How do you frequently assess the effect on hair loss of your stack?

[Ghoul]

The reason I don't advocate bothering with DHT bloodwork is because this is an area where feels matter more than numbers.

Start with a low dose of Fin. Feel ok? Try upping it to .50. then the "standard" 1mg. If you get to 1mg and don't have sides there's a 90% chance you won't have any loss.

IF you do see continued loss, start in low dose Dutasteride and see how much you can tolerate.

At the point you feel sides you have to stop, because in my opinion having hair with terrible low DHT side effects is worse than going bald.

The good news if that for the vast majority of men, even low dose Fin is enough to stop hair loss completely.

 

[Spideog]

I couldn’t give a shit anymore. Either turkey or going GSP mode.

 

[marsupial]

No, I'm not posting my hairline, what's that going to prove? Are you not listening? I told you DHT blockers should've been used decades ago, and failing to do so has cost me significant lost ground. All I can do with my "knowledge" is not lose more hair at this late stage.

I don't know what you're arguing about. Take the simple steps to STOP hair loss entirely while you have hair to protect. The overwhelming majority can do it at a dose of Fin that doesn't cause sides.

Is there some reason not to do these things?

Because the only other option is to surrender to the belief it's inevitable and then, later after you go through the trauma of Norwood 4 or worse grade loss, you're trying to hang on to what's already a severely damaged hairline that could've been preserved with early action.

Ok. What is the most efficient way to obtain fin and 2% ketoconazole shampoo

 

[marsupial]

Also can you explain why and how you were unable to notice hair loss before nw4? Were you able to monitor it when it got to nw1-3?

 

[AlexDavis43]

Ok. What is the most efficient way to obtain fin and 2% ketoconazole shampoo

Many sources here have finasteride and keto shampoo is pretty widely available.

 

[Ghoul]

Also can you explain why and how you were unable to notice hair loss before nw4? Were you able to monitor it when it got to nw1-3?

I decided that with finasteride (aka propecia) causing sex destroying side effects, and being in a marriage, I'd rather keep sex working and lose my hair(which seemed way off in the distance). It happens so slowly you get accustomed to it, and even if it catches your attention "I'll deal with it later" is an always temptation to succumb to. Even when it's clear it's going to eventually get bald you tell yourself "I'll just get a transplant when it gets too bad.".

Those delays all make the situation much worse than putting the brakes on asap. Transplants look just ok at best, only from certain angles, usually they look like crap or worse. And are way more complex than you imagine, with a yearlong recovery.

"Fuck it" is easy to say when it's not too bad.

It's 200% crystal clear in hindsight, with all this knowledge acquired in the last decade, that nothing is as good or easy as just protecting the hair you've got for your future self.

Looking younger as you age is a huge advantage in business and relationships. That's why people spend a fortune trying to turn the clock back. It's not just shallow vanity.

For men, fitness, hair, and money means age and the experience that comes with it make you more valuable to the opposite sex, more charismatic to the other men you do business with, not less, than when you were younger.

Destroyed hair makes you look older, period. Old and tired. People will draw conclusions from you about that, fair or not. Bald is ok if you look good bald, but not as good as a healthy head of hair.

You can control fitness and success through your efforts. Hair, once it's too far gone, is out of your control no matter how much money you throw at it.

If I told you spending the equivalent of a few cents a day in effort now will give you an asset men would spend a million on at some point in the future you'd consider that a smart investment.

You see what you're losing, but that thinning crown isn't in your face every day. Other people see it. Do you think that's attractive? Guys who focus more than most on building a good looking physique want to pretend hair does't matter, when that's pure cope because they feel like they have no control over it so go into acceptance mode.

It's like saying "as long as you're healthy a below average physique with a flabby belly is fine, it'll have no impact on your life and how others perceive you".. Few here would buy that crap.

When your slowly retreating temporal frontal indentations meet the ever enlarging thinning crown and you're starting to see yourself turning into an old monk it's going to suck worse than you can imagine now.

The psychological consequences of androgenetic alopecia: A systematic review

Androgenetic alopecia is the most common cause of hair loss in both males and females. In a society that places significant value on hair and associates it with attractiveness, a lack there of can have damaging psychological consequences. The psychosocial ...

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

 

[AlexDavis43]

All in all it just seems way more difficult to do that if you already have a full head of thick hair. Seems much easier if you have short hair or a shaved head

There's nothing difficult about it.

I keep the pen next to the toilet and use it for a few minutes while I'm shitting 1-2 x/wk.

 

[Eddie.]

I couldn’t give a shit anymore. Either turkey or going GSP mode.

I think i'll skip transplant but i'm interested on doing a shaved scalp micropigmentation. I like the shaved but not bald look..and because i know myself, i couldn't live with the idea that all that money and suffering from hair transplant could go in trash if i keep using peds and not taking finasteride, RU, minoxidil and all that shit for the rest of my life..

I keep the pen next to the toilet and use it for a few minutes while I'm shitting 1-2 x/wk.

Duuude, eat some fiber xD
(jk)

 

[Ghoul]

I think i'll skip transplant but i'm interested on doing a shaved scalp micropigmentation. I like the shaved but not bald look..and because i know myself, i couldn't live with the idea that all that money and suffering from hair transplant could go in trash if i keep using peds and not taking finasteride, RU, minoxidil and all that shit for the rest of my life..



Duuude, eat some fiber xD
(jk)

Finasteride has the added benefit of saving you from old man weak stream pissing from that prostate that uses gear as fertilizer to grow troublesomely large, as it will inevitably do.

Minoxidil improves blood circulation and might spare you from a stroke or heart attacks by that gravy thick AAS blood most of us and up with.

It's not like you don't already see the benefits of pharma enhancements introduced into your body. These two tiny pills are hardly some big deal by comparison and arguably all upside if managed correctly.

Dudes shooting major quantities of Chinese sourced chemicals of questionable origins turn into organic hippies when it comes to non-PEDs lol..

 

[Eddie.]

Finasteride has the added benefit of saving you from old man weak stream pissing from that prostate that uses gear as fertilizer to grow troublesomely large, as it will inevitably do.

Minoxidil improves blood circulation and might spare you from a stroke or heart attacks by that gravy thick AAS blood most of us and up with.

It's not like you don't already see the benefits of pharma enhancements introduced into your body. These two tiny pills are hardly some big deal by comparison and arguably all upside if managed correctly.

Dudes shooting major quantities of Chinese sourced chemicals of questionable origins turn into organic hippies when it comes to non-PEDs lol..

Are you a repper of some pharma company that sells fin and minoxidil? In 99% of your posts you're trying to persue people to use a shitload of chemicals to keep their hair. Even keto has potential sides and u were saying the other dude he can use it every day.. Jeez.

And before you rushed, i'm already using minoxidil, RU and keto now that i run primo.. In one month i'll continue with minox only. But hell no i'll get old and treat my hair like a damn princess. Sooner or later the shave will take place, that moment will determined by how much effort money and drugs i'm willing to spent before i take the decision to let my genetics take the lead. I'm no anti pharmaceuticals guy, i'm taking drugs to improve my health for a long time, way before starting gear.

I just know where to draw a line.. i don't negotiate my sex life for a beautiful head. I'm 6 foot blue eyed man and my confidence goes beyond my hairline. Does that really upsets you? Is your first name Taeian btw?

 

[Ghoul]

Are you a repper of some pharma company that sells fin and minoxidil? In 99% of your posts you're trying to persue people to use a shitload of chemicals to keep their hair. Even keto has potential sides and u were saying the other dude he can use it every day.. Jeez.

And before you rushed, i'm already using minoxidil, RU and keto now that i run primo.. In one month i'll continue with minox only. But hell no i'll get old and treat my hair like a damn princess. Sooner or later the shave will take place, that moment will determined by how much effort money and drugs i'm willing to spent before i take the decision to let my genetics take the lead. I'm no anti pharmaceuticals guy, i'm taking drugs to improve my health for a long time, way before starting gear.

I just know where to draw a line.. i don't negotiate my sex life for a beautiful head. I'm 6 foot blue eyed man and my confidence goes beyond my hairline. Does that really upsets you? Is your first name Taeian btw?

Right, I'm sure a guy who knows his overall health is worsened, not improved by AAS for the benefit of a good looking body is going to he happy to "let genetics take over" at some undefined point in the future because his self esteem is too high to let something as petty as appearance affect his decisions.

You're not on TRT. Like all of us here, you're trading some portion of your lifespan for looks. That's not because your self worth is detached from vanity.

"Properly managed" means finding a dose that doesn't cause sexual side effects. Halting the process at the earliest possible stage is smarter than resorting to poorly researched hail mary chems like RU later.

 

[marsupial]

I decided that with finasteride (aka propecia) causing sex destroying side effects, and being in a marriage, I'd rather keep sex working and lose my hair(which seemed way off in the distance). It happens so slowly you get accustomed to it, and even if it catches your attention "I'll deal with it later" is an always temptation to succumb to. Even when it's clear it's going to eventually get bald you tell yourself "I'll just get a transplant when it gets too bad.".

Those delays all make the situation much worse than putting the brakes on asap. Transplants look just ok at best, only from certain angles, usually they look like crap or worse. And are way more complex than you imagine, with a yearlong recovery.

"Fuck it" is easy to say when it's not too bad.

It's 200% crystal clear in hindsight, with all this knowledge acquired in the last decade, that nothing is as good or easy as just protecting the hair you've got for your future self.

Looking younger as you age is a huge advantage in business and relationships. That's why people spend a fortune trying to turn the clock back. It's not just shallow vanity.

For men, fitness, hair, and money means age and the experience that comes with it make you more valuable to the opposite sex, more charismatic to the other men you do business with, not less, than when you were younger.

Destroyed hair makes you look older, period. Old and tired. People will draw conclusions from you about that, fair or not. Bald is ok if you look good bald, but not as good as a healthy head of hair.

You can control fitness and success through your efforts. Hair, once it's too far gone, is out of your control no matter how much money you throw at it.

If I told you spending the equivalent of a few cents a day in effort now will give you an asset men would spend a million on at some point in the future you'd consider that a smart investment.

You see what you're losing, but that thinning crown isn't in your face every day. Other people see it. Do you think that's attractive? Guys who focus more than most on building a good looking physique want to pretend hair does't matter, when that's pure cope because they feel like they have no control over it so go into acceptance mode.

It's like saying "as long as you're healthy a below average physique with a flabby belly is fine, it'll have no impact on your life and how others perceive you".. Few here would buy that crap.

When your slowly retreating temporal frontal indentations meet the ever enlarging thinning crown and you're starting to see yourself turning into an old monk it's going to suck worse than you can imagine now.

The psychological consequences of androgenetic alopecia: A systematic review

Androgenetic alopecia is the most common cause of hair loss in both males and females. In a society that places significant value on hair and associates it with attractiveness, a lack there of can have damaging psychological consequences. The psychosocial ...

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

Yes I too prefer having non-receded hair for multiple reasons


But knowing what you know now, do you think that acting when you noticed nw1 would’ve made for a better outcome or at least more delayed hair loss? So far my impression is that you did notice it and you neglected it all the way from nw1 thru nw3. Wouldn’t that be far different from someone who surveys the position of each front hairline follicle on their forehead every week or so on blast??

Also fin/min will ultimately not prevent hair loss if someone is blasting supraphysiological doses of test. It can certainly delay it but won’t be able to stop the test-associated follicle weakening. Not to mention guys who use straight up DHT steroids. What is your cycle history?

I do think at a certain age, say 45, it tends to stop mattering, especially if you’re out of shape like 99.9% of American 45yo are

 

[marsupial]

Many sources here have finasteride and keto shampoo is pretty widely available.

I’m looking for pct sources that have both products. It’ll be far cheaper via them. So far nothing

 

[trtbuilder]

Right, I'm sure a guy who knows his overall health is worsened, not improved by AAS for the benefit of a good looking body is going to he happy to "let genetics take over" at some undefined point in the future because his self esteem is too high to let something as petty as appearance affect his decisions.

You're not on TRT. Like all of us here, you're trading some portion of your lifespan for looks. That's not because your self worth is detached from vanity.

"Properly managed" means finding a dose that doesn't cause sexual side effects. Halting the process at the earliest possible stage is smarter than resorting to poorly researched hail mary chems like RU later.

Nailed it.

 

[karambit]

I decided that with finasteride (aka propecia) causing sex destroying side effects, and being in a marriage, I'd rather keep sex working and lose my hair(which seemed way off in the distance). It happens so slowly you get accustomed to it, and even if it catches your attention "I'll deal with it later" is an always temptation to succumb to. Even when it's clear it's going to eventually get bald you tell yourself "I'll just get a transplant when it gets too bad.".

Those delays all make the situation much worse than putting the brakes on asap. Transplants look just ok at best, only from certain angles, usually they look like crap or worse. And are way more complex than you imagine, with a yearlong recovery.

"Fuck it" is easy to say when it's not too bad.

It's 200% crystal clear in hindsight, with all this knowledge acquired in the last decade, that nothing is as good or easy as just protecting the hair you've got for your future self.

Looking younger as you age is a huge advantage in business and relationships. That's why people spend a fortune trying to turn the clock back. It's not just shallow vanity.

For men, fitness, hair, and money means age and the experience that comes with it make you more valuable to the opposite sex, more charismatic to the other men you do business with, not less, than when you were younger.

Destroyed hair makes you look older, period. Old and tired. People will draw conclusions from you about that, fair or not. Bald is ok if you look good bald, but not as good as a healthy head of hair.

You can control fitness and success through your efforts. Hair, once it's too far gone, is out of your control no matter how much money you throw at it.

If I told you spending the equivalent of a few cents a day in effort now will give you an asset men would spend a million on at some point in the future you'd consider that a smart investment.

You see what you're losing, but that thinning crown isn't in your face every day. Other people see it. Do you think that's attractive? Guys who focus more than most on building a good looking physique want to pretend hair does't matter, when that's pure cope because they feel like they have no control over it so go into acceptance mode.

It's like saying "as long as you're healthy a below average physique with a flabby belly is fine, it'll have no impact on your life and how others perceive you".. Few here would buy that crap.

When your slowly retreating temporal frontal indentations meet the ever enlarging thinning crown and you're starting to see yourself turning into an old monk it's going to suck worse than you can imagine now.

The psychological consequences of androgenetic alopecia: A systematic review

Androgenetic alopecia is the most common cause of hair loss in both males and females. In a society that places significant value on hair and associates it with attractiveness, a lack there of can have damaging psychological consequences. The psychosocial ...

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

Hmm..I'm curious as to why you never went for a few hair tranplants ? Did you allow your hair loss to get to the point where there was too much loss to cover up in the recipient site? Or was it financial, a time slot or are you older so when most of your loss occured, the results were " Barbie plugs/picket fence" poor or unacceptable ?

 

[Spideog]

I think i'll skip transplant but i'm interested on doing a shaved scalp micropigmentation. I like the shaved but not bald look..and because i know myself, i couldn't live with the idea that all that money and suffering from hair transplant could go in trash if i keep using peds and not taking finasteride, RU, minoxidil and all that shit for the rest of my life..



Duuude, eat some fiber xD
(jk)

Expensive?

 

[BachmanityInsanity]

B) You can certainly use it every day. The only downside it dries your hair quite a bit. That may or not be an issue depending on how oily your hair is, so you may need to follow with a conditioner.

C. Oral Minox is unquestionably superior, While sides are minimal, fleeting, and very rarely an issue they tend to present when initiating use. The most common is a little water retention (bloat). So perhaps start with 2.5mg/day for a few weeks, then move to x2 a day or just 5mg. Stick with it and the water retention almost always fades away as your body gets accustomed to it.

Despite my efforts, no UGL lab makes it yet. Generic Asia says they will. Pharma is the only option currently. If you have good insurance and a willing dermatologist you could get a prescription. You could go to Sesame and get a telemedicine appointment for a prescription for $39. Even without insurance with GoodRX two months worth of Minox would be $10. Finally, PCT24x7 sells 10 packs of 5mg Minoxytop after current sale for $3.85, So about $11.50 a month. Still far cheaper than foam which is closer to $50/mo but It was only $1.40 a month ago, lol. I would buy a years worth and offer him $2 per 10 pack since that's 50 packs.

D: Dutasteride is potent and a last resort when Fin is ineffective. It's really best to keep the dosages down of DHT inhibitors. Most people do well on 1mg/ED of Fin or less. I would start with .25mg/ED and see if you still find hairs in your hands after shampooing after two weeks. If so up it to .50mg, two weeks and then 1mg if necessary. 1mg is the "standard" starting point treatment for hair loss, but it was brutal for me so I'm very cautious. .25mg has been fine after the first week, and hair fall is essentially zero now.

Your hair looks like it's at the "very recoverable" with intervention stage. I've seen crowns like that fully fill in with fin/minox for a year. Should start seeing visible results after 4 months. The Minox will trigger the natural shed stage in order to "reset" the follicles for a more robust growth cycle. This is normal when initiating topical or oral minox and completely normal, don't panic when seeing lots of shed for the first week to ten days.

D. Bloods are often useful with what we do but not with DHT. The reason is outcomes for DHT processes are less dependent on how much DHT we have than the extremely variable level of sensitivity we have for it. Some men are seemingly immune to high levels, and need a lot to function, men with Male Pattern Baldness are more sensitive to varying degrees, only need a tiny amount to feel good, and lose hair (and get enlarged prorates) with even moderate amounts.

Brilliant thanks for such a detailed reply!! I will read up on all those points also. That’s given me some great points thanks bro

 

[BachmanityInsanity]

Some questions all, is there a substantial difference between Fin and Dut for both causing sexual side effects like very low libido as well as depression ?
Is Dut known for having a long lasting negative effect on libido similar to post finesteride syndrome ?

 

[Spideog]

Yes I too prefer having non-receded hair for multiple reasons


But knowing what you know now, do you think that acting when you noticed nw1 would’ve made for a better outcome or at least more delayed hair loss? So far my impression is that you did notice it and you neglected it all the way from nw1 thru nw3. Wouldn’t that be far different from someone who surveys the position of each front hairline follicle on their forehead every week or so on blast??

Also fin/min will ultimately not prevent hair loss if someone is blasting supraphysiological doses of test. It can certainly delay it but won’t be able to stop the test-associated follicle weakening. Not to mention guys who use straight up DHT steroids. What is your cycle history?

I do think at a certain age, say 45, it tends to stop mattering, especially if you’re out of shape like 99.9% of American 45yo are

You guys are fully grown men though and you knew this going into this game that this shit would happen. Hair loss I don’t give a crap about it because women don’t really give a shit. Shave your head, I’m only 25 and people say I look 30 and yet it doesn’t bother me because why would it. Personally I wouldn’t fuck with a jacked bald guy. George St Pierre looked pretty sick before he got that gay hair transplant and now walks around with white dyed hair. It’s not a masculine trait. Being muscular, lean and having a jawline is much more important.

 

[trtbuilder]

You guys are fully grown men though and you knew this going into this game that this shit would happen. Hair loss I don’t give a crap about it because women don’t really give a shit. Shave your head, I’m only 25 and people say I look 30 and yet it doesn’t bother me because why would it. Personally I wouldn’t fuck with a jacked bald guy. George St Pierre looked pretty sick before he got that gay hair transplant and now walks around with white dyed hair. It’s not a masculine trait. Being muscular, lean and having a jawline is much more important.

View attachment 284715

Women do care. Especially if you have an ugly misshapen head and dont look good shaved. A lot of the steroid monkeys with shaved heads look like subhumans. Im good on that.