afterwards. "The dose makes the poison"; remember that line.

So what is ur goal with this? Are you still gonna be cutting or are u bulking. Bc u don't even need 400mg of test to maintain the shape ur in now. I just want to know ur goal or reason for doing this. I can understand the WANT to, just not the need. I'm not criticizing ya just trying to understand.

The goal is to maintain what I have now, until my body is "set" at this weight for a bit, until it's time to bulk. I wanted to cut, but my friend Gabe said to forget cutting again at this point. I mentioned how everyone on the board says to lean out to a single-digit BF%, and then grow into a higher %, but he said that's not necessary; that I already lost fat, and it's ok if I gain a bit back so long as I put on quality tissue, because BF% also has to takes into account muscle as well. He thinks many people have a skewed view of bf% and throw out arbitrary numbers on what someone should do at what points and when, without realizing if any new tissue is added, it's not like I'd become the same 20% I was last year. And when I do add more lean tissue, my next cut it will actually be easier.

Also, I'm taking this rebound opportunity to target weaker prioritize weaker parts like my arms and calves, while they are prone to growth.

I could argue none of us need to be on gear at all; but the thing is, I want to be...I also want to make sure I let the drugs assist in adding tissue while my body is primed to put on quality size. I think it would be retarded to drop all gear right now.

 

[BigRed91]

She doesn't get paid to think lol. No, she of course thinks I dont' need to take anything, but she knows I'm going to do what I want, anyway. She also konws my medical records, since her former boss is our family practitioner, so she knows I'm in good health.

No idea; it just seems logical to me, and my bloodwork showed I was fine afterwards. "The dose makes the poison"; remember that line.

The goal is to maintain what I have now, until my body is "set" at this weight for a bit, until it's time to bulk. I wanted to cut, but my friend Gabe said to forget cutting again at this point. I mentioned how everyone on the board says to lean out to a single-digit BF%, and then grow into a higher %, but he said that's not necessary; that I already lost fat, and it's ok if I gain a bit back so long as I put on quality tissue, because BF% also has to takes into account muscle as well. He thinks many people have a skewed view of bf% and throw out arbitrary numbers on what someone should do at what points and when, without realizing if any new tissue is added, it's not like I'd become the same 20% I was last year. And when I do add more lean tissue, my next cut it will actually be easier.

Also, I'm taking this rebound opportunity to target weaker prioritize weaker parts like my arms and calves, while they are prone to growth.

I could argue none of us need to be on gear at all; but the thing is, I want to be...I also want to make sure I let the drugs assist in adding tissue while my body is primed to put on quality size. I think it would be retarded to drop all gear right now.

Well I'm sure you could maintain on just 250mg a week and also improve ur physique on it slowly but I know this is what u want to do so do it but like others said just bc ur bloods are good doesn't mean it's not taking a toll on you.
But the biggest guy I know personally is 55 yrs old 6'2" 315lbs and ripped all the time and he's old school he says cycling is just switching compounds haha he never cruises but he does come totally off everything about 1-2 months every year. Just complete nonsense but it works for him.

 

[Rido]

She doesn't get paid to think lol. No, she of course thinks I dont' need to take anything, but she knows I'm going to do what I want, anyway. She also konws my medical records, since her former boss is our family practitioner, so she knows I'm in good health.

Again, You haven't had all the testing done. and FNPs arent trained to know all the effects of anabolic steroids in the body. There are certain health markers you may not even be following, what about plaque build up with a coronary calcium screen? You do not have an echo so how do you know everything is in check? that is just tip of the ice berg


I honestly think at this point(I am sure that most will agree) that you are lying to yourself.

you keep going back to blood but if that is all that needed to be done, we wouldn't have MRI's CTs, liver biopsies, kidney ultrasounds etc.

 

[jJjburton]

I will admit that logically I should get off soon, go back to a "TRT" dose, but I won't; my TRT dose is 200mg of cyp, which isn't even TRT, and puts me over 1000.

I've been on for a while now; taking only a month or so between cycles, since literally last year, when I did my 1 gram of Deca only for 12 weeks; after that, I went like few weeks, then started Test/Tren E/Primo. 15 weeks into that, I dropped the Tren E, and switched to Anavar 50mg ed. I'm currently still on the Test/Primo/Var since my cutting cycle started in Feb!

I've been taking 5iu of GH ED since last year, and I recently bumped it up to 10ius about 20 days ago.

I don't care to take bloods, because it wouldn't stop me anyway, and I only do so when its my time to go to get a yearly check up. And when I did take my bloods, they weren't bad at all, few things like AST and Hemocrit 51% elevated but nothing crazy. In fact, a year prior, I ran a low-dose of Cyp 200 / Tren E 200 for six months straight, and I only took a month off, and my bloods were normal after. My EKG and everything was literally perfect.

I don't get high blood pressure from any drug, while on; I don't feel like shit; I don't get any of the sides most people complain about, even from Tren. I feel like I'm one of those people who are very side-effect resistant. The only drug that I got noticeable shit from was anadrol, which gave me acid reflux that was annoying. I stopped that 17 days in because it was not allowing me to eat the calories I needed to bulk.

Point is, since I am on TRT for life, I see no reason why to stop, even if it is to return to "normal" levels of whatever blood markers. What is the point really, if I'm just gonna blast again in another month; even if I took two or three months off, how does that help? It's not like a month or so will undo all the damage being done to my organs, if any. And like I said, my bloods come back perfect, so where is this damage that supposed to be harming me? This makes me think pros are taking 100x more than we do, as they are literally walking around with high blood pressure for years, and having shitty bloodwork the whole time.

Why couldn't I just drop all gear and return to Cyp only, but at 600mg to maintain what I built? There was a study showing that men taking 600mg had literally no negative sides at all. In fact, Milos runs 500mg for 20+ years as his "TRT" based on this very study. I just feel that gaining size, then going to TRT for a month just doesn't make any sense; if the drugs are fucking your bloodwork up badly, you shouldn't be taking those drugs at all, and you should find drugs that don't.

Am I addicted to these drugs or am I just not seeing the point? There is not one pro who has taken off gear and retained anything he's built; not one. All these guys coming out like Seth Feroce or Lee Preist claiming they are on TRT only are full of shit: Look at Dorian, Arnold, Haney, Ronnie, and everyone else running TRT, how much they shrunk. So why would we want to blast and cruise, to gain and shrink, on and off? Isn't that retarded or what? Why not just stay on until you're done taking them all together?

So most people i know who have size stay at 400-500 mg a week, cruising.

 

[Isrrike]

Do you ever get echo cardio grams? Or heart checks? My bloods were perfect and I found out through echo I had cardiac remodelling and an ejection fraction fo 39%

 

[Rido]

Do you ever get echo cardio grams? Or heart checks? My bloods were perfect and I found out through echo I had cardiac remodelling and an ejection fraction fo 39%

Thank you for telling people your issues. Helps educate people (serious)

 

[Logan44551]

@hurricane had a stroke years ago. Not sure how his blood work was leading up to it. Blasting year round is definitely going to take years off your life.

The Effects of Anabolic Steroids on the Heart's Structure and Function

Perhaps one of the most worrying side effects of prolonged anabolic steroid use are those related to the heart. Indeed, a startling amount of case reports

thinksteroids.com

 

[Deleted member 123722]

Do you ever get echo cardio grams? Or heart checks? My bloods were perfect and I found out through echo I had cardiac remodelling and an ejection fraction fo 39%

No I haven't, but I also haven't been abusing steroids for years on end... I've had an EKG, and it was perfect. I also never have high blood pressure on any drug, no joke...not on tren, not on 1 gram of deca, and not even on 50mg of anadrol. But I'll never take drol again, so that won't matter.

 

[Deleted member 123722]

Again, You haven't had all the testing done. and FNPs arent trained to know all the effects of anabolic steroids in the body. There are certain health markers you may not even be following, what about plaque build up with a coronary calcium screen? You do not have an echo so how do you know everything is in check? that is just tip of the ice berg


I honestly think at this point(I am sure that most will agree) that you are lying to yourself.

you keep going back to blood but if that is all that needed to be done, we wouldn't have MRI's CTs, liver biopsies, kidney ultrasounds etc.

I'm not lying to myself at all, becaus I'm not even aware of half the shit you're talking about. I've always be a careless user of drugs; I don't understand bloodwork, nor did I ever care to, because I was not going to stop doing what I wanted...how many of you guys can admit this?

So, no I haven't done every single test people think should be taken, and I haven't because I haven't been running gear like this for decades straight like most pros or real bodybuilders do, so I figured why would I need to if I'm not abusing shit like others are?. But from what I've seen so far, there are no indications that I'm unhealthy.

Should I ask for these other tests? Sure. I can ask the VA for my yearly health check up.

Please list the ones you guys think I should get, and I will request them.

 

[BigRed91]

No I haven't, but I also haven't been abusing steroids for years on end... I've had an EKG, and it was perfect. I also never have high blood pressure on any drug, no joke...not on tren, not on 1 gram of deca, and not even on 50mg of anadrol. But I'll never take drol again, so that won't matter.

I can tell Noone is gonna talk you out of this but do u want to be the guy on here in a few years telling people not to do this bc it gave u health problems. We are trying to look out for you man. I know u like to experiment but just like the 10iu of hgh you been doing, this isn't gonna be the secret trick that works.

 

[cdoubleu]

I want to get off…at least once a day.

 

[Deleted member 123722]

I can tell Noone is gonna talk you out of this but do u want to be the guy on here in a few years telling people not to do this bc it gave u health problems. We are trying to look out for you man. I know u like to experiment but just like the 10iu of hgh you been doing, this isn't gonna be the secret trick that works.

I know you guys are looking out for me, and I appreciate it; the only person who can talk myself out of something is when I agree with infallible logic. So the only way anyone can convince me is to get me to see their argument, and consider it infallible. That's how I operate.

Victor Black has solid logic, and he is all about lower dosages; I've heard his arguments, especially against high-dose blast and cruise, and he is all about protecting organs, and the brain as well, so that's why I'll be spending money to consult with him, and I'll be more than happy to share what I learn with the community, even though it's gonna cost me $200 for an hour.

 

[Deleted member 123722]

Let' also not forget the question I raised in this post as well:

Am I addicted to these drugs or am I just not seeing the point? There is not one pro who has taken off gear and retained anything he's built; not one. All these guys coming out like Seth Feroce or Lee Preist claiming they are on TRT only are full of shit: Look at Dorian, Arnold, Haney, Ronnie, and everyone else running TRT, how much they shrunk. So why would we want to blast and cruise, to gain and shrink, on and off? Isn't that retarded or what? Why not just stay on until you're done taking them all together?

 

[Pantera]

I'm not lying to myself at all, becaus I'm not even aware of half the shit you're talking about. I've always be a careless user of drugs; I don't understand bloodwork, nor did I ever care to, because I was not going to stop doing what I wanted...how many of you guys can admit this?

So, no I haven't done every single test people think should be taken, and I haven't because I haven't been running gear like this for decades straight like most pros or real bodybuilders do, so I figured why would I need to if I'm not abusing shit like others are?. But from what I've seen so far, there are no indications that I'm unhealthy.

Should I ask for these other tests? Sure. I can ask the VA for my yearly health check up.

Please list the ones you guys think I should get, and I will request them.

Get an echocardiogram. Will show that condition of your heart. Buddy a few posts up that said his ejection fraction was 39%? That's heart failure. An echo will tell you what your ejection fraction is, whether or not you have LVH, etc.

At the end of the day you don't want to be past the point of no return regarding your health. You will regret it when you're older and death is more imminent. I don't mean to come off as preachy. I just think about health a lot these days.

P.S. Also get a cystatin-c test to check your kidney function. If they insist on just checking your creatinine, tell them your muscle mass makes a creatinine test unreliable.

 

[Rido]

Get an echocardiogram. Will show that condition of your heart. Buddy a few posts up that said his ejection fraction was 39%? That's heart failure. An echo will tell you what your ejection fraction is, whether or not you have LVH, etc.

At the end of the day you don't want to be past the point of no return regarding your health. You will regret it when you're older and death is more imminent. I don't mean to come off as preachy. I just think about health a lot these days.

P.S. Also get a cystatin-c test to check your kidney function. If they insist on just checking your creatinine, tell them your muscle mass makes a creatinine test unreliable.

I want to add to this that the mild HF at 39% is reversible, but it is still important to watch this marker.

 

[Deleted member 123722]

apparently injectable L-carinitine has heart remodeling capabilities; Meadows was a big fan of it...200mg a day to achieve those benefits.

 

[BigRed91]

apparently injectable L-carinitine has heart remodeling capabilities; Meadows was a big fan of it...200mg a day to achieve those benefits.

And yet he still died of a heart attack didn't he at quite an early age

 

[Deleted member 123722]

And yet he still died of a heart attack didn't he at quite an early age

Yes, but he had some genetics issues that killed him; I'm sure the gear made things worse, but it was mostly genetic, from what I understand.

 

[Slowww]

No idea; it just seems logical to me, and my bloodwork showed I was fine afterwards. "The dose makes the poison"; remember that line.

Idk if this is very convincing. People think lots of stuff that is wrong is logical. Flat earth seems logical in the absence of science. If the dose makes the poison you still consumed & exposed yourself to the same overall dose, just over a longer period of time. You can do whatever you want obviously i just can’t see the point in being on tren as long as possible instead of minimising time of exposure due to sides most people experience.

Regarding the on g deca stuff and so on have you had EKGs or anything like this after? I had these and was fine (using less gear) but i don’t think it’s safe operating under the assumption that doing the test once means im in the clear. if you’re gonna be like permablasting you gotta be really on top of testing. A lot of guys you mentioned like Dorian has a very enlarged heart and he has openly discussed it, Arnold has had heart surgery etc. Ronnie also doesn’t have the best bill of health, and Meadows RIP has passed away. They’re very big but at what cost? If you realise those outcomes are likely/possible and go that way that is one thing, and I can respect that but don’t think it can’t happen to you if adhering to those kinds of protocols. Not trying to be rude or change your opinion, but just staying on seems like a decision not to be taken too lightly