Primobolan - underrated for muscle gain?

[buzzingonaas]

No sir, I do blood work more frequently than anyone I know. I’m 100% a data guy so I like to have numbers to look at and to reference back to.

I have pulled labs on primo probably upwards of a dozen times.

I do not base anything off of “feeling” only data.

My e2 on 300 test, 500 primo was around 18 and I felt like SHIT the whole time. Dehydrated, angry, just awful. Last blast I ran 500 test, 400 primo, my e2 was 22 and I felt amazing. So no clinically low e2 and nothing high, but the feeling was drastically different. I do think there’s something to it even though it didn’t show up on my bloodwork.

 

[readalot]

Was recently at a diabetes conference and HDL function was strongly questioned. Not absolute HDL levels.

But if they tank (due to AAS) and recover, do they recover similar functionality? There are zero studies on this. Pharma companies are researching it.

HDL cholesterol concentration or HDL function: which matters?

This editorial refers to ‘Extreme high high-density lipoprotein cholesterol is paradoxically associated with high mortality in men and women: two prospecti

academic.oup.com

the hypothesis being that AAS (say oxandrolone or high dose non 17AA AAS) induce hysteresis or switch the protective function of hdl? Hence hdl-c may recover but the benefit to vascular wall would not?

Interesting.

 

[AlexDavis43]

HDL cholesterol concentration or HDL function: which matters?

This editorial refers to ‘Extreme high high-density lipoprotein cholesterol is paradoxically associated with high mortality in men and women: two prospecti

academic.oup.com

the hypothesis being that AAS (say oxandrolone or high dose non 17AA AAS) induce hysteresis or switch the protective function of hdl? Hence hdl-c may recover but the benefit to vascular wall would not?

Interesting.

Yeah, something like that. There are a bunch of HDL function tests that don't coincide with absolute levels. Ie, you can have low HDL but if it has high functionality, gtg. And vice versa.

 

[readalot]

Yeah, something like that. There are a bunch of HDL function tests that don't coincide with absolute levels. Ie, you can have low HDL but if it has high functionality, gtg. And vice versa.

That would be quite the bummer and indicate an irreversible genomic effect, no?

Primary genetic disorders affecting high density lipoprotein (HDL)

There is extensive evidence demonstrating that there is a clear inverse correlation between plasma high density lipoprotein cholesterol (HDL-C) concentration and cardiovascular disease (CVD). On the other hand, there is also extensive evidence that HDL ...

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

 

[sivart77]

Primo is my favorite…hands down! Nice gradual quality gains.
Slow is fast and fast is slow

 

[brutalbuilt]

primo is overrated now wym

everyone talks about primo saying its the best these days lol

 

[Klimmzugernie]

primo is overrated now wym

everyone talks about primo saying its the best these days lol

I also think that Primobolan is enjoying a lot of hype at the moment. On the one hand, because some time ago it was extremely expensive, was often counterfeited and was therefore mystified in a certain way.
Accessibility has become much better today and good control mechanisms have now been established in the scene to identify fakes (even if I think that some users have become relatively lazy about sending products to Janoshik, for example - for blind testing).
However, it is undisputed that if Primobolan is well tolerated in terms of libido and sexual function, it can be taken in high doses, in combination with high doses of testosterone, without side effects.
In addition to the anabolic properties, Primobolan also has strong androgenic properties and, for most users, strong estradiol-pressing synergies.
This means the user is able to design a very potent stack with just two components, without aromatase inhibitors, without prolactin inhibitors, and without water and blood pressure problems. It can be used excellently for diet and bulking.
It is beneficial for insulin sensitivity in men.

All of this is more or less a unique selling point and overshadows all other alternatives.

Unfortunately for me, I can't stand it. I look great on it, have no joint problems, grow and get stronger without feeling any side effects like Nandrolone or EQ do, but my mood is subterranean and my sexuality is absolutely 0. No matter what combination I try it in .

However, my experience was in combination with testosterone enanthate. It may well be that I adjusted too hastily.
I think I will try testosterone propionate to make more targeted and dynamic adjustments.
So I'm not giving up Primobolan for myself yet.

 

[Shivathedestroyer]

My e2 on 300 test, 500 primo was around 18 and I felt like SHIT the whole time. Dehydrated, angry, just awful. Last blast I ran 500 test, 400 primo, my e2 was 22 and I felt amazing. So no clinically low e2 and nothing high, but the feeling was drastically different. I do think there’s something to it even though it didn’t show up on my bloodwork.

Yeah I’m not surprised by that. I also use it in prep and as I get closer to the show as a tool as I intentionally Need to take my e2 very low and I just do that through raising my primo and lowering test.

A few months ago before my competition I pulled an e2 of 5

 

[lilhawk]

Big cope. It still weakens your arteries, adds plaque and enlarges the heart. Wouldn't take it permanently. The German guy recently died of an aneurysm also only took 2xx T + 250/w Primo "sport's TRT".

Uh no.

 

[brutalbuilt]

I also think that Primobolan is enjoying a lot of hype at the moment. On the one hand, because some time ago it was extremely expensive, was often counterfeited and was therefore mystified in a certain way.
Accessibility has become much better today and good control mechanisms have now been established in the scene to identify fakes (even if I think that some users have become relatively lazy about sending products to Janoshik, for example - for blind testing).
However, it is undisputed that if Primobolan is well tolerated in terms of libido and sexual function, it can be taken in high doses, in combination with high doses of testosterone, without side effects.
In addition to the anabolic properties, Primobolan also has strong androgenic properties and, for most users, strong estradiol-pressing synergies.
This means the user is able to design a very potent stack with just two components, without aromatase inhibitors, without prolactin inhibitors, and without water and blood pressure problems. It can be used excellently for diet and bulking.
It is beneficial for insulin sensitivity in men.

All of this is more or less a unique selling point and overshadows all other alternatives.

Unfortunately for me, I can't stand it. I look great on it, have no joint problems, grow and get stronger without feeling any side effects like Nandrolone or EQ do, but my mood is subterranean and my sexuality is absolutely 0. No matter what combination I try it in .

However, my experience was in combination with testosterone enanthate. It may well be that I adjusted too hastily.
I think I will try testosterone propionate to make more targeted and dynamic adjustments.
So I'm not giving up Primobolan for myself yet.

i think its overhyped i like it cause it can used as an ai instead using actual ai's but at high doses primo can destroy lipids too and can cause hair loss

people think its side effect free when its not

rather use eq i get bigger stronger faster than primo and i dont have to take as much mg unlike primo which gotta be dosed higher

 

[buzzingonaas]

i think its overhyped i like it cause it can used as an ai instead using actual ai's but at high doses primo can destroy lipids too and can cause hair loss

people think its side effect free when its not

rather use eq i get bigger stronger faster than primo and i dont have to take as much mg unlike primo which gotta be dosed higher

When you say bigger faster, are you eating the same calories? I hear this often and don’t understand. If by scale weight, yes compounds that cause you to retain water will bump weight, but by actual muscle, how do you gauge mg per mg muscle gain on, say, a 700 calorie surplus?

 

[brutalbuilt]

When you say bigger faster, are you eating the same calories? I hear this often and don’t understand. If by scale weight, yes compounds that cause you to retain water will bump weight, but by actual muscle, how do you gauge mg per mg muscle gain on, say, a 700 calorie surplus?

i just kno my body and i can tell by gym performance, the mirror and weight
my surplus was around the same when i did both

i dont hold any extra water on eq.. eq can lower my estro pretty drastically so it keeps my estro in check from the test

 

[nightprowler7]

Primo is my favorite…hands down! Nice gradual quality gains.
Slow is fast and fast is slow

I think it goes slow is smooth, smooth is fast

 

[sivart77]

I think it goes slow is smooth, smooth is fast

It’s just a saying an old guy told me many years ago when I first got into my line of work. It’s stuck with me ever since

 

[Spideog]

I think it goes slow is smooth, smooth is fast

I don’t know what that means.

 

[Lculebra]

Primo está sobrevalorado en mi opinión. No hace nada que EQ no haga y a menudo es falso y costoso, además es necesario inyectar más aceite para lograr una dosis, ya que solo es de 100 mg/ml. Lo agregué a mi ciclo más grande que he corrido solo porque quería ver qué pasaría y lo agregué a 500 mg por semana y noté que me veía más duro y seco, pero no diría que aumentaría masa. Creo que tiene su lugar en un corte o en un lote si se apila con una buena cantidad de prueba. pero por sí solo digo que es bastante débil y la mayoría estaría decepcionado. Tiene la gran reputación de ser un gran fármaco, pero creo que la mayoría estaría de acuerdo en que, si lo he probado, no está a la altura de las expectativas. No quiero decir que sea malo, pero creo que está sobrevalorado y puede provocar una caída del cabello increíble. Entonces nuevamente eq es mejor. Sólo mi opinión.

Creo que hiciste una buena opinión sobre Primo.

 

[jtmarlin]

I've come to the conclusion that the only reason to use primo is as an AI. It's basically like taking proviron IMO. I actually think it hinders gains in a testosterone cycle bc it reduces estrogens so much. You'd actually probably get bigger (not just bloat but muscle) taking 500mg of test alone w/o an AI vs 500mg test/500mg primo. It's is not even on the same planet as Nandrolone which is the best building steroid injectable there is IMO by an enormous margin. Enormous. No amount of primo could even equal 200mg deca or even 20mg of Dianabol IMO. One thing that it does do is it seems to fix blood work problems caused by high doses of testosterone alone bc perhaps it completes with receptors. I don't know why but my hematocrit is higher on 200mg of test only than it was on 500mg of test + 250mg primo. Cholesterol was worse.

 

[buzzingonaas]

I've come to the conclusion that the only reason to use primo is as an AI. It's basically like taking proviron IMO. I actually think it hinders gains in a testosterone cycle bc it reduces estrogens so much. You'd actually probably get bigger (not just bloat but muscle) taking 500mg of test alone w/o an AI vs 500mg test/500mg primo. It's is not even on the same planet as Nandrolone which is the best building steroid injectable there is IMO by an enormous margin. Enormous. No amount of primo could even equal 200mg deca or even 20mg of Dianabol IMO. One thing that it does do is it seems to fix blood work problems caused by high doses of testosterone alone bc perhaps it completes with receptors. I don't know why but my hematocrit is higher on 200mg of test only than it was on 500mg of test + 250mg primo. Cholesterol was worse.

disagree with the overall sentiment, however the hematocrit thing I have encountered. Every time the primo gets lowered or taken out, my hematocrit goes up.

 

[jtmarlin]

disagree with the overall sentiment, however the hematocrit thing I have encountered. Every time the primo gets lowered or taken out, my hematocrit goes up.

The hct thing is really really interesting and it doesn't seem to be E2 related either given I have tried this on plain old TRT with similar E2 levels and the HCT is much higher. My PSA also went down .4 (which could just be an off test, I don't know)

 

[AlexDavis43]

I've come to the conclusion that the only reason to use primo is as an AI.

If you're shelling out for primo, hopefully it's not just for AI.

Primo would be the least convenient and most expensive AI.