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Classic Fentanyl synthesis is fairly straightforward, and the synthesis of many fentanyl class opiods are covered in several organic chemistry that can be found at any college bookstore. There's even a one pot synthesis that has been done with good results and high yields.
My initial idea was to mix fentanyl base with it's molar equivalent of citric acid to yield fentanyl citrate, as it dissociates in water while fentanyl base does not. The base does, however, dissolve in methanol- results of IV injection of a methanol/fentanyl solution would likely result in the death of the user. So, fentanyl citrate.
The problem in the synthesis is not the manufacture process itself, which is effortless, but in the acquisition of precursors. N-Phenethyl-Piperidone, it's precursors Piperidone and Phenethylbromine, 4-anilino-N-phenethylpiperidine, and aniline are all on the DEA list of watched chemicals.
This can be avoided through synthesis of the precursors using simpler organic compounds, though many reagents would have to be purchased through unconventional means. Further difficulty is presented with the synthesis of 4-Piperidone, and while there are several methods, few are practical or affordable. Sciencemadness has several great threads on the subject. Feel free to check them out.
I could go on and walk you through the whole synthesis, open ChemLab and draw up structures and formulas, discuss why carfentanyl would be a much more profitable and just as easy to manufacture, the dangers of running a fentanyl lab, or the risks involved in synthesis, but I won't. There's no point.
Truthfully, there were a few reasons I never went through with it. One, there's a huge risk of overdose involved. If I got sloppy with titration when I cut it, I'd be fucked. The biggest hiccup was the the normalization of fentanyl particles in a dry dilutant. Essentially, I'd intended to dilute it in lactose and distribute it in bags at 75µg/bag. This is the general dose of Duragesic used for anesthesia. Duragesic is fentanyl citrate in saline.
Dr. JIM, you might say, "Why Auntie, why don't you just pulverize the fentanyl crystals with your mortar and pestle, then mix it directly with the lactose powder?" You would be an idiot if you did. See, there's no way to normalize the distribution of fentanyl citrate across a dry medium that way. You need to mix them in a solution, with the theory being that the distribution of particles in solution is completely homogenous, and all portions of the solution contain equal amounts of reagent.
What you need for this is a spray dryer. A spray dryer is a an apparatus that suspends atomized droplets of a solution, all of a closely similar volume, and dries them.
The reason it must be done this way and not dried from a large standing batch of solution is to prevent the fentanyl from crystallizing out of solution in a ratio uneven to the lactose dilutent, as pure substances tend to crystallize (crash, in the steroid world) as the solution becomes supersaturated (by drying), causing the same problem as mixing the dry powders: Hot(and dead) spots. Hot spots and dead spots mean one poor guy gets nothing, and another poor guy gets a 2 mg grain of pure fentanyl. And dies. I had issues with the spray drier. I worked on several plans a friend, and engineering student, and random samples of finished product showed variances too wide to be safe for consumption. Work was abandoned.
I made 153.786±.015 grams of pure fentanyl base, and shut everything down. Including apparatus that I had to purchase or build, including a tube furnace for the synthesis of dry aluminum chloride (for a Lithium Aluminum Hydride synthesis), I spend just under $2100. Do the math, and figure out how much that's worth on the street. You need a little under a kilogram of lactose for a gram of fentanyl base. Less for fentanyl citrate. We used the above mentioned tube furnace to destroy the sample.
So that's why I didn't do it. I didn't want to kill people.
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Hold up.... I'm going to run a multiple linear regression model on this data
dude you sure you arent walter white????fuck steroids you should be cooking meth......and synthesizing mdma....molly nom nom nom:drooling::drooling:
Walter White? Oh, and precursors for mdma are very hard to come by. Safrole and isosafrole can be extracted from raw materials, but it would be inefficient and wouldn't be cost-effective for my small lab. The fentanyl synthesis is probably the most dangerous thing I've ever done in my lab. We had to suit up, seal up vents and wrapped the room in visqueen that we sort of welded together and supported using a skeleton of PVC pipe. We also had to set up ventilation for the room with filtration, and some reactions had to be done in inert gasses under pressure. When we were done we wiped the entire room down with dilute hydrochloric acid and later potassium permanganate. We destroyed the paint and had to redo it. And I cracked my favorite condenser.
Methamphetamine synthesis is chemically uninteresting. Fentanyl seemed fun, and there's a lot of really dirty heroin on the streets here right now. In hindsight the entire operation was risky and foolish.
searay
New Member
Go make your own shit then! In the amount of time it took you to type all that to us you could of had a good start!
Sassafrass tree, and from camphor I think. You can buy raw natural oil from China, which is about 80% pure saffrole. Piperinole can be synthesized from piperine, a major constituent of black pepper. Tell you what I'll do. You come up with a large quantity of safrole, and I'll drive up and do a molly synth. I'll want some of that for myself though.
I've read novel synthesis from eugenol, which is in cloves, and available for practically nothing if you know sources for flavoring chemists. I'm more interested in one of Shulgin's compounds synthesized from myrestricin, the active compound in nutmeg. Seemed really neat.
I did. Inb4 you learn to read.
Naw, I'm just trolling you a bit. And fucking with Dr JIM. For the lulz. I do everything for the lulz.
Ok admittedly you have a better understanding for chemistry than I gave you credit for but I also KNOW this, sometimes circumstances and PEOPLE are not always as they appear!
Jim
Jim
Sometimes even doctors have to take their medicine.
Yep I think your on to something there, lol!
He may have a better understanding of chemistry but by repainting the walls, he's proven his decorating skills are lacking. I mean, who wouldn't appreciate the potassium permanganate fresco? The lovely brown tint hides dope smoke stains so well. And the anti-microbial properties make it a perfect choice for a drug den [
)]CBS
Adornment Expert
In PIHKAL, Shulgin not only lists everything needed to synthesize all the chems but also a step by step instruction on how to do so. This was one reason LE was not happy when it was first published.
Also, a chemist, or a source here on Meso or any board, is only as good as his connections. This guy a.witch doesn't have connects to the precursors he needs to follow the steps in A Shulgins book? So what good is his ability to follow directions?
If he decided to home brew, he's be on par with these new guys here, including herc. They lack the connections to high quality and even more important consistant raw powders that the long time successful UGL's do.
Thanks. I just reread my post, and facepalmed at the spelling errors and words I mistakenly left out. I'd been drinking. And I agree with you. It's exactly why I made the posts. I believe the three points I've made in my earlier post to be valid, and that they warranted further examination. I'll also admit that the troll in me did get a bit carried away (and secretly enjoyed continuing) once the "a.bitch" and other inflammatory comments were made. By Stretch, et al. I can't say I haven't been entertained by all of this. I have.
I'm glad that there's been feedback on this, both negative and positive. Hopefully it will put a dent in the third argument I've made, the "500lb elephant in the room".
And hey, if you guys still have problems for it, I have only one excuse:
I did it for the lulz.
Shulgin focused on phenethylamines and tryptamines. Neither of his books have anything to do with fentanyl class drugs or opiates. If I really wanted to go to the trouble, I could find a source for precursors. It's easier than you think. Also, much of Shulgin's work is outdated, and his synthesis' were designed to use chemicals that were fairly easy for the average chemist to attain at the time. The DEA has changed that, making much of this obsolete. Many of these can be synthesized, but the work it time consuming.
Consider the old school meth synths, and how much that's changed. Or how much Uncle Fester changed it.
I don't really have a desire to manufacture molly or any PEA at the present. I'd only be doing it for personal use, and with quantities that small it's cheaper to buy the drugs from someone I know. The only reason I'd need "a connect" is if I planned to manufacture in quantity. I don't, and most chemists synthesize their reagents from the get go. Check Sciencemadness, or any of the related boards, you'll find things to be exactly as I say.
As far as being on par with a UGL, how would you know? What if I told you I work closely with a rep at Sigma-Aldritch? Or that I've seen the assay for all of my reagents, with matching curves on the MS when I sent it out to be tested on my own?
No biggerben69, reading a book and following directions isn't quite enough. There are procedures that need to be followed to assure that your synthesis results in the highest yield and quality. Also, you need to have a fundamental understanding of the underlying science to be successful.
RPD
New Member
:snaps fingers:
Ah, damn. See, that's where I would have gone wrong. [
)]
overhandright
New Member
This really sucks a fat one. I purchased from herc when he first came around here. I just finished a 10 week run of herc's tren a, test p and mast p at 1ml each eod. The gear was definitely g2g. I did my last pin on 09/20. I'm going to have labs done in about a week before a start pct. I was afraid this would happen. I heard about ugls starting out g2g then going to shit. I made great gains and had no health issues on herc's gear and was looking forward to doing it for my next cycle around Christmas. But easy come easy go I guess. It just really pisses me off.
Home brewing doesn't require one to be anything near a chemist. If you had a friend that worked for a major pharm company what good would that do you? He's going to smuggle the raw steroid powders home from work?
This thread and the posts that are being made are just plain silly. What does this kid have to offer to this forum. You showed up because you got beat by herc like many others did. How did this turn into a thread for you to talk about your fantasy's about being a big time drug manufacturer.
a.witch, you're a noob when it comes to AAS. Correct? If you weren't you wouldn't be ordering from herc or any of the untested sources here. This means you have no connections which means your supposes skills in the lab are useless.
You seem to think it necessary for some reason to separate yourself from the average member here at meso? It's gonna take time for that, son. Nobody knows you. You've got nothing useful to offer, or so you believe, because you're a noob to all this. There's no shame in that, kiddo. Let your guard down and behave yourself. We'll accept you for you.
You'll keep your façade going for a while. Check this out. You need us much more than we need you. If you fell off and never post again we'll forget you by lunch tomorrow. The part in this that has to do with your progression in the community is that you'll have to start all over again. I get that you enjoy popping up spouting some shit that stirs the pot some, but you're hurting your chances at getting to know folks that can help you achieve what you and most guys here want. Connections. You need people in our community to get connections. Your arrogance and silly stories will keep you right where you are. Fucking kids these days.
This thread and the posts that are being made are just plain silly. What does this kid have to offer to this forum. You showed up because you got beat by herc like many others did. How did this turn into a thread for you to talk about your fantasy's about being a big time drug manufacturer.
a.witch, you're a noob when it comes to AAS. Correct? If you weren't you wouldn't be ordering from herc or any of the untested sources here. This means you have no connections which means your supposes skills in the lab are useless.
You seem to think it necessary for some reason to separate yourself from the average member here at meso? It's gonna take time for that, son. Nobody knows you. You've got nothing useful to offer, or so you believe, because you're a noob to all this. There's no shame in that, kiddo. Let your guard down and behave yourself. We'll accept you for you.
You'll keep your façade going for a while. Check this out. You need us much more than we need you. If you fell off and never post again we'll forget you by lunch tomorrow. The part in this that has to do with your progression in the community is that you'll have to start all over again. I get that you enjoy popping up spouting some shit that stirs the pot some, but you're hurting your chances at getting to know folks that can help you achieve what you and most guys here want. Connections. You need people in our community to get connections. Your arrogance and silly stories will keep you right where you are. Fucking kids these days.
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