2023 Cut

[Deleted member 123722]

It may be possible that my training is also not conducive to my cutting goals. If we think about it, the way I am training now, is the same was I was training trying to gain tissue: low volume, two sets to failure; this preserves energy so I get enough muscle stimulus, which is great for being in a surplus. But this doesn't even raise my heart rate at all; I don't even break a sweat.

While in a deficit, I am not going to gain any tissue; I'll be lucky to preserve it, which I certainly have. So perhaps it's time to go back to a higher-volume approach, with shorter rest periods to get my heart rate up a bit, so my training can also act a bit as some cardio: kind of like how they did it in the old days for contest prep.

Besides, I've been training the same way for nearly six months, so a change-up may cause some breakthroughs.

It did some more volume today on back/biceps and if felt really good to do. I only rested one min in between sets, and I broke a sweat. I never sweat doing my workouts, so I'll try this out and see what happens.

The question is whether I should return to bro-splits and just hammer a muscle to death, or just add higher-volume evenly to my current PPL split. However, once again, the increased frequency is there to make sure I grow the most in a year, but I'm not in a growth phase, so a bro-split may just be the answer here.

 

[BigTomJ]

It may be possible that my training is also not conducive to my cutting goals. If we think about it, the way I am training now, is the same was I was training trying to gain tissue: low volume, two sets to failure; this preserves energy so I get enough muscle stimulus, which is great for being in a surplus. But this doesn't even raise my heart rate at all; I don't even break a sweat.

While in a deficit, I am not going to gain any tissue; I'll be lucky to preserve it, which I certainly have. So perhaps it's time to go back to a higher-volume approach, with shorter rest periods to get my heart rate up a bit, so my training can also act a bit as some cardio: kind of like how they did it in the old days for contest prep.

Besides, I've been training the same way for nearly six months, so a change-up may cause some breakthroughs.

It did some more volume today on back/biceps and if felt really good to do. I only rested one min in between sets, and I broke a sweat. I never sweat doing my workouts, so I'll try this out and see what happens.

The question is whether I should return to bro-splits and just hammer a muscle to death, or just add higher-volume evenly to my current PPL split. However, once again, the increased frequency is there to make sure I grow the most in a year, but I'm not in a growth phase, so a bro-split may just be the answer here.

Dont overestimate the caloric expenditure from resistance training.

Its my personal opinion is that training intensity should remain as close to the same between a cut and a growing phase, given that lifting doesnt actually burn that many callories, generally speaking, in an absolute sense.

so the difference from what youre doing now, to a high volume approach, is likely not going to be as drastic as you think.


Let your training stimulus be straining stimulus, and let your cardio be cardio. IME when we try to mix the two all we do is fall short on both.


I understand wanting to change up your training to keep it fresh, and training should be fun, but i just wanted to add this bit in in case the above was your primary consideration for the training change

 

[Cohiba]

What are your macros right now?

Reason I ask is because I think high protein, low carb will look a lot different on you with those calories than equally weighted carbs and protein.

I think you're letting yourself get too fluffy during these bulks, and it's making it too hard for you to get back to where you want to be.

You're in good shape, you look better than 98% of the mfkers on the beach man, so stop giving yourself such a hard time. Your work is paying off.

 

[DECLAN]

I'm starting to think even getting shredded is genetic. Why wouldn't it be? If there are hyper responders to training and shit, why not dieting? A lot of these bodybuilders were always lean from the start; many were skinner or leaner dudes who blew up on gear.

How long are you dieting already? I thought you went on vacation and took a break.

I believe you are not giving it time for the fat loss to occur. Remember, if bodybuilders needed minimum 16 weeks to get in contest shape and most start at 12% bf or below.

I'm in the same boat as you, I haven't cut in more than a decade, I have to learn how my body reacts to cutting again. I saw progress around 8 week and stalled again recently at 12 week. I still have 4 weeks to go but I think I need to extend another month just to reach 10-12%. For reference, I probably started around 25-30%.

 

[Deleted member 123722]

Dont overestimate the caloric expenditure from resistance training.

Its my personal opinion is that training intensity should remain as close to the same between a cut and a growing phase, given that lifting doesnt actually burn that many callories, generally speaking, in an absolute sense.

so the difference from what youre doing now, to a high volume approach, is likely not going to be as drastic as you think.


Let your training stimulus be straining stimulus, and let your cardio be cardio. IME when we try to mix the two all we do is fall short on both.


I understand wanting to change up your training to keep it fresh, and training should be fun, but i just wanted to add this bit in in case the above was your primary consideration for the training change

Right, but I did text my friend about this and he was thinking that my trianing isn't intensive enough because I don't break a sweat and I'm not breathing heavy, which is true. That doesn't mean I wasn't hard to do or whatever, but he's thinking that I should make my workouts more volume so there is my energy expended and increase in cardiac activity with shorter rest periods, kind of like how Arnold and them did contest prep.

I did sweat at lot more today and I did enjoy the massive pump from the volume.

What are your macros right now?

Reason I ask is because I think high protein, low carb will look a lot different on you with those calories than equally weighted carbs and protein.

I think you're letting yourself get too fluffy during these bulks, and it's making it too hard for you to get back to where you want to be.

You're in good shape, you look better than 98% of the mfkers on the beach man, so stop giving yourself such a hard time. Your work is paying off.

200 protein, 265 carbs, 100 fat, and that's because I'm at ~2700.

How long are you dieting already? I thought you went on vacation and took a break.

I believe you are not giving it time for the fat loss to occur. Remember, if bodybuilders needed minimum 16 weeks to get in contest shape and most start at 12% bf or below.

I'm in the same boat as you, I haven't cut in more than a decade, I have to learn how my body reacts to cutting again. I saw progress around 8 week and stalled again recently at 12 week. I still have 4 weeks to go but I think I need to extend another month just to reach 10-12%. For reference, I probably started around 25-30%.

I've been dieting since March 1st. I started a 260lbs, using a slight deficit which was 3300 calories. I decreased it by 200 over the weeks. I lost about 30lbs, and I took a diet break for vacation on July 13-17, with no training or dieting, and barely gained anything. So before that, it was was nonstop dieting and training, PPLPPL off, with no breaks whatsoever.

 

[DECLAN]

Right, but I did text my friend about this and he was thinking that my trianing isn't intensive enough because I don't break a sweat and I'm not breathing heavy, which is true. That doesn't mean I wasn't hard to do or whatever, but he's thinking that I should make my workouts more volume so there is my energy expended and increase in cardiac activity with shorter rest periods, kind of like how Arnold and them did contest prep.

I did sweat at lot more today and I did enjoy the massive pump from the volume.



200 protein, 265 carbs, 100 fat, and that's because I'm at ~2700.

I've been dieting since March 1st. I started a 260lbs, using a slight deficit which was 3300 calories. I decreased it by 200 over the weeks. I lost about 30lbs, and I took a diet break for vacation on July 13-17, with no training or dieting, and barely gained anything. So before that, it was was nonstop dieting and training, PPLPPL off, with no breaks whatsoever.

Hmmn maybe the diet break is not long enough? You've been at it for a while, unless you feel your good to go for another diet phase, maybe have a maintenance cruise for another month then do another 16-20 weeks to get shredded.

 

[Cohiba]

200 protein, 265 carbs, 100 fat, and that's because I'm at ~2700.

This is the problem, right here. You're not getting enough protein for one. You weigh 230 lbs, and for a natty guy one would say they should be getting 1g/lbs of bodyweight.

BUT, you're on all kinds of shit that enhances protein synthesis (hgh, test/tren/mast). Your body could very well make use of even more protein that that.

It's not going to be easy, but I'd shoot for 300g of protein a day. Then get enough carbs to stay at that 2700 calories, lower the fat a little too if you can.

A good macro split for you might be 300p/200c/75f.

 

[Deleted member 123722]

This is the problem, right here. You're not getting enough protein for one. You weigh 230 lbs, and for a natty guy one would say they should be getting 1g/lbs of bodyweight.

BUT, you're on all kinds of shit that enhances protein synthesis (hgh, test/tren/mast). Your body could very well make use of even more protein that that.

It's not going to be easy, but I'd shoot for 300g of protein a day. Then get enough carbs to stay at that 2700 calories, lower the fat a little too if you can.

A good macro split for you might be 300p/200c/75f.

I don't disagree, I should at least be at 250g of protein, but this is part of my "diet break" as well, not driving myself nuts on getting certain macro goals, to take that mental break as well.

It's next week that I'm going back full force.

I also am going to "tighten" up my diet as well, since I've been doing IIFYM this entire time. I think it gets to a point where calories are so much lower, you can't do IIFYM.

 

[Deleted member 123722]

Hmmn maybe the diet break is not long enough? You've been at it for a while, unless you feel your good to go for another diet phase, maybe have a maintenance cruise for another month then do another 16-20 weeks to get shredded.

Well some say you should take a month or more off. So instead of me bulking next time, I'll be cutting again.

But then I'm in the same cyclical spin. I think changing my training and tightening the diet may just do the trick.

 

[Jin23]

Its my personal opinion is that training intensity should remain as close to the same between a cut and a growing phase, given that lifting doesnt actually burn that many callories, generally speaking, in an absolute sense.

Yes. And volume should be somewhat dialed down - if you have a modular approach to training, this should be automatic, as MRV will drop on a kcal deficit no matter what you do - because you simply do not need as much volume to hold on to muscle as you need to grow. And besides, weight training volume is much more fatiguing then cardio, which leads to a much greater systemic fatigue accumulation, which then lowers your training intensity.

 

[Deleted member 123722]

I was just thinking: If I've been dieting for 5 months straight, perhaps now is the time to add t3 and use it correctly, at 25mcg per day? I know I swore it off, since last time I used 50mcg per day and abused it, but maybe this time I actually need it?

My thinking is, I don't think adding 25mcg would hurt if its simply replacement dose, being if my t3 is lower now after all this dieting? If it is not low, then I simply replace what I'm already making, and no harm is done. If it is low, then I give my metabolism the boost it needs.


I do plan on running clen again in the near future.

 

[Cohiba]

I don't disagree, I should at least be at 250g of protein, but this is part of my "diet break" as well, not driving myself nuts on getting certain macro goals, to take that mental break as well.

It's next week that I'm going back full force.

I also am going to "tighten" up my diet as well, since I've been doing IIFYM this entire time. I think it gets to a point where calories are so much lower, you can't do IIFYM.

So when you start back, focus on getting an excess of protein. You can make gains on gear even when you're in a slight deficit. Once you don't have enough protein, you're going to start losing muscle.

Your body is not going to turn the excess protein into fat like it will carbs and fats.

 

[Deleted member 123722]

So when you start back, focus on getting an excess of protein. You can make gains on gear even when you're in a slight deficit. Once you don't have enough protein, you're going to start losing muscle.

Your body is not going to turn the excess protein into fat like it will carbs and fats.

Monday I'm starting up again. Gonna make a few tweaks to everything.

 

[SippinCoffee]

I feel your pain buddy. In my 20s I could get down to 190 and be 10% bf no problem. Now I'm 37 and 6'1 240lbs. I do look good and this last cycle I just finish 2 weeks ago has my arms and upper back looking great, but I can't get my weight down enough to where my midsection looks decent.

It's dumb that we go to the beach and feel self conscious about how we look. Other guys see us and wish they looked like this. But then again if we were complacent we probably wouldn't look like we do. I saw someone on here one day say that everyone of us look in the mirror and don't like what we see otherwise we wouldn't be here and that's made more and more sense.

Truth is, you're a beast and a lot of men left the beach salty AF after seeing you on vacation.

 

[BigTomJ]

Yes. And volume should be somewhat dialed down - if you have a modular approach to training, this should be automatic, as MRV will drop on a kcal deficit no matter what you do - because you simply do not need as much volume to hold on to muscle as you need to grow. And besides, weight training volume is much more fatiguing then cardio, which leads to a much greater systemic fatigue accumulation, which then lowers your training intensity.

Exactly, couldn't have said it better. Save the energy and fatigue for a bit of actual cardio

 

[Deleted member 123722]

Exactly, couldn't have said it better. Save the energy and fatigue for a bit of actual cardio

Would you think it is better to increase output via cardio than decrease calorie any further?

 

[narta]

Would you think it is better to increase output via cardio than decrease calorie any further?

Of course it's better. Burning fuel has a far better metabolic response than not having enough fuel to burn

 

[Deleted member 123722]

So let's suppose my metabolism is beat up from the five months dieting straight; perhaps I should eat at slightly lower than new maintenance, and I just use cardio to burn fat off.

 

[BigTomJ]

Would you think it is better to increase output via cardio than decrease calorie any further?

It's a balance.
You can only do so much cardio, and you can only reduce intake so much.

Generally I like to max out the cardio first that you can manage with your time and effort, then start digging deep on the intake.
You'll feel better in general keeping as much good as you can in and making up the deficit in expenditure. Within reason of course

 

[BigTomJ]

So let's suppose my metabolism is beat up from the five months dieting straight; perhaps I should eat at slightly lower than new maintenance, and I just use cardio to burn fat off.

If you've been aggressively cutting for 5 months straight I think a period at maintenance calories or just slightly bellow, with a little cardio will do well for your morale and will help you retain what youve grown so far