Timing of hGH with early AM workout

[Megadick3000]

The only rationale for avoiding eating post-rhGH bolus would be insulin resistance. Since rhGH stimulates lipolysis and causes insulin resistance within 1-2 h, and these effects disappear after approx. 8 hr (this is not to say there is not summation of these effects and increased basal IR from chronic rhGH admin.) This, then, is a rationale (among others) for nighttime administration... or, given stimulation of FFAs and ketone bodies, an argument for eating within 1-2 h of the bolus.

Since the body adapts to fasted cardio by reducing TDEE later in the day anyhow (yes, it is smarter than you), all these fasted GH protocols are just bad bro science.

So heres where i get confused.

If GH + slin is such a good combo as bro scientists say, then if your not using exogenous insulin wouldnt you want to eat carbs post injection of GH to stimulate insulin release?

Secondly. Since GH has well documented inhibitory effects on lipogenesis, wouldnt ideal protocol for fat loss be fasted cardio followed by GH followed by daily caloric intake? The idea here being you burn fat, then take GH before eating anything to inhibit lipogenesis whilst proceeding to then consume a caloric surplus? The lipogenesis inhibiting effects of GH would presumably prevent your body from replenishing the fat reserves that were depleted earlier in the day during fasted cardio despite consuming a surplus over TDEE.

 

[Type-IIx]

So heres where i get confused.

If GH + slin is such a good combo as bro scientists say, then if your not using exogenous insulin wouldnt you want to eat carbs post injection of GH to stimulate insulin release?

Secondly. Since GH has well documented inhibitory effects on lipogenesis, wouldnt ideal protocol for fat loss be fasted cardio followed by GH followed by daily caloric intake? The idea here being you burn fat, then take GH before eating anything to inhibit lipogenesis whilst proceeding to then consume a caloric surplus? The lipogenesis inhibiting effects of GH would presumably prevent your body from replenishing the fat reserves that were depleted earlier in the day during fasted cardio despite consuming a surplus over TDEE.

Good questions.

So, contrary to Scott Stephenson's apparent argument that timing is irrelevant, the clinical relevance of different timings/routes of administration have been established, and indeed research on this matter was conducted almost 30 years ago. For example [1]. If these matters are relevant to clinicians, do you suppose they are relevant to supra-physiological dosing?

Regarding GH + insulin: one must distinguish strongly between GH + insulin (endogenous) vs. rhGH + rhInsulin with supra-physiological dosages. At endogenous levels, there is an interference effect exerted by insulin on GH [2]. When we look at the protocols used by bodybuilders, the difference is that their protocols are characterized by A) supra-physiological B) systemic C) exogenous D) rhGH with E) rhInsulin, and of particular importance, F) hyperaminoacidemia.

Under these conditions (A-F), you have what is seen in practice.

Your second question definitely gets to a far different conclusion than where I have been led by the literature and practice. You must account for pharmacokinetics of the route of administration, dosage, etc.
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References:
[1] Laursen, T., Jergensen, J. O. L., & Chrlstiansen, J. S. (1994). Metabolic effects of growth hormone administered subcutaneously once or twice daily to growth hormone deficient adults. Clinical Endocrinology, 41(3), 337–343. doi:10.1111/j.1365-2265.1994.tb02554.x
[2] Fryburg, D. A., Louard, R. J., Gerow, K. E., Gelfand, R. A., & Barrett, E. J. (1992). Growth Hormone Stimulates Skeletal Muscle Protein Synthesis and Antagonizes Insulin’s Antiproteolytic Action in Humans. Diabetes, 41(4), 424–429. doi:10.2337/diab.41.4.424