Standford's Primo 200 mg/ml - Analysis Preformed Performed by Analiza Białek, Chromate & Jano

[CoachCabo]

My take is that Chromate has real problems, either with equipment or protocol, or both. Those are wildly different results. I would also like to see test equipment details like Analiza displays.

Analiza did not do the retest. She likely just fixed the typo then transmitted the “new“ report. Only my opinion but….
Again, wildly different results.

HPLC, in my limited experience, is not that crazy in variables.

Jano’s report looks legit.
I sent him some samples a few years ago. Simultaneously I ran these samples on a Agilent 1100 which I was purchasing. They came back within a milligram of his reports. I have stated this on another forum in the past and was accused of gargling Jano’s nuts. The Jano hate is strong there, unfortunately.
The purchase of that system failed so to speak due to COVID and the inability to drive to the USA to pick it up. But I am again in the market for one because this testing shit is out of hand.
If I am sending stuff off, it’s going to Jano.

NO brewer is using nearly 50% more primo raws to make their product. I would expect a 10%+/- in milligrams, but nothing more.

Hats off to Stanford if they are getting that accurate!

 

[Pinnacle Elements]

Jesus Christ Marie! They're minerals!

Guys, HEAVY METAL ROCKS!

Honestly we should be thankful they don’t charge extra for the heavy metals, a free bonus gift from our China friends <3

 

[Pinnacle Elements]

NO brewer is using nearly 50% more primo raws to make their product. I would expect a 10%+/- in milligrams, but nothing more.

Not only that but without supersolvents , Primo isn’t going to hold at 287mg/ml

 

[CoachCabo]

Not only that but without supersolvents , Primo isn’t going to hold at 287mg/ml

Precisely!
Forgot about that. I made it at 200mg with the standard 20/2. It was painful. But I am a pip pussy. Everything hates me.
My friends who got free primo were happy though.

 

[Stanfordpharma1]

@Stanfordpharma1

Heat (and other stuff) degrades trenbolones, which results into lower mg/ml. I also see other indicators or degradation, but generally don't list them on the report.

The 'darker' the tren is the more degraded it is, so the lower mg/ml.

I have some raw tren powder that tested well. Brewed it on low heat and it came out darkest I've ever seen. The finished product tested very good. I find there are many factors on my end that can lead to darker tren. Heat bring one, but carrier oil and the color of the raws plays a big part as well.

 

[Zmn71]

@Stanfordpharma1

Heat (and other stuff) degrades trenbolones, which results into lower mg/ml. I also see other indicators or degradation, but generally don't list them on the report.

The 'darker' the tren is the more degraded it is, so the lower mg/ml.

Does heat degrade other compounds such as test or primo?

Been throwing all my gear on a hot plate for 10 minutes every morning haha.

 

[Chromate]

My take is that Chromate has real problems, either with equipment or protocol, or both. Those are wildly different results. I would also like to see test equipment details like Analiza displays.

Analiza did not do the retest. She likely just fixed the typo then transmitted the “new“ report. Only my opinion but….
Again, wildly different results.

HPLC, in my limited experience, is not that crazy in variables.

Jano’s report looks legit.
I sent him some samples a few years ago. Simultaneously I ran these samples on a Agilent 1100 which I was purchasing. They came back within a milligram of his reports. I have stated this on another forum in the past and was accused of gargling Jano’s nuts. The Jano hate is strong there, unfortunately.
The purchase of that system failed so to speak due to COVID and the inability to drive to the USA to pick it up. But I am again in the market for one because this testing shit is out of hand.
If I am sending stuff off, it’s going to Jano.

NO brewer is using nearly 50% more primo raws to make their product. I would expect a 10%+/- in milligrams, but nothing more.

Hats off to Stanford if they are getting that accurate!

More like 30% over (the 287 figure was a legitimate calculation error) — not impossible but definitely unlikely. The error would be in the protocol since other samples that have been run on this machine have been spot on. Still working it out.

 

[brutalbuilt]

looks like all the jano haters have all been proven wrong lmao

 

[janoshik]

I have some raw tren powder that tested well. Brewed it on low heat and it came out darkest I've ever seen. The finished product tested very good. I find there are many factors on my end that can lead to darker tren. Heat bring one, but carrier oil and the color of the raws plays a big part as well.

Indeed, carrier oil matters a lot too, should have mentioned that as well.

Some oils are more prone to darkening than others, even with compounds other than trenbolone.

 

[nightprowler7]

Indeed, carrier oil matters a lot too, should have mentioned that as well.

Some oils are more prone to darkening than others, even with compounds other than trenbolone.

Which ones are more prone to darkening in your opinion

 

[janoshik]

Which ones are more prone to darkening in your opinion

I have literally no idea, apologies.

 

[lift4lyfe]

@Stanfordpharma1

Heat (and other stuff) degrades trenbolones, which results into lower mg/ml. I also see other indicators or degradation, but generally don't list them on the report.

The 'darker' the tren is the more degraded it is, so the lower mg/ml.

Darker tren has lower mg/ml? Are we sure about that? I’m sitting on the darkest vial I’ve ever seen (it started out dark and keeps getting darker over time), but it’s supposedly the highest mg/ml as well… I guess testing it is the only way to find out

 

[Stanfordpharma1]

Darker tren has lower mg/ml? Are we sure about that? I’m sitting on the darkest vial I’ve ever seen (it started out dark and keeps getting darker over time), but it’s supposedly the highest mg/ml as well… I guess testing it is the only way to find out

I would say that's more of a possibility than a constant. I've seen white tren e powder that tested amazing and dark yellow tren e that tested amazing. Both finished products tested spot on and the color difference of the finished product was like night and day. The carrier oils also play a factor. Also the heat, but I'm not sure if theres an exact correlation between the color and degradation due to heat. I think that's why it would be a good test to perform.

 

[Stanfordpharma1]

Which ones are more prone to darkening in your opinion

That would be your thicker, darker carriers like gso or cso. Clear carriers such as mct or eo could come out as clear as test e if your tren powders are light in color and made with low temps.

 

[readalot]

I would say that's more of a possibility than a constant. I've seen white tren e powder that tested amazing and dark yellow tren e that tested amazing. Both finished products tested spot on and the color difference of the finished product was like night and day. The carrier oils also play a factor. Also the heat, but I'm not sure if theres an exact correlation between the color and degradation due to heat. I think that's why it would be a good test to perform.

Excellent. How color bodies (impurities) in the raw powder/carrier oil manifest color in the finished product (after experiencing heat in solution) is notoriously difficult to predict.

Two raw powders can look practically identical from a color standpoint but then give vastly different color in solution of finished product.

This statement does not contradict Jano's statement that heat can degrade tren. However the color of the finished product does not strongly correlate with tren mg/ml in finished product.

Based on my own experience outside AAS manufacture, even with most sophisticated testing available it is almost impossible to build a predictive color model based on measurable impurities in raw material.

Be interesting to see if even some modest impurity analysis on AAS raws would yield some insight into color formation.

Oxidation, light, storage also applicable.

 

[readalot]

Example of successful investigation in related industry:

https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S135951131300617X

 

[Cromagg]

Which ones are more prone to darkening in your opinion

“Steroid carrier oils can sometimes darken due to oxidation or exposure to light and air. Common carrier oils like cottonseed, grapeseed, and sesame oil are prone to this. Oxidation changes the oil's color and can affect its quality.”

Not a big help, since it’s the whole gamut. But…

 

[Cromagg]

Example of successful investigation in related industry:

https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S135951131300617X

View attachment 275584

You want to harvest broth?

 

[Cromagg]

Excellent. How color bodies (impurities) in the raw powder/carrier oil manifest color in the finished product (after experiencing heat in solution) is notoriously difficult to predict.

Two raw powders can look practically identical from a color standpoint but then give vastly different color in solution of finished product.

This statement does not contradict Jano's statement that heat can degrade tren. However the color of the finished product does not strongly correlate with tren mg/ml in finished product.

Based on my own experience outside AAS manufacture, even with most sophisticated testing available it is almost impossible to build a predictive color model based on measurable impurities in raw material.

Be interesting to see if even some modest impurity analysis on AAS raws would yield some insight into color formation.

Oxidation, light, storage also applicable.

Oxidation and light. These are natural products w variance. It not so technical.

Damn, you’re a verbose one, no?

 

[Cromagg]

Oxidation and light. These are natural products w variance. Not to mention taking on the color other chems added. Common.

Damn, you’re a verbose one, no?