John Haack Training programme / Gear cycle?

[MFAAS]

I believe he was trying to not trivialize the work haack is putting in, not that he was trying to be clever or a smart ass. At least that’s how I read his comment

Thanks man, that is exactly correct,

@barbell001 I was definitely not trying to be negative, so no need to get defensive. IMO it was just a poor choice of words in the original post (effortless). You never know who is reading and how they will read that. Lots of new guys seem to truly believe things SHOULD be "effortless", especially when steroids are involved. It is just a damn shame that is the way it is, but it is. Unfortunately for whatever reason we have to make it abundantly clear that the guys who have the insane physiques and crazy strength actually bust their fucking ass 365 days a year, living the life to get where they are at. So I partially misunderstood what you were saying and just wanted to clarify--no worries though. All good here.

 

[MFAAS]

So this is a recommended Bench programme by Ed Coan - As he doesn't explain what to do if this happens, what would I do if say I didn't get a rep in the second set? Would I repeat the sets again the week after until I did or would you just move to the next progression?

Bench*: (example weights)
Max: 275
Goal: 300
*He would use the exact same programming to increase his CBP and Inclines. TnG bench, but paused CBP and Incline.

Week outs:
10: 180x2x10 (~65%x2x10)
9: 190x2x10 (~69%x2x10)
8: 200x2x8 (~73%x2x8)
7: 210x2x8 (~76%x2x8)
6: 230x2x5 (~84%x2x5)
5: 240x2x5 (~87%x2x5)
4: 250x2x3 (~91%x2x3)
3: 260x2x3 (~95%x2x3)
2: 270x2x2 (~98%x2x2)
1: 280x2x2 (~102%x2x2)
Peak: 300x1x1 (109%x1x1)

The Stronger By Science guys have a program you can buy that was stored in excel where it would auto-regulate the weight and reps based off of how many reps you did with the weight the week before. It was full body hypertrophy and strength but they might have expanded upon it now. Regardless, I took that program with the formulas and made it into my own PPL program a while back. It was really cool and I liked it a lot. Basically it was something like...if you went over a certain number of reps it would up the weight for next week, if you went under then it would lower the reps or weight. I can't remember exactly. It was really cool though. EXTREMELY complex excel formula though I swear. Like I am quite good with excel and that was beyond me haha.

 

[Type-IIx]

So this is a recommended Bench programme by Ed Coan - As he doesn't explain what to do if this happens, what would I do if say I didn't get a rep in the second set? Would I repeat the sets again the week after until I did or would you just move to the next progression?

Bench*: (example weights)
Max: 275
Goal: 300
*He would use the exact same programming to increase his CBP and Inclines. TnG bench, but paused CBP and Incline.

Week outs:
10: 180x2x10 (~65%x2x10)
9: 190x2x10 (~69%x2x10)
8: 200x2x8 (~73%x2x8)
7: 210x2x8 (~76%x2x8)
6: 230x2x5 (~84%x2x5)
5: 240x2x5 (~87%x2x5)
4: 250x2x3 (~91%x2x3)
3: 260x2x3 (~95%x2x3)
2: 270x2x2 (~98%x2x2)
1: 280x2x2 (~102%x2x2)
Peak: 300x1x1 (109%x1x1)

My approach would be if it doesn't work it's not for me, and to change the progression, refocus on needed assistance work.

 

[the_unit]

A magic bullet? By asking if anyone knows his training program and cycle so that I can try it out? Yes of course I want to know - why wouldn't I give it a go.

So going off your defeatist attitude I guess there is no point trying the Ed coan programming or anything else.

Negative guys like you are 10 a penny on forums.

No, what I am saying is his progress/excellence has less to do with programming and training than it does with his genetic predisposition, otherwise he would not be such a stand out.

Also, many of the high level lifters would suggest you look at what they did to get where they are, not what they are currently doing. As you move from novice to elite, the input and output variables of programming change and your response to stimulus changes as a result.

I think trialing different training methodologies is incredibly useful to assess your individual response to training, and over time if you objectively assess programming and response you can optimize your own training. I think first principles questions would just be more useful is all.

In regards to the Ed Coan program, what was particularly unique about him was his ability to pick reasonable and achievable numbers when mapping his program (i.e he wouldn't miss training lifts). If you miss lifts with that progression you should ask why (acute fatigue, accumulative fatigue, rate of progression exceeds rate of adaptability) and adjust accordingly.

 

[barbell001]

I would really appreciate you guy's help on this, this is the page I am referring to:

Ed Coan - 10 Week Training Template - Cast Iron Strength

In a previous post there was a 3 hour discussion by powerlifting G.O.A.T. candidate Ed Coan on his training routine and his approach to training. A helpful

www.castironstrength.com

My best bench was 470lb's at 185 BW RAW with no arch, and for reps I've done 405 for 5. I got to this simply by trying for new Max's constantly in 1, 2 and 3 rep sets. My dream would be to hit 485 and I am a little over 200 BW now but finding it hard to repeat how I did it before as my rotator cuffs do not stand up to the heavy abuse like they use to week in and out Lol

Are we saying then that apart from the light work on saturday and accessories he just trained Bench one day per week and used the rest of the time to recover to make sure he hit the following sets and reps the next week?

This will be the first time I have ever followed a programme and just cannot believe towards the end that you are able to jump in 4 to 5% overall weight increases and get them - But does this actually happen as in theory if you have hit all the previous required numbers then you can hit the doubles and singles? Seems almost too good to be true.

Is this also why you often see guys loading up on the heavy orals towards the end of the programme to make sure they get the desired poundages?

Forgive me for sounding amateur here but I have always trained at home in a power rack and competition spec flat bench so have never had any proper advice off anyone in a proper powerlifting gym.

 

[MR_Midas]

So this is a recommended Bench programme by Ed Coan - As he doesn't explain what to do if this happens, what would I do if say I didn't get a rep in the second set? Would I repeat the sets again the week after until I did or would you just move to the next progression?

Bench*: (example weights)
Max: 275
Goal: 300
*He would use the exact same programming to increase his CBP and Inclines. TnG bench, but paused CBP and Incline.

Week outs:
10: 180x2x10 (~65%x2x10)
9: 190x2x10 (~69%x2x10)
8: 200x2x8 (~73%x2x8)
7: 210x2x8 (~76%x2x8)
6: 230x2x5 (~84%x2x5)
5: 240x2x5 (~87%x2x5)
4: 250x2x3 (~91%x2x3)
3: 260x2x3 (~95%x2x3)
2: 270x2x2 (~98%x2x2)
1: 280x2x2 (~102%x2x2)
Peak: 300x1x1 (109%x1x1)

Ed Coan is the greatest of the greats. When I tried to study according to his programs, I could not complete more than one. Always over training or getting wildly tired. Apparently she is for very gifted guys. I'm wondering if someone was able to progress on them?

 

[MR_Midas]

Do you know where I can find details of this training system mate?

As far as I remember, she has a link in her Instagram profile where you can contact for training and consultation

 

[MR_Midas]

He's mentioned in podcasts how his training has developed. He was coached by Jason Mannenkoff early on and then Joseph Franzo (Joey Flexx) and his current training is an amalgamation of those and previous training. He has then taken the Ed Coan approach and just basically repeats the training with the aim of adding 2.5-5kg to each lift. It is pretty standard stuff, linear periodization, top singles, bench 2-3x per week (1 heavy, 1-2 rep work variation), squat 2x (1 heavy, 1 rep work variation) per week and deadlift 1x I believe.

He's also discussed his PEDs cycles, typically 12 weeks with test base (125-300mg), first 6 weeks anavar last 6 weeks anadrol ~50mg. He normally comes off between cycles but for this prep remained on since quick turn around between meets.

He is also obviously a genetic outlier, as a natural powerlifter he was the best at the time and set significant new records and this trend has carried on in his enhanced carrier to no surprise.

The more important variable you can control and should concern yourself with is your individual response to training and drugs.

I remember the time when he was training according to the methods of Jason Mannenkoff, I have been following John for a long time. And now he has turned into a hulk. I have a feeling that he works to the maximum all the time and that it doesn’t even surprise me, but how he recovers. Here he is undoubtedly a genetic talent and unique. I think in the near future he will raise the result that it will not be achievable for anyone

 

[Misterfister]

Okay so unless you've been hiding in a war bunker the last 5 years you'll no doubt know who he is! lol

I've followed his videos for roughly the past 6 years now online, going from a 180lb strong lifter to this now 220 - 225lb absolute bloody monster.

Seen him progress from a 405 Bench to just recently hitting 600lb's and the Deadlift from 700 to over 900 now. Every time I log into my Youtube account this bugger is setting a new PR! He just seems to be getting stronger and stronger and stronger .....

There are various theories about all this including the fact that he was an extremely strong natty in the first place, then he touched SARM's then he went full Roids mode. He must also have a Very good training programme in place too to allow him to continually progress the way he effortlessly does .....

Does anyone on here know what kind of programming he follows currently and the type of gear cycles he runs? I heard rumours of him stating its purely 300mg Test per week and 50mg Adrol per day but this just cannot be true at least not now. When you see him lifting now at least in deads his face looks like he's full of Adrol and not just a tab a day. I've seen him say he hates tren also so there must be more than meets the eye somewhere?!

Just lol

 

[MR_Midas]

Just lol

What made you laugh so hard?

 

[Ridethelightningbarefoot]

If he publicly fully disclosed his usage his ipf records would be stripped. Hes probably doing the same thing everyone else is. Hes just another gifted dood that got on gear and became even greater. I worked hard and ate hard and got a back injury. Sometimes it just comes down to people who are the most gifted. Gear doesnt make you elite, or any other regimen. Its your mindset and genetics at the end of the day when your talking elite pro level. Everyone wants to be like ronnie, jay, john, ed coan but at the end of the day your not them.

 

[MFAAS]

If he publicly fully disclosed his usage his ipf records would be stripped. Hes probably doing the same thing everyone else is. Hes just another gifted dood that got on gear and became even greater. I worked hard and ate hard and got a back injury. Sometimes it just comes down to people who are the most gifted. Gear doesnt make you elite, or any other regimen. Its your mindset and genetics at the end of the day when your talking elite pro level. Everyone wants to be like ronnie, jay, john, ed coan but at the end of the day your not them.

And luck and discipline with posture and breathing etc to prevent injuries.

Shit, sometimes even with perfect posture and breath and everything you still wind up injured just because of some stupid dumb luck thing. Or sometimes things outside training really fuck your training and progress up (still bitching about my tennis elbow lol)

 

[Ridethelightningbarefoot]

And luck and discipline with posture and breathing etc to prevent injuries.

Shit, sometimes even with perfect posture and breath and everything you still wind up injured just because of some stupid dumb luck thing. Or sometimes things outside training really fuck your training and progress up (still bitching about my tennis elbow lol)

I wish I got a mri before I started lifting heavy. Im fairly certain it was a previous inury that just showed its ass when I started lifting heavy. I remember getting back spasms in high school playing football

 

[barbell001]

I never understand why when you ask if anyone knows what they are running in terms of gear or any other protocols why some people always put up these stupid responses such as 'Why would you want to know, you are not them' or 'they are gifted genetically and you aren't' - Well yeah thats pretty bloody obvious isn't it, otherwise I'd have a natural 440lb bench like John did before he started gear!! But clearly whatever he is now running is working amazingly well and has put a tonne of weight on him as he has gained 160lb's on his bench and is at 600 gunning for a new PR of 606 currently. So why wouldn't you want to learn from the best lifter in the world? Wouldn't you want to know his daily diet plan and what he eats? I can only assume the negative idiots saying this never read any training articles either or try to improve themselves in any way.

 

[Misterfister]

What made you laugh so hard?

Thinking that he was ever drug free, or that his stack was just some test and 50mg A Bombs. Just lol.

 

[MR_Midas]

Thinking that he was ever drug free, or that his stack was just some test and 50mg A Bombs. Just lol.

Now I understand

 

[olrak]

I never understand why when you ask if anyone knows what they are running in terms of gear or any other protocols why some people always put up these stupid responses such as 'Why would you want to know, you are not them' or 'they are gifted genetically and you aren't' - Well yeah thats pretty bloody obvious isn't it, otherwise I'd have a natural 440lb bench like John did before he started gear!! But clearly whatever he is now running is working amazingly well and has put a tonne of weight on him as he has gained 160lb's on his bench and is at 600 gunning for a new PR of 606 currently. So why wouldn't you want to learn from the best lifter in the world? Wouldn't you want to know his daily diet plan and what he eats? I can only assume the negative idiots saying this never read any training articles either or try to improve themselves in any way.

Yes, wanting to know how he trains, eats and his Ped use is normal, the problem is a lot of people finding out his whole training philosophy then try to emulate him and this is when they can run into serious problems.

Also a lot of guys wanting to know his routine think he has some secret special knowledge, highly unlikely, it's good old fashion hard work and brilliant genetics

 

[MR_Midas]

Everyone believes in a secret, every champion has it, just hides it well

 

[olrak]

No man, that's sounds mysterious and all, but its hard work, smart programming and good genetics.
You can use his peds, programming and diet but the only secret he has is in his genetics, there's no hacks no short cut, just born with talent

 

[ruxin32424]

No man, that's sounds mysterious and all, but its hard work, smart programming and good genetics.
You can use his peds, programming and diet but the only secret he has is in his genetics, there's no hacks no short cut, just born with talent

no *haacks