Bringing natural medicine to bodybuilding

hmmm...somehow my post magically dissapeared...I simply made an observation about how unprofessional Mr. Scally seemed with his always being on here and going back and forth with members...And wondered aloud if this was due to him being rich and not needing patients, and therefore has a lot of time on his hands. Somehow I think this post will be removed as well. Real class act.

I've already banned two users and deleted their posts who signed up specifically to make personal attacks against HANS. You apparently signed up specifically to attack Dr. SCally personally with your first post. You are banned as well. We don't need trolls to disrupt the forum. Goodbye.
 
hmmm...somehow my post magically dissapeared...I simply made an observation about how unprofessional Mr. Scally seemed with his always being on here and going back and forth with members...And wondered aloud if this was due to him being rich and not needing patients, and therefore has a lot of time on his hands. Somehow I think this post will be removed as well. Real class act.

The orginal purpose of this thread was to bring the idea of a more healthier approach to the sport then all of sudden it gets completely blown off subject with illogical and unprofessional rants attacking my intregity along with members that have been here for year donating their times and experiences.

The point being is that Scally has his views and approach. I have my approaches that work with me..
Miilard i appreciate your consideration greatly.
 
The point being is that Scally has his views and approach. I have my approaches that work with me..
Miilard i appreciate your consideration greatly.


Exactly! What I want to learn is how you come about your conclusions. Apparently, according to you, this is only known to you. As long as you are clear that you have no scientific support for your treatments, they are based on experience alone, I have no argument/debate. This way all will [not] know how you go about making recommendations.
 
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Exactly! What I want to learn is how you come about your conclusions. Apparently, according to you, this is only known to you. As long as you are clear that you have no scientific support for your treatments, they are based on experience alone, I have no argument/debate. This way all will [not] know how you go about making recommendations.

Principles I use are heavily documented on gov.t data bases
1) methylaytion issue and mutations I finding in people are increasing
2) thyroid and mineral metabolism
3) nutient deficiency and effects enyzmatic pathways that are altered.
4) hormone and receptors binding at cellular levels by altering prostaglandins
5) improper sleep and its affects on the body.
6) impaired intestinal absorption based on food allergies.testing.

Reason I do not mention it because other people have stolen it and taken credit for it..
 
HAN, i'm just a noob immersed in my own health issues as a hobby. sometimes ur claims sound shaky, which goes with the territory of being non-conformist. i understand that it may be burdensome to answer every question in a manner that the questioner desires, especially when u may be synthesizing several sources of evidence-based knowledge with ur own professional experience and intuition. however, i would hope that u can concede that such a disposition can naturally make people wonder about ur efficacy and legitimacy.

i do NOT mean this as an attack, in the past u have made claims that have really interested me...when i've asked u for substantiation, u've ignored me. in my case that may be understandable, since i'm a verbose noob, but overall such a habit can leave u seeming defensive and oblique.

any treatments based on non-traditional practices will bring varying degrees of skepticism and hostility, simply bcuz there is a great deal of intentional fraud and self-serving delusion in the alternative treatment community. there r also non-standard treatments that produce positive results and improved health outcomes...the burden on non-traditional practitioners to "prove themselves" may be unfair, but efforts at acknowledging and sometimes satisfying such inquiry go a long way to helping people sort wheat from chaff...and advance support for those alternative treatments that work.
 
DNA methylation is essential for normal development and is associated with a number of key processes including genomic imprinting, X-chromosome inactivation, suppression of repetitive elements and carcinogenesis.

It sounds as though it would be hard to mess this up.
 
i do NOT mean this as an attack, in the past u have made claims that have really interested me...when i've asked u for substantiation, u've ignored me. in my case that may be understandable, since i'm a verbose noob, but overall such a habit can leave u seeming defensive and oblique.

I tend to agree. A lot of "hit and run" answers. But, it's his business to get you as a customer. That's not a slam either, it's economicsl
 
I tend to agree. A lot of "hit and run" answers. But, it's his business to get you as a customer. That's not a slam either, it's economicsl

i wonder if HAN might consider keeping a blog or other source detailing his theories and professional experiences, so that when noobs like me ask questions that may require onerously long answers, he could at least reply "check page 2, middle paragraphs in this section of my site" so that we can get some kind answer without bogging him down with explanations and justifications. any legitimate health practitioner's time is valuable, and i'm grateful for every trained professional that chooses to contribute here to any extent.

i just get greedy for info is all. :)
 
Lots of cat fighting on this board! I do have concerns when a provider, consultant, or whatever he/she defines themselves as doesn't have a website, written materials, and other things you can research to make an educated decision.

Does HAN and Michael Scully, M.D. work together at all? What I don't understand is if HAN has helped so many here why there aren't tons of posts on the thread telling us what he did for them and the success they experienced. Everyone likes to share successes, right?

I have spent SO much money on medical stuff, alternative providers, and other stuff. I'm very cautious before I jump in the pond now. I saw a medical provider who did ART (Autonomic Response Testing) a few months ago. Strangely, every visit they found I needed $200-$300 of supplements. Furthermore, wouldn't you know they are were sold there. :) The person was a well-educated M.D., but they just didn't take time to look at my medical history. They were sure their methods were foolproof. I can't say one way or the other, but like I said I tread carefully. That doc at least had a website.
 
Lots of cat fighting on this board! I do have concerns when a provider, consultant, or whatever he/she defines themselves as doesn't have a website, written materials, and other things you can research to make an educated decision.

Does HAN and Michael Scully, M.D. work together at all? [It would be nice, but there are a few obstacles.] What I don't understand is if HAN has helped so many here why there aren't tons of posts on the thread telling us what he did for them and the success they experienced. Everyone likes to share successes, right?

I have spent SO much money on medical stuff, alternative providers, and other stuff. I'm very cautious before I jump in the pond now. I saw a medical provider who did ART (Autonomic Response Testing) a few months ago. Strangely, every visit they found I needed $200-$300 of supplements. Furthermore, wouldn't you know they are were sold there. :) The person was a well-educated M.D., but they just didn't take time to look at my medical history. They were sure their methods were foolproof. I can't say one way or the other, but like I said I tread carefully. That doc at least had a website.


Good Post

Confucius: “A fool despises good counsel, but a wise man takes it to heart.”

[Confucius also says, “When you know a thing, to hold that you know it; and when you do not know a thing, to allow that you do not know it – this is knowledge.”]
 
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Good Post

Confucius: “A fool despises good counsel, but a wise man takes it to heart.”

[Confucius also says, “When you know a thing, to hold that you know it; and when you do not know a thing, to allow that you do not know it – this is knowledge.”]

Mike - I'm assuming by your last few posts that you spent some time today watching the Karate Kid.

:popcorn:
 
Lots of cat fighting on this board! I do have concerns when a provider, consultant, or whatever he/she defines themselves as doesn't have a website, written materials, and other things you can research to make an educated decision.

Does HAN and Michael Scully, M.D. work together at all? What I don't understand is if HAN has helped so many here why there aren't tons of posts on the thread telling us what he did for them and the success they experienced. Everyone likes to share successes, right?

I have spent SO much money on medical stuff, alternative providers, and other stuff. I'm very cautious before I jump in the pond now. I saw a medical provider who did ART (Autonomic Response Testing) a few months ago. Strangely, every visit they found I needed $200-$300 of supplements. Furthermore, wouldn't you know they are were sold there. :) The person was a well-educated M.D., but they just didn't take time to look at my medical history. They were sure their methods were foolproof. I can't say one way or the other, but like I said I tread carefully. That doc at least had a website.


About a year ago, I came on to this forum very desperate and actually ended up traveling to go see Han and Dr. O all the way from Florida. At the time, I believed all the hype and thought that he could get me back on track and would be the missing link I needed to get healthy again. In reality and in the long run, I virtually had to figure out all my own problems during every step of my treatment and the treatment itself was botched. Of course I am very disappointed that this happened, but the only positive for me was that I learned alot about various medical topics through my own research and trial and errors and feel that I am close regaining my health.

Overall, the results have been mixed. There has been alot of ups and downs and if I had to do over again, I would have probably never went up there. Most people who would seek his services are probably either very frustrated with their own doctors or in a very desperate heath situation and need help quickly. This is can make a patient very vulnerable and willing to believe almost anything.

The Pros were that in the beginning he was there for me when I was at a very low point in my life and really needed just someone to say that I had a chance to get healthy again. We talked about various medical issues and it sounded like we were going to make some progress, and this can really lift a persons spirits. I definetely needed it and have always thanked him for being there at that time even if it did not work out that great in the long run.

The Cons were that during my treatment, my health got worse from a medicine that he prescribed me and then I was left on my own to figure out what went wrong and how to try and fix it. And the medicine was cortef, for adrenal support. As I started working my way up to 10mg with the cortef, I first started to feel very jittery and nervous and just plain awful. I mentioned this and they did not really know what to say and pushed me to go for 20 mg because the "cortef needed to push the thyroid in the cells." Then as I got up to 20mg, I felt very bad, once again no help. I actually had trouble getting ahold of them during this process as well, which was like a double whammy. Taking something a doctor prescribes, you start to feel very bad, and then not have them there to ask questions or get their advice on what I should do. Imagine that.

After staying at 20mg for a few weeks, I started get some serious symptoms in my central nervous systems such as alot of pain in head, neck, spine, and some numbness in limbs, etc. that was very scary for me. This is when I am the most disappointed with the treatment. Once I started to develop these symptoms, both Han and Dr. O basically left me out to rot. They did not want anything to do with me and that is pretty sad. But I have learned that thats how some doctors work and have accepted that. What would have been nice and what a Doctors in my opinion should do, is when things don't work out like there supposed to or a patient is getting worse, that is the time when a Doctor needs to dig deep and really try to help a patient. The only one digging deep and trying to figure out what went wrong and get healthy again was me. But I have learned alot in this process.

Also during my treatment, he seemed like he was wrong on predictions almost every step of the way. One week it would be like your thyroid is screwed, and little time would go by and he would be like oh actually, I think you never even had a thyroid problem to begin with. Or he would say something like, I am sure the "xyz" level is going to be depleted and that is why you feel so bad and this lab that I just ordered for you will tell us that. And then when the lab comes back, the "xyz" level is actually ok. These are just a few examples of many, but you get the point. This happened on many lab tests and various levels one can measure in the human body.

I have spent the past few months running tests at Cleveland Clinic and other hosptials to check for a barage of major illnesses that could be affecting me and the good thing is that nothing has came back very bad yet. I still am feeling pretty awful, but at least I know I am not dying or have some terrible disease, and that is big relief for me. I am going to post a thread soon asking for everyone's help to try and regain my health.

In summary, I think it is completely justified that people question Hans judgement or anyone else judgement who wants to put themself out there as person who knows alot about medical subjects and comes on to these forums and tells people what they have or don't have going on,. And this not the first time that people have called him out on things he says. What people need to understand when they come on these forums and others, is that you cannot believe everything you read or someone tells you. You have do alot of research and look at multiple opinions before you come to any conclusion. And the research and everything else is out there for you to view. The internet is great for this. You can learn so much, but you also have to be careful at the same time. And as far as Doctors go, don't think Han or others are the only ones who can get people on various forums healthy again. There alot of good people and doctors on forums who love to help people. However, there are also alot of good docs out there right in your own neighborhood. You just have to know what type of doctor could possibly help you. I will say though that I have learned so much from this forum and am very grateful that it is available to all of us.
 
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Big Pete you may have just shined a light on everything that so many people have questioned for so long. Most of what you said has truthful roots from what I've hear and experienced from people and just being on this forum listening to what has been said by people. This is the first I've heard anyone really publically come out and say something like this though. It takes guts, but it may save countless people from despair or wasted resources and precious time.
 
About a year ago, I came on to this forum very desperate and actually ended up traveling to go see Han and Dr. O all the way from Florida. At the time, I believed all the hype and thought that he could get me back on track and would be the missing link I needed to get healthy again. In reality and in the long run, I virtually had to figure out all my own problems during every step of my treatment and the treatment itself was botched. Of course I am very disappointed that this happened, but the only positive for me was that I learned alot about various medical topics through my own research and trial and errors and feel that I am close regaining my health.

Overall, the results have been mixed. There has been alot of ups and downs and if I had to do over again, I would have probably never went up there. Most people who would seek his services are probably either very frustrated with their own doctors or in a very desperate heath situation and need help quickly. This is can make a patient very vulnerable and willing to believe almost anything.

The Pros were that in the beginning he was there for me when I was at a very low point in my life and really needed just someone to say that I had a chance to get healthy again. We talked about various medical issues and it sounded like we were going to make some progress, and this can really lift a persons spirits. I definetely needed it and have always thanked him for being there at that time even if it did not work out that great in the long run.

The Cons were that during my treatment, my health got worse from a medicine that he prescribed me and then I was left on my own to figure out what went wrong and how to try and fix it. And the medicine was cortef, for adrenal support. As I started working my way up to 10mg with the cortef, I first started to feel very jittery and nervous and just plain awful. I mentioned this and they did not really know what to say and pushed me to go for 20 mg because the "cortef needed to push the thyroid in the cells." Then as I got up to 20mg, I felt very bad, once again no help. I actually had trouble getting ahold of them during this process as well, which was like a double whammy. Taking something a doctor prescribes, you start to feel very bad, and then not have them there to ask questions or get their advice on what I should do. Imagine that.

I am the most disappointed with the treatment. Once I started to develop these symptoms, both Han and Dr. O basically left me out to rot. They did not want anything to do with me and that is pretty sad. But I have learned that thats how some doctors work and have accepted that. What would have been nice and what a Doctors in my opinion should do, is when things don't work out like there supposed to or a patient is getting worse, that is the time when a Doctor needs to dig deep and really try to help a patient. The only one digging deep and trying to figure out what went wrong and get healthy again was me. But I have learned alot in this process.

Also during my treatment, he seemed like he was wrong on predictions almost every step of the way. One week it would be like your thyroid is screwed, and little time would go by and he would be like oh actually, I think you never even had a thyroid problem to begin with. Or he would say something like, I am sure the "xyz" level is going to be depleted and that is why you feel so bad and this lab that I just ordered for you will tell us that. And then when the lab comes back, the "xyz" level is actually ok. These are just a few examples of many, but you get the point. This happened on many lab tests and various levels one can measure in the human body.

In summary, I think it is completely justified that people question Hans judgement or anyone else judgement who wants to put themself out there as person who knows alot about medical subjects and comes on to these forums and tells people what they have or don't have going on,. And this not the first time that people have called him out on things he says. What people need to understand when they come on these forums and others, is that you cannot believe everything you read or someone tells you. You have do alot of research and look at multiple opinions before you come to any conclusion. And the research and everything else is out there for you to view. The internet is great for this. You can learn so much, but you also have to be careful at the same time. And as far as Doctors go, don't think Han or others are the only ones who can get people on various forums healthy again. There alot of good people and doctors on forums who love to help people. However, there are also alot of good docs out there right in your own neighborhood. You just have to know what type of doctor could possibly help you. I will say though that I have learned so much from this forum and am very grateful that it is available to all of us.

I thought you had been reading my diary. Except I went from Texas. At least you got prescriptions. I was told to go overseas to get them. Everything else you've stated mirrors my experience. 6000.00 in tests weren't enough to properly help me.
I wasn't going to say anyting in open forum because I was thinking there were some he seems to help.
Was told my insurance wouldn't pay so I covered office visit. Insurance paid but no refund to me. Then he wanted 100.00 for a 10 munite phone call where I had to give my lab numbers while he was at dinner.(background noise)
Now he is going overseas to be a "personal trainer"? Too bad for his clients. Well at least he will soon be offering a cure for cancer.
 
I thought you had been reading my diary. Except I went from Texas. At least you got prescriptions. I was told to go overseas to get them. Everything else you've stated mirrors my experience. 6000.00 in tests weren't enough to properly help me.
I wasn't going to say anyting in open forum because I was thinking there were some he seems to help.
Was told my insurance wouldn't pay so I covered office visit. Insurance paid but no refund to me. Then he wanted 100.00 for a 10 munite phone call where I had to give my lab numbers while he was at dinner.(background noise)
Now he is going overseas to be a "personal trainer"? Too bad for his clients. Well at least he will soon be offering a cure for cancer.


I am sorry that your experience was bad as well. It is great that this issue has been brought up because I am sure we aren't the only ones who went to see him or he is treating in some way. I am going to be starting a thread pretty soon that covers a variety of issues related to my heath. Maybe it will be able to help you or you will be able to help me. We have probably went through similar testing, etc. In the meantime, what I could offer for advice is keep researching on issues affecting your health and look for doc that might be able to help. If you haven't had too much sucess with traditional docs in your area, try searching for ones that think outside the box. Such as a holistic, integrative, functional, anti-aging, natural, etc. A few good websites to start are the

Acam website
Functional medicine index website
WHO anti-aging website
Or even possibly a chiropractor that is very familiar a variety of health topics
 
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About a year ago, I came on to this forum very desperate and actually ended up traveling to go see Han and Dr. O all the way from Florida. At the time, I believed all the hype and thought that he could get me back on track and would be the missing link I needed to get healthy again. In reality and in the long run, I virtually had to figure out all my own problems during every step of my treatment and the treatment itself was botched. Of course I am very disappointed that this happened, but the only positive for me was that I learned alot about various medical topics through my own research and trial and errors and feel that I am close regaining my health.

Overall, the results have been mixed. There has been alot of ups and downs and if I had to do over again, I would have probably never went up there. Most people who would seek his services are probably either very frustrated with their own doctors or in a very desperate heath situation and need help quickly. This is can make a patient very vulnerable and willing to believe almost anything.

The Pros were that in the beginning he was there for me when I was at a very low point in my life and really needed just someone to say that I had a chance to get healthy again. We talked about various medical issues and it sounded like we were going to make some progress, and this can really lift a persons spirits. I definetely needed it and have always thanked him for being there at that time even if it did not work out that great in the long run.

The Cons were that during my treatment, my health got worse from a medicine that he prescribed me and then I was left on my own to figure out what went wrong and how to try and fix it. And the medicine was cortef, for adrenal support. As I started working my way up to 10mg with the cortef, I first started to feel very jittery and nervous and just plain awful. I mentioned this and they did not really know what to say and pushed me to go for 20 mg because the "cortef needed to push the thyroid in the cells." Then as I got up to 20mg, I felt very bad, once again no help. I actually had trouble getting ahold of them during this process as well, which was like a double whammy. Taking something a doctor prescribes, you start to feel very bad, and then not have them there to ask questions or get their advice on what I should do. Imagine that.

After staying at 20mg for a few weeks, I started get some serious symptoms in my central nervous systems such as alot of pain in head, neck, spine, and some numbness in limbs, etc. that was very scary for me. This is when I am the most disappointed with the treatment. Once I started to develop these symptoms, both Han and Dr. O basically left me out to rot. They did not want anything to do with me and that is pretty sad. But I have learned that thats how some doctors work and have accepted that. What would have been nice and what a Doctors in my opinion should do, is when things don't work out like there supposed to or a patient is getting worse, that is the time when a Doctor needs to dig deep and really try to help a patient. The only one digging deep and trying to figure out what went wrong and get healthy again was me. But I have learned alot in this process.

Also during my treatment, he seemed like he was wrong on predictions almost every step of the way. One week it would be like your thyroid is screwed, and little time would go by and he would be like oh actually, I think you never even had a thyroid problem to begin with. Or he would say something like, I am sure the "xyz" level is going to be depleted and that is why you feel so bad and this lab that I just ordered for you will tell us that. And then when the lab comes back, the "xyz" level is actually ok. These are just a few examples of many, but you get the point. This happened on many lab tests and various levels one can measure in the human body.

I have spent the past few months running tests at Cleveland Clinic and other hosptials to check for a barage of major illnesses that could be affecting me and the good thing is that nothing has came back very bad yet. I still am feeling pretty awful, but at least I know I am not dying or have some terrible disease, and that is big relief for me. I am going to post a thread soon asking for everyone's help to try and regain my health.

In summary, I think it is completely justified that people question Hans judgement or anyone else judgement who wants to put themself out there as person who knows alot about medical subjects and comes on to these forums and tells people what they have or don't have going on,. And this not the first time that people have called him out on things he says. What people need to understand when they come on these forums and others, is that you cannot believe everything you read or someone tells you. You have do alot of research and look at multiple opinions before you come to any conclusion. And the research and everything else is out there for you to view. The internet is great for this. You can learn so much, but you also have to be careful at the same time. And as far as Doctors go, don't think Han or others are the only ones who can get people on various forums healthy again. There alot of good people and doctors on forums who love to help people. However, there are also alot of good docs out there right in your own neighborhood. You just have to know what type of doctor could possibly help you. I will say though that I have learned so much from this forum and am very grateful that it is available to all of us.


This is really frustrating to read, considering my upcoming trip to Shawn and Dr. Overbeck in two weeks. How was the need for CORTEF confirmed? Saliva testing? Through my own reading I believe that my problems have something to do with a nasty stress/cortisol cycle that I cannot break. And believe me I am DE-SPER-ATE to regain my health right now.
 
I am sorry that your experience was bad as well. It is great that this issue has been brought up because I am sure we aren't the only ones who went to see him or he is treating in some way. I am going to be starting a thread pretty soon that covers a variety of issues related to my heath. Maybe it will be able to help you or you will be able to help me. We have probably went through similar testing, etc. In the meantime, what I could offer for advice is keep researching on issues affecting your health and look for doc that might be able to help. If you haven't had too much sucess with traditional docs in your area, try searching for ones that think outside the box. Such as a holistic, integrative, functional, anti-aging, natural, etc. A few good websites to start are the

Acam website
Functional medicine index website
WHO anti-aging website
Or even possibly a chiropractor that is very familiar a variety of health topics

Pete you have have the audacity to go online and say this
Common Pete how many hours I spend on the phone with you FREE on my own time trying to help you to best of my knowledge and in the end I WAS RIGHT !! IT WAS YOUR GUT. That fact you can not DENY
Want me to pull up my cell phone bill to show you ? I know of about 6 callls that lasted over an hour at a time.
Pete didn't I say heal the gut will take stress off your adrenals?
..DO NOT BELEIVE ME GO BACK AND READ THE POSTS. Did not I identify it in the office right through muscle testin? DIDN"T I are you going to lie deny that. You can not go back and change your post so the truth lies in there.

We can not do a damn thing till we have correspondence from your other Dr's which we never recieved.
You have 5 different types of dr's going at one time and we need to know what end is up. you are a complex case which have multiple layers to content with, but still you want further testing that I sent out over a month ago and never recieved. I can not help that..Pete we are just one dr in among of seas of dr working on your case. Tell you the truth spending all that time on heavy metal detox will not do crap because the problem is in your gut as I told you over a year ago. but you still are chasing shadows
Yes pete we did go deeper we were the only ones to truly reveal what the was going on inside you, but then bash us for helping.


MOB after spending 3 fucken hours on the phone with you of MY OWN TIME BECAUSE I FELT COMPELLED where i spefically told you months ago what the hell was going on. your going to stand here and fucking back stabbed me too.

YOU KNOW WHAT FOR EVERY NEGATIVE THING THERE ARE 1,000 Positive....

BTW GUYS I NEVER TREAT DR DOES THAT I SUGGEST SO GET YOUR STORIES STRAIGHT !!
 
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About a year ago, I came on to this forum very desperate and actually ended up traveling to go see Han and Dr. O all the way from Florida. At the time, I believed all the hype and thought that he could get me back on track and would be the missing link I needed to get healthy again. In reality and in the long run, I virtually had to figure out all my own problems during every step of my treatment and the treatment itself was botched. Of course I am very disappointed that this happened, but the only positive for me was that I learned alot about various medical topics through my own research and trial and errors and feel that I am close regaining my health.

Overall, the results have been mixed. There has been alot of ups and downs and if I had to do over again, I would have probably never went up there. Most people who would seek his services are probably either very frustrated with their own doctors or in a very desperate heath situation and need help quickly. This is can make a patient very vulnerable and willing to believe almost anything.

The Pros were that in the beginning he was there for me when I was at a very low point in my life and really needed just someone to say that I had a chance to get healthy again. We talked about various medical issues and it sounded like we were going to make some progress, and this can really lift a persons spirits. I definetely needed it and have always thanked him for being there at that time even if it did not work out that great in the long run.

The Cons were that during my treatment, my health got worse from a medicine that he prescribed me and then I was left on my own to figure out what went wrong and how to try and fix it. And the medicine was cortef, for adrenal support. As I started working my way up to 10mg with the cortef, I first started to feel very jittery and nervous and just plain awful. I mentioned this and they did not really know what to say and pushed me to go for 20 mg because the "cortef needed to push the thyroid in the cells." Then as I got up to 20mg, I felt very bad, once again no help. I actually had trouble getting ahold of them during this process as well, which was like a double whammy. Taking something a doctor prescribes, you start to feel very bad, and then not have them there to ask questions or get their advice on what I should do. Imagine that.

After staying at 20mg for a few weeks, I started get some serious symptoms in my central nervous systems such as alot of pain in head, neck, spine, and some numbness in limbs, etc. that was very scary for me. This is when I am the most disappointed with the treatment. Once I started to develop these symptoms, both Han and Dr. O basically left me out to rot. They did not want anything to do with me and that is pretty sad. But I have learned that thats how some doctors work and have accepted that. What would have been nice and what a Doctors in my opinion should do, is when things don't work out like there supposed to or a patient is getting worse, that is the time when a Doctor needs to dig deep and really try to help a patient. The only one digging deep and trying to figure out what went wrong and get healthy again was me. But I have learned alot in this process.

Also during my treatment, he seemed like he was wrong on predictions almost every step of the way. One week it would be like your thyroid is screwed, and little time would go by and he would be like oh actually, I think you never even had a thyroid problem to begin with. Or he would say something like, I am sure the "xyz" level is going to be depleted and that is why you feel so bad and this lab that I just ordered for you will tell us that. And then when the lab comes back, the "xyz" level is actually ok. These are just a few examples of many, but you get the point. This happened on many lab tests and various levels one can measure in the human body.

I have spent the past few months running tests at Cleveland Clinic and other hosptials to check for a barage of major illnesses that could be affecting me and the good thing is that nothing has came back very bad yet. I still am feeling pretty awful, but at least I know I am not dying or have some terrible disease, and that is big relief for me. I am going to post a thread soon asking for everyone's help to try and regain my health.

In summary, I think it is completely justified that people question Hans judgement or anyone else judgement who wants to put themself out there as person who knows alot about medical subjects and comes on to these forums and tells people what they have or don't have going on,. And this not the first time that people have called him out on things he says. What people need to understand when they come on these forums and others, is that you cannot believe everything you read or someone tells you. You have do alot of research and look at multiple opinions before you come to any conclusion. And the research and everything else is out there for you to view. The internet is great for this. You can learn so much, but you also have to be careful at the same time. And as far as Doctors go, don't think Han or others are the only ones who can get people on various forums healthy again. There alot of good people and doctors on forums who love to help people. However, there are also alot of good docs out there right in your own neighborhood. You just have to know what type of doctor could possibly help you. I will say though that I have learned so much from this forum and am very grateful that it is available to all of us.

I cant believe I woke up today and read these posts on what I though was only in my head and happening to me for a long time!! Unbelievable!!

I'm so upset about this experience that I won't even waste my time explaining everything that I went through and never saw the light at the end of the tunnel.

I got the longest list of excuses for why no solution has worked. Every supplement was recommend as the reason why my health never improved because I was deficient in that. Each time I took that supplement and nothing happened then it was onto the next excuse.

I properly kept track of every conversation and consultation and things never added up. There was not any improvement in quality of life and libido nor a sign that it would improve at all.

The conclusion that I arose to was that they could not fix me. Everything that was being suggested was because they had no other solutions. I am glad to have moved on.
 
This is really frustrating to read, considering my upcoming trip to Shawn and Dr. Overbeck in two weeks. How was the need for CORTEF confirmed? Saliva testing? Through my own reading I believe that my problems have something to do with a nasty stress/cortisol cycle that I cannot break. And believe me I am DE-SPER-ATE to regain my health right now.

Everything was medically validated via salivia and blood testing symptoms.. honestly with all stuff going on in the gut people can become allergic to one of the binders which most likely was the case medically it was necessary and had validation.
Since past year we have learned so much more about things and have things down working with so many others. AGAIN PEOPLE BLAME ONE THING which could be a multiplitude of things going on esepcially in complex cases.

When delaing with gut issues anything can happen, but obviously people will not get better till the cause of the issue which has been identified BY US which no other dr even considered but we get the bed mouth for helping shine light on the situation.
So do not let 3 people out of several hundred get your hopes down.
MOB- I was DEAD ON with but stabbed me in the back
PETE - NO other Dr that he had been to found the main issue..WE DID ... ENOUGH SAID...

Others well you can not please every one all the time then we would not be human...
 

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