MESO-Rx Exclusive The Science of Trenbolone - Second Edition

[ChestRockwell]

Thanks - anyone who doesn't use test as the foundation for a cycle is asking for trouble. Isn't that one of the few ironclad rules about steroid use?

Well, sort of. I feel that the vast majority of individuals should have at least TRT in a sensible stack design, unless they really know what they are doing.

And even if they do, there are potential consequences to not using testosterone (think about the pathways it uses and what could happen if they are suppressed for long periods of time).

But I don't necessarily think it has to be the foundation (or what I call an "anchor" compound). Some stack designs work well when testosterone is left in as TRT and you let the others do the heavy lifting.

Would you say that, especially on tren, that it's a good idea to just manage against estrogen sides as you "feel" them, rather than try to push E2 down to a lower level? I only take AIs as I feel E2 sides coming, that has worked for me so far - and with what you're saying it sounds like it's actually synergistic with tren to let your E2 go higher than normal?

Yes, I have what I suppose is seen by some as a semi-controversial philosophy, in that I feel one should abstain from AIs whenever possible. This is even more true when no signs of high estrogen appear and folks are using AIs to proactively lower estrogen levels. In fact, none of my enhanced males are on currently on AIs and I've used them less than a handful of times in my own experience.

I hear a lot that some individuals are just more estrogenic, and I never dispute this. But I've had success with even some of the loudest "complainers" who come to me. And, just about everyone I've worked with have eventually come off AIs entirely. So yeah, I think that makes my position pretty clear on that

 

[tenpoundsleft]

Well, sort of. I feel that the vast majority of individuals should have at least TRT in a sensible stack design, unless they really know what they are doing.

And even if they do, there are potential consequences to not using testosterone (think about the pathways it uses and what could happen if they are suppressed for long periods of time).

But I don't necessarily think it has to be the foundation (or what I call an "anchor" compound). Some stack designs work well when testosterone is left in as TRT and you let the others do the heavy lifting.

Yes, I have what I suppose is seen by some as a semi-controversial philosophy, in that I feel one should abstain from AIs whenever possible. This is even more true when no signs of high estrogen appear and folks are using AIs to proactively lower estrogen levels. In fact, none of my enhanced males are on currently on AIs and I've used them less than a handful of times in my own experience.

I hear a lot that some individuals are just more estrogenic, and I never dispute this. But I've had success with even some of the loudest "complainers" who come to me. And, just about everyone I've worked with have eventually come off AIs entirely. So yeah, I think that makes my position pretty clear on that

I have adopted that approach too - i.e. I down manage E2 only when I feel it coming, but otherwise ignore it. Doesn't make sense to keep hammering it with a steady AI regimen since the sides seem to fluctuate so much depending on factors unrelated to the steroid dose (sleep, food, exercise intensity, travel - it's hard to figure out what does it, some weeks I need nothing, other weeks I have to pop a whole pill).

 

[Bigboy727]

I am not familiar with the chemical structure of Tren. I am wondering if Tren shuts you down as bad as Deca?

 

[ChestRockwell]

I have adopted that approach too - i.e. I down manage E2 only when I feel it coming, but otherwise ignore it. Doesn't make sense to keep hammering it with a steady AI regimen since the sides seem to fluctuate so much depending on factors unrelated to the steroid dose (sleep, food, exercise intensity, travel - it's hard to figure out what does it, some weeks I need nothing, other weeks I have to pop a whole pill).

This make me very happy to hear!

I am not familiar with the chemical structure of tren. I am wondering if Tren shuts you down as bad as Deca?

Yes.

 

[Inquiring Mind]

@ChestRockwell im not sure if you were planing on addressing things such as Tren cough and what affects Tren has on the lungs. I have read that Tren causes scaring on the lining of the lungs by way of PGf2a and can potentially be fatal; don’t know if any truth to that, I dont even have a close what the fuck a PGF2a is LOL, but that caughing stuff, whether from the powder or from the solvents, can’t be good.

Just curious, we check other major organ functions via blood test, is there such a blood test to measure lung damage, particularly when on Tren?

I’m the same regard i have read that the symptoms, coughing and restricted ability to inhale or breath properly, are similar to sudden beta-antagonist activity in asthmatic people, and that simply using an inhaler would alleviate Tren cough immediately. I can not speak on this from any personal experience as I do t have access to an asthma pump, but I’m sure I could get a script if anyone can expound on the validity of this.

But if this is true, would it not be prudent to include clenbuterol or albuterol when taking Tren?

This issue with affects on the lungs is a serious thing and should be further explored as Tren is still a hot topic.

 

[Morefyah]

@ChestRockwell im not sure if you were planing on addressing things such as Tren cough and what affects Tren has on the lungs. I have read that Tren causes scaring on the lining of the lungs by way of PGf2a and can potentially be fatal; don’t know if any truth to that, I dont even have a close what the fuck a PGF2a is LOL, but that caughing stuff, whether from the powder or from the solvents, can’t be good.

Just curious, we check other major organ functions via blood test, is there such a blood test to measure lung damage, particularly when on Tren?

I’m the same regard i have read that the symptoms, coughing and restricted ability to inhale or breath properly, are similar to sudden beta-antagonist activity in asthmatic people, and that simply using an inhaler would alleviate Tren cough immediately. I can not speak on this from any personal experience as I do t have access to an asthma pump, but I’m sure I could get a script if anyone can expound on the validity of this.

But if this is true, would it not be prudent to include clenbuterol or albuterol when taking Tren?

This issue with affects on the lungs is a serious thing and should be further explored as Tren is still a hot topic.

Albuterol had my heart racing and jacked up my BP. It also gave me bad insomnia. IMO it would be a bad idea..

 

[Bigboy727]

@ChestRockwell im not sure if you were planing on addressing things such as Tren cough and what affects Tren has on the lungs. I have read that Tren causes scaring on the lining of the lungs by way of PGf2a and can potentially be fatal; don’t know if any truth to that, I dont even have a close what the fuck a PGF2a is LOL, but that caughing stuff, whether from the powder or from the solvents, can’t be good.

Just curious, we check other major organ functions via blood test, is there such a blood test to measure lung damage, particularly when on Tren?

I’m the same regard i have read that the symptoms, coughing and restricted ability to inhale or breath properly, are similar to sudden beta-antagonist activity in asthmatic people, and that simply using an inhaler would alleviate Tren cough immediately. I can not speak on this from any personal experience as I do t have access to an asthma pump, but I’m sure I could get a script if anyone can expound on the validity of this.

But if this is true, would it not be prudent to include clenbuterol or albuterol when taking Tren?

This issue with affects on the lungs is a serious thing and should be further explored as Tren is still a hot topic.

I know it restricts my cardio however I didn’t know if it was hurting my lungs permanently. Hope you’re wrong!

 

[Inquiring Mind]

Albuterol had my heart racing and jacked up my BP. It also gave me bad insomnia. IMO it would be a bad idea..

Albuterol came to mind only because it’s discussed, otherwise I don’t honesty know anything about it from personal experience...there would be lighter versions of inhalers I’d assume, no?

 

[Inquiring Mind]

I know it restricts my cardio however I didn’t know if it was hurting my lungs permanently. Hope you’re wrong!

Right, but why does it do that, like what is going on internally and on what level for it to have such an impact on breaking and cardio?

 

[Gbro]

I can't wait for the next part to be released.

 

[tenpoundsleft]

@ChestRockwell im not sure if you were planing on addressing things such as Tren cough and what affects Tren has on the lungs. I have read that Tren causes scaring on the lining of the lungs by way of PGf2a and can potentially be fatal; don’t know if any truth to that, I dont even have a close what the fuck a PGF2a is LOL, but that caughing stuff, whether from the powder or from the solvents, can’t be good.

Just curious, we check other major organ functions via blood test, is there such a blood test to measure lung damage, particularly when on Tren?

I’m the same regard i have read that the symptoms, coughing and restricted ability to inhale or breath properly, are similar to sudden beta-antagonist activity in asthmatic people, and that simply using an inhaler would alleviate Tren cough immediately. I can not speak on this from any personal experience as I do t have access to an asthma pump, but I’m sure I could get a script if anyone can expound on the validity of this.

But if this is true, would it not be prudent to include clenbuterol or albuterol when taking Tren?

This issue with affects on the lungs is a serious thing and should be further explored as Tren is still a hot topic.

We'll see what @ChestRockwell says about this but AFAIK it's just a temporary nuisance/irritation if you get some Tren in the blood system and it gets to the lungs. Nothing permanent, the violent cough is just our reaction to the chemical in question.

(I have yet to experience Tren cough despite running it 4 cycles - maybe because I only use slins)

 

[Inquiring Mind]

We'll see what @ChestRockwell says about this but AFAIK it's just a temporary nuisance/irritation if you get some Tren in the blood system and it gets to the lungs. Nothing permanent, the violent cough is just our reaction to the chemical in question.

(I have yet to experience Tren cough despite running it 4 cycles - maybe because I only use slins)

I have learned to mitigate the cough by going ultra super slow while injection. I take my time as it is, but when Tren is in the mix I can take a lot longer now. I can feel the affect coming on in my lungs or my bronchial cord, so then I ease off the plunger for about a minute, let the oils dispures in my leg, and continue again. This has been the most effective way that I have been using to avoid a full blown caugh attack.

With slin pins I’d have to assume your gong into th delt, but even then I have found it’s just not deep enough to get deep into the muscle belly and you can get a welt or bump of sub-q oil. I found it’s just not work it. Triceps are an ok place to pin with a slin.

 

[ChestRockwell]

@ChestRockwell im not sure if you were planing on addressing things such as tren cough and what affects Tren has on the lungs. I have read that Tren causes scaring on the lining of the lungs by way of PGf2a and can potentially be fatal; don’t know if any truth to that, I dont even have a close what the fuck a PGF2a is LOL, but that caughing stuff, whether from the powder or from the solvents, can’t be good.

Do you happen to recall where you read this? I briefly skim over "tren cough" however there is nothing in the literature on this because 99% of trials are done on animals. So any sort of conclusions drawn on the cause and acute/long-term effects would have to be highly speculative, in my opinion.

 

[Inquiring Mind]

Do you happen to recall where you read this? I briefly skim over "tren cough" however there is nothing in the literature on this because 99% of trials are done on animals. So any sort of conclusions drawn on the cause and acute/long-term effects would have to be highly speculative, in my opinion.

Sorry for not getting back sooner..I was not able to find the arrival. It was a link on another thread. I do most of not all my surfing the web via smartphone, therefore I realy don’t save or bookmark anything as it’s all just too easy to go on to the next thing..

In any event, while I was attempting to back track my steps on Google, I can across the topic a few times. Paraphrasing what I read, Prostaglandin PGF2a was linked to lung scaring due to excessive swelling or inflammation of the lungs and that’s Tren triggers or exasperates it, therefore using Tren was be indirectly inducing said condition upon oneself.

Ummm, I think I’ll keave the scientific stuff to you guys.

 

[ChestRockwell]

Paraphrasing what I read, Prostaglandin PGF2a was linked to lung scaring due to excessive swelling or inflammation of the lungs and that’s Tren triggers or exasperates it, therefore using Tren was be indirectly inducing said condition upon oneself.

I believe I found the thread where this was mentioned.

I've never come across anything on this direct link myself, so the burden of proof would be on the person making this claim. I would happily review, if legitimate sources of evidence come out...however right now, I don't see any reason to think it is someone just making claims.

 

[Wunderpus]

@ChestRockwell Do you have any idea why tren seems to cause acid reflux in all users? Always wondered about this...

 

[ChestRockwell]

@ChestRockwell Do you have any idea why tren seems to cause acid reflux in all users? Always wondered about this...

I have long speculated this could be caused by trenbolone-mediated changes in histamine levels.

 

[Wunderpus]

I have long speculated this could be caused by trenbolone-mediated changes in histamine levels.

That, and the insomnia, I find are the most irritating factors of trenbolone (at least in the short term). I don't LIKE taking meds like Nexium if I can avoid it, but the reflux is insufferable for me otherwise. The insomnia I have found melatonin seems to counteract pretty well...

 

[ChestRockwell]

That, and the insomnia, I find are the most irritating factors of trenbolone (at least in the short term). I don't LIKE taking meds like Nexium if I can avoid it, but the reflux is insufferable for me otherwise. The insomnia I have found melatonin seems to counteract pretty well...

Yes, I completely agree. Interestingly, I have found that insomnia symptoms are far less prevalent when energy intake is at a surplus. I have zero explanation for why this is, but it happens consistently enough that it cannot be chalked up to coincidence.

If "trensomnia" hits hard during a diet, that is often when it is time to pull it out of the stack.

 

[Wunderpus]

Yes, I completely agree. Interestingly, I have found that insomnia symptoms are far less prevalent when energy intake is at a surplus. I have zero explanation for why this is, but it happens consistently enough that it cannot be chalked up to coincidence.

If "trensomnia" hits hard during a diet, that is often when it is time to pull it out of the stack.

Hmm, that could be, I haven't noticed that. However, energy surplus on trenbolone NORMALLY means "carb surplus" for me, which equals SWEAT CITY... Sweating before bed = insomnia... So, hmm...

And, yes, I agree about pulling it at that point. Losing sleep is counterproductive in almost every way to our goals.