Anabolic Steroids & Liver [GI]

Genetics pay a huge roll in how your liver will process toxins. I've had blood work done while on oral steroids + partying averaging an 18-pack of beer a day. Liver enzymes only slightly elevated. When IP first started selling sulfasalazine (liver cure) I took it daily and my liver enzymes were just fine no matter how much I drank.

Dialysis machines are for a failing liver isn't all that common. Check out the studies on sulfasalazine for cirrhosis of the liver from drinking. There have been a few. A key one was in England. It may help him. IP is retired & Mao is gone as well, I believe. They were the only sources I knew who carried it.
 
Sinclair M, Grossmann M, Gow PJ, Angus PW. Testosterone in Men with Advanced Liver Disease: Abnormalities and Implications. J Gastroenterol Hepatol. http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/jgh.12695/abstract

Serum testosterone is reduced in up to 90% of men with cirrhosis, with levels falling as liver disease advances.

Testosterone is an important anabolic hormone, with effects on muscle, bone, and haematopoiesis. Many of the features of advanced liver disease are similar to those seen in hypogonadal men, including sarcopenia, osteoporosis, gynecomastia and low libido. However the relative contribution of testosterone deficiency to the symptomatology of advanced liver disease has not been well established.

More recently it has been demonstrated that low testosterone in men with cirrhosis is associated with increased mortality, independent of the classically recognised prognostic factors such as MELD score. Only several small clinical trials have examined the role of testosterone therapy in men with cirrhosis, none of which have resolved the issue of whether or not testosterone is beneficial.

However, in men with organic hypogonadism due to structural hypothalamic-pituitary-testicular axis disease, testosterone therapy has been shown to improve muscle mass, bone mineral density, increase haemoglobin and reduce insulin resistance.

Despite initial concerns linking testosterone with hepatocellular carcinoma, more recent data suggests that this risk has been overstated. There is therefore now a strong rationale to assess the efficacy and safety of testosterone therapy in cirrhosis in well-designed randomised controlled trials.
 
Nothing for liver damage? The British study appeared particularly promising.

Can you post the abstract or the journals name, date, year and volume number and I'll be happy to look into it mate.

That being said, many studies have looked promising initially until confirmation research, which includes the required volume of patients needed to evaluate statistical significance, is completed.

Regs
Jim
 
I'll find it sometime today. It showed great promise in reversing cirrhosis based scarring.
 
This citation references a study which showed a reversal of hepatic fibrosis in RATS treated with Sulfa! There are some VERY important physiological differences between rats and human toxin derived liver disease. The primary difference for unknown reasons the rodent hepatic system lacks the regenerative capabilities of homosapiens in many respects.

In this instance the important difference is rodents are MUCH more apt to develop acute hepatic failure when exposed to the same toxins, that results in a more chronic or cumulative effect in humans.

Moreover rodents regenerative ability results in septa (spaces between liver cells) separation. This process would quite likely WORSEN any preexisting portal hypertension, which by definition every patient with cirrhosis has to one degree or another, and is a HUGE cause of mortality in humans. (These are good reasons to completely ignore AAS related hepatic dysfunction in rodents also IMO, especially those based on changes in hepatic enzymes)

Finally I could not locate any studies during my BRIEF Medline search in which Sulfasalazine was used as a form of PROPHYLAXIS, that is as a means of PREVENTING liver disease, which is the intent of using "liver protectors" while consuming oral AAS, right?

I mean the very reasoning for discontinuing ANY drug that causes liver toxicity is to PREVENT hepatic fibrosis, which exclusive of isolated forms of therapy such as interferon and antivirals for hepatitis, is largely irreversible!

Another salient yet overlooked difference in hepatic research is the livers NATURAL ability to restore functionality in spite of the abuse we "humans" impose upon it. It's a marvel we live beyond our "teen years", lol (However do media outlets mention this very important characteristic, most do NOT for a variety of reasons, yet unfortunately enhanced sales seems to be the primary motive, IMO)

No but the important point is how difficult it is to determine whether a specific therapy such as Sulfa is responsible for improvement, or was the livers regenerative capability the reason "reversal was noted"!

So what does my diatribe mean? I've seen this many times before: promising initial studies with a limited account of potentially responsible variables, small number of patients, animal models extrapolated to humans, etc, etc, etc.

Consequently, I see no use for Sulfasalazine as prophylaxis for AAS associated hepatic toxicity, especially considering how VERY RARE it is, excluding media hype to the contrary.

Thanks for the posts and commentary, its really appreciated because all on Meso may benefit, including yours truly :)
JIM
 
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Excellent posts as always doctor. Thank you for putting so much time, effort, and knowledge in to help others out!

My liver seems to be able to take more than most. How much is genetics playing a role in liver or other organ damage/disease in your opinion?

Thanks again.
 
Although there are probably a few "ethnic" differences, such as why some "alcoholics" develop cirrhosis and some do not, overall toxins are toxins and challenging the consumption based limits of genetic variance is ill advised. Thus moderation is key, IMO

Regs
jim
 
OK, I would like to get Both Doctors Opinions on these 3 Supplements for the Liver.
Liv-52 DS - Tudca - NAC.
As I take All 3, this is my Question, can I Eliminate 1 in Favor of the Other Two.
What do you think about the Info on Clinical Studies................ JP
P.S.
Had a Conversation with my Rheumatologist, and she had Concerns with the Liv-52.
Because it's not made in the U.S., and has many Herbals in it.
Concerns of Purity and Potency.
 
All THREE are an absolute WASTE OF MONEY!

NO STUDY (that I'm aware of) has shown they "protect the liver" from "toxins", as a prophylactic measure!

Regs
Jim
 
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Dr. Jim, what about UDCA? What do you suggest for liver protection if not NAC, Liv52? Is milk thistle also useless?
 
Was looking to get either 1 of u to answer the question about orals, is water consumption our best defense or would either of u recommend something?

Thx for taking the time to review this post.


The Green Machine

Casca

Hell if anyone else wants to chime in, MythoTiK? What say you, is it really that simple? I ask because you see so many telling us otherwise. I would rather spend my money where it counts!!!!
 
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