MESO-Rx Exclusive Steroid users say bad things about trenbolone - how accurate are the descriptions?

[Eman]

So by saying shit out may not have been the best analogy but the implication is still there. At some point whether it’s genetics diminishing returns physiological limits or some portion just passing through your body and just being excreted. As the dose increases. At some point some portion of compound will be wasted and wasted refers to all of the above. Would you agree on that.

I would agree to a certain extent, but not because any hormones are being excreted. But yes, at a certain point, there will be a certain portion of hormone that's being "wasted" in the sense that muscle tissue can only grow so fast and strength is only built so fast. If your body is progressing as fast as it physiologically can at say 500mg, then taking 1gr isn't going to benefit you... You'd be "wasting" the other 500mg.

With that said, this is all very black and white "rules". There's no way to really know what dosage is your "maxed out" point is... It's just generally understood that the more you take, the closer you'll get to that point. Especially considering that many folks are able to get fine results with less hormones. Personally I don't see a lot of merit in micro dosing myself but, it has worked for Olympic athletes for a pretty long time.. More or less.

 

[Thegreek]

Yes I’m speaking from experience I ran 3grams of test a week.
no hormones do not just get wasted and excreted. Your body uses them. The body doesn’t just say “well out of this 1500mg of hormones I’m only going to use 1000 and just expel the rest.”

I would agree to a certain extent, but not because any hormones are being excreted. But yes, at a certain point, there will be a certain portion of hormone that's being "wasted" in the sense that muscle tissue can only grow so fast and strength is only built so fast. If your body is progressing as fast as it physiologically can at say 500mg, then taking 1gr isn't going to benefit you... You'd be "wasting" the other 500mg.

With that said, this is all very black and white "rules". There's no way to really know what dosage is your "maxed out" point is... It's just generally understood that the more you take, the closer you'll get to that point. Especially considering that many folks are able to get fine results with less hormones. Personally I don't see a lot of merit in micro dosing myself but, it has worked for Olympic athletes for a pretty long time.. More or less.

I’m not putting a specific number to it because like @Eman put it there is no way to know what your ceiling is. If you are super tuned to your body id say you can get pretty close but for arguments sake. If 500 was the limit out of 1500 and the rest is diminishing returns. What happens to 1000. It doesn’t just disappear. I think it’s fair to say a percentage becomes waste. Technically the whole 1000 is a waste of time and money lol but still it has to go somewhere. As far as microdosing goes. It’s not just about the dose. It’s the timing too. Traditional trt was 200mgs every 10-14 days. By day 5 its dropping. By day 7 it’s beginning to crash. Another 3 to 7 days after that it’s tanked. Then boom you spike it again. Week and half two weeks later tanked. That’s not how the body works. Which leads to all these fucked up sides. I pin 100mg every 5 days. No crash. No AI. Estrogen and everything else in the normal range.

 

[NLM36]

I’m not putting a specific number to it because like @Eman put it there is no way to know what your ceiling is. If you are super tuned to your body id say you can get pretty close but for arguments sake. If 500 was the limit out of 1500 and the rest is diminishing returns. What happens to 1000. It doesn’t just disappear. I think it’s fair to say a percentage becomes waste. Technically the whole 1000 is a waste of time and money lol but still it has to go somewhere. As far as microdosing goes. It’s not just about the dose. It’s the timing too. Traditional trt was 200mgs every 10-14 days. By day 5 its dropping. By day 7 it’s beginning to crash. Another 3 to 7 days after that it’s tanked. Then boom you spike it again. Week and half two weeks later tanked. That’s not how the body works. Which leads to all these fucked up sides. I pin 100mg every 5 days. No crash. No AI. Estrogen and everything else in the normal range.

I’ll put it like this. The more testosterone you inject the higher your testosterone levels will be. You see this by taking an absolute crazy amount of test and getting blood work done.

 

[Millard]

So why the difference with tren? (1) I do think it's strength leads to more experience of harm, but (2) there could be some social or psychological reasons that harms are more likely to be attributed to tren rather than other factors. That might be the case for the mental and social harms. But what about the physical harms? The heart attacks, blocked bile ducts and blood noses and shit. Why would someone lie about that/attribute it to tren when it's not/exaggerate? Someone once said to me that sometimes bodybuilders equate risk with effectiveness. Do you think that's true? And do you think some of the experience of harm is an attempt to prove commitment to the lifestyle?

I agree that the potency of trenbolone can lead to some increased side effects when compared to equivalent milligram dosages of other steroids. However, this isn't a fair comparison.

No one makes apples to oranges comparisons 6mg/day of the beta-agonist salbutamol to 6mg/day of the more potent beta-agonist clenbuterol. People respect the fact that clenbuterol is 1000x more potent. They are forced to. So they dose accordingly.

Bodybuilders are failing to do this with trenbolone. They may compare 500mg/wk trenbolone to 500mg/wk testosterone, etc., etc. If trenbolone is 2-3x more potent then of course the side effects will be greater. So would the side effects on 1000mg/wk or 1500mg/wk testosterone.

IMO, this failure may be most responsible for the mythology and demonization.

The lesson learned is not to say trenbolone is the devil but to use a more appropriate dose. Harm reduction.

We also have to acknowledge that some steroid users, just like the general public, may believe a lot of things that are simply not true and really have a tough time determining causality. The trenbolone mythology creates its own expectancy and confirmation biases.

Don't get me wrong. Self-reports are invaluable especially in this type of subculture. But I'm cautious about accepting anything at face value.

We should be most skeptical of the guys blaming steroids for extreme actions that destroy their lives and those around them in one way or another whether it's ruining their marriage, turning them into rapists, causing them to mail pipe bombs to prominent politicians, etc., etc.

 

[MairUnderwood(Researcher)]

causing them to mail pipe bombs to prominent politicians, etc., etc.

this happened? and was blamed on tren?

 

[Millard]

this happened? and was blamed on tren?

Cesar Sayoc briefly mentioned "heavy amounts of steroids" among a lot of other issues. It was the expert witnesses at his trial who gave a full-throttled scapegoating of steroids going so far to say that he never would have targeted politicians with pipe bombs if it weren't for the steroids! If they thought it would have helped his case, I'm sure they would have cited tren.

I guess his public defenders have a job to do. But it says a lot about our society when defense attorneys think the best strategy is to consult a "psychiatrist with specialized knowledge regarding the effects of steroid use to address how Mr. Sayoc's extensive steroid use likely affected his mental health" while overlooking other potential scapegoats.

For example, how did it affect his mental health to be "raped, penetrated and molested" by "Brother Raymond" for over a year while he was allegedly imprisoned at a Catholic boarding school? How did it affect his mental health 40 years later when he confronted his rapist and no one believed him? How did it affect his mental health when he learned that the $6000 settlement he received paled in comparison to the six- and seven-figure other Church victims received?

Sayoc goes on for multiple pages about this. He only briefly mentions steroids.

Yet the headlines only say Sayoc was fucked up from steroids.

RUFKM ...

Domestic terrorist Cesar Sayoc faces sentencing today

It's not the first time. Dr. Pope makes a nice side income pandering to defense attorneys as an "expert witness".

And then there's Michael First of Columbia University :

 

[Methyl Mike]

200mg/day.
Why would DHEA and Pregnenolone work well orally but not testosterone?

Wait I'm confused, you just said In another thread that you achieve 3000ng/dl from test cream 3x a day?

 

[Deleted member 59947]

Wait I'm confused, you just said In another thread that you achieve 3000ng/dl from test cream 3x a day?

Yes.

I alternate methods when I get sick of one.

 

[Crybaby]

My dick loves you tren.

 

[MairUnderwood(Researcher)]

My dick loves you tren.

So I presume you fall at the erection end of the spectrum of tren dick, and not the roll-up end!

 

[Crybaby]

So I presume you fall at the erection end of the spectrum of tren dick, and not the roll-up end!

Yup.I feel like a God.

 

[MairUnderwood(Researcher)]

Yup.I feel like a God.

no 'making a pact with the devil' side to it? no bad sides?

 

[Ridethelightningbarefoot]

I just read a pub med article about the use of tren ace and e2 in cattle. Said it increased carcass value of the steer! Time to harvest some gym rats!!!! Man what if there is a mass conspiracy where gym owners are raising human cattle for the lizard people!!!!! Joe bidens sitting in his office right now having a human butt steak!!!!!! All these librals out there lickin their lips everytime they get around a golds gym!!!!! Hahaha

 

[Human_backhoe]

I just read a pub med article about the use of tren ace and e2 in cattle. Said it increased carcass value of the steer! Time to harvest some gym rats!!!! Man what if there is a mass conspiracy where gym owners are raising human cattle for the lizard people!!!!! Joe bidens sitting in his office right now having a human butt steak!!!!!! All these librals out there lickin their lips everytime they get around a golds gym!!!!! Hahaha

Given the Dems reputation...... I'd say human veal

 

[Ridethelightningbarefoot]

Given the Dems reputation...... I'd say human veal

Hell nahh!!!!hahahahah

 

[Human_backhoe]

Hell nahh!!!!hahahahah

View: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=hKLHVLXtxfo


Lol

 

[Ridethelightningbarefoot]

View: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=hKLHVLXtxfo


Lol

Oh my god.....they need to pay someone to stand there and tell him to shut the fuck up

 

[Crybaby]

no 'making a pact with the devil' side to it? no bad sides?

Only sides I get from tren is heat.I always feel hot and the night sweats aren't so bad as some others get no rage either.But the sexual side oh my fucken God,it's amazing cum once and after a few minutes you could go a second round.Again that's me I'm talking about everyone else is different.

 

[ShredMN]

Yes. The highest I've ever gone on Tren E was 600mg weekly, and I felt like absolute shit. Couldn't sleep. It was a mix of being completely tired and completely wired. I could barely complete a workout at the end of the work day.

I also had the most insane, vivid dreams. Like huge bugs were attacking me and I was beating them on the head trying to make a dent in their exoskeleton haha. If I would have opened my eyes, I would have sworn they were in the room. It was bizarre.

All I need is 250mg weekly, mixed with some Test and Mast, and I feel amazing...get stronger every week. And I can sleep and recover.

That sounds like a pretty wicked sweet dream to me! Did you recently watch Starship Troopers prior to dreaming up that madness?! My dreams are just weird, but not violent and certainly don’t include giant bugs that I’m trying to beat with a club or some other fun weapon!

 

[ShredMN]

From personal experience, and using tren quite a few times, I would say the article has alot of embellishment, although some points are accurate. As long as I use L-Tryptophan and GABA while on it, I don't have any mental issues, some night sweats, but that's about it. But it gets a little irratating when I read someone say that tren is such a mass builder. Sorry, no it's not. I've gotten far more size with Deca/Test than Tren/Test.

GABA supplements do not cross the blood brain barrier, therefore they don’t have any effect on neurotransmitter levels. Theanine, on the other hand, directly increases your body’s own GABA production. Go for theanine instead of GABA next time around!