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[liteboost]

I have had vacuum in every single vial of optis.

 

[mtt]

Meso Members, I hope each and every single one of you are doing well including your loved ones. That our wives, mothers, women in our lives received much love, plenty of gifts and flowers this Mother’s Day.


Though I have not been as active on Meso lately, I keep a close eye on it. I’m sure you the customer would rather have me working behind the scenes on your orders, getting them swiftly to you as I have from day one than constantly answering the same questions over and over. As always, emails are answered promptly.

It seems that one subject in particular has been brought up lately. Vacuum seal. Before I discuss the above matter I would like to once again mention to you where my Grey Tops come from.

My Grey Tops come from a LICENSED GMP facility that meets Pharmacopoeia standards. I will not divulge the facility for obvious reasons but many Veterans and long time members know exactly where they originate. This facility also provides their labeled Somatropin to hospitals and pharmacies. They have to meet firm guidelines and go through strict stages of quality control.

To the subject in question. Vacuum seal, no vial leaves the facility without a vacuum seal. Vacuum seal is required in order for the manufacturing process to be completed. Vacuum seal is necessary for the rubber stopper to be placed and properly sealed.

Below I have tried to break it down in layman’s terms describing how vacuum seal goes concurrently in the manufacturing process.

- Vials are filled with Somatropin in liquid form.

- Negative pressure of lyophilizer is concluded, liquid is converted to a solid.

- Once proper pressure-parity has been achieved internally and externally-(vials) rubber stoppers are applied.

- aluminum seal is applied

- QC of closure stability

Meso Members, I believe I have been fair in facing any obstacle that has crossed my path. I know that I provide a top tier Somatropin and have had a stellar history up to this point and have no intention of changing that. What is troubling is when I get emails telling me “I need to do this," “do that," when my Pharmaceutical line is questioned even though they can be authenticated online.

I know I cannot please everyone and some might take the above the wrong way but for those that are happy with my Somatropin and my customer service, it is greatly appreciated.

@mtt & @Logan44551, it seems you are quite displeased with my Somatropin or myself since I ACTED a certain way which was not to your liking. Please email me so we can come to an agreement and get you compensated. I apologize for not meeting your standards. Their many other sources who I’m sure can fulfill your needs.

Meso, thank you for your continuous support and for reading this lengthy post. By the way, in a few weeks a new batch of Grey Tops should be available once results have been posted.

I am not displeased at all with your service. I specifically complimented you both in private emails and on this thread. I even stated that after testing the 28iu Purple tops that it was the best deal ever on HGH.
I complained specifically ONLY about the Blue Tops not having a vacuum seal. You took any criticism on the GH you provide as a personal insult (you told me so) which is just ridiculous. You don't manufacture the product and even if you did it would still be silly. If I complained about the quality of the new tires that I bought and filed a complaint with the manager of Firestone why would he be personally insulted?

Because I think you are a great source with service second to no one I wanted to let you know that there are some doubts starting to rise in regard to this vacuum seal issue which points to quality control.
That way you can address the situation publicity before any damage is done to your reputation. This is what you are doing now.

Just to be crystal clear: I have NO complaints about the Grey tops and have openly praised the Purple tops. It was only the Blue tops that I complained about not having a vacuum seal. And your service and communication is awesome. The special packaging that I request is always observed and really makes a big difference. TP didn't give a crap and even on an over $1,500 order, he couldn't be bothered with packing in a large box where it will be delivered in a secure and protected environment away from sitting in direct sunlight all day.

 

[muscletrain]

I am not displeased at all with your service. I specifically complimented you both in private emails and on this thread. I even stated that after testing the 28iu Purple tops that it was the best deal ever on HGH.
I complained specifically ONLY about the Blue Tops not having a vacuum seal. You took any criticism on the GH you provide as a personal insult (you told me so) which is just ridiculous. You don't manufacture the product and even if you did it would still be silly. If I complained about the quality of the new tires that I bought and filed a complaint with the manager of Firestone why would he be personally insulted?

Because I think you are a great source with service second to no one I wanted to let you know that there are some doubts starting to rise in regard to this vacuum seal issue which points to quality control.
That way you can address the situation publicity before any damage is done to your reputation. This is what you are doing now.

Just to be crystal clear: I have NO complaints about the Grey tops and have openly praised the Purple tops. It was only the Blue tops that I complained about not having a vacuum seal. And your service and communication is awesome. The special packaging that I request is always observed and really makes a big difference. TP didn't give a crap and even on an over $1,500 order, he couldn't be bothered with packing in a large box where it will be delivered in a secure and protected environment away from sitting in direct sunlight all day.

That's the issue with two different facilities the grey tops are the licensed GMP facility afaik the larger kits are not @opti ? I've had zero issues with the red top 120s and then the grey tops they are great so far and the break down makes it sound like they may be another "anki-bio situation" where they're after hours produced in a pharma setting if that really is true that they come from a place that is providing chinese medical facilities as well.

 

[Bulldog413]

New batch of grays? I’m in. Sign me up for at least 2 when they drop.

 

[lynks8]

I have had vacuum in every single vial of optis.

Have you ordered the most recent grey 120's? If so, roughly when did you order? (e.g. month/year)
Thank you.

One other theory and question to pose to the board. Perhaps the lack of vacuum is due to the stoppers leaking? My earlier sets of Opti 100's had a softer feeling stopper. The grey 120's seem to have a different, harder feeling stopper. Anyone else notice this?

@opti , I appreciate your post and explanation. I am still enjoying your product and will likely continue to order more, but, with respect, at least half my vials do not have vacuum. My syringes' plungers are super easy to move and will get sucked in with the tiniest bit of vacuum. On half my vials they suck in quickly when first reconstituting. Half, they don't move at all, even if given a budge. Removing the plunger and placing the open syringe into a fresh vial will produce an audble sound when it has vacuum, and absolute silence when it doesn't.

There is a very clear inconsistency here that was not present with previous batches. Does this mean the gh is negatively affected? Doubtful to any significant degree, but without testing these specific vials, who really knows.

Again, this is not meant to disparage, but rather to inform. If I was running such a business, I'd want to know such information, even if it's unpleasant and/or doesn't comport with my understanding of the standards of the facility from which I purchase my product.

 

[mtt]

Have you ordered the most recent grey 120's? If so, roughly when did you order? (e.g. month/year)
Thank you.

One other theory and question to pose to the board. Perhaps the lack of vacuum is due to the stoppers leaking? My earlier sets of Opti 100's had a softer feeling stopper. The grey 120's seem to have a different, harder feeling stopper. Anyone else notice this?

@opti , I appreciate your post and explanation. I am still enjoying your product and will likely continue to order more, but, with respect, at least half my vials do not have vacuum. My syringes' plungers are super easy to move and will get sucked in with the tiniest bit of vacuum. On half my vials they suck in quickly when first reconstituting. Half, they don't move at all, even if given a budge. Removing the plunger and placing the open syringe into a fresh vial will produce an audble sound when it has vacuum, and absolute silence when it doesn't.

There is a very clear inconsistency here that was not present with previous batches. Does this mean the gh is negatively affected? Doubtful to any significant degree, but without testing these specific vials, who really knows.

Again, this is not meant to disparage, but rather to inform. If I was running such a business, I'd want to know such information, even if it's unpleasant and/or doesn't comport with my understanding of the standards of the facility from which I purchase my product.

This was exactly my intention as well. To inform and to make him aware before it becomes a major issue. BTW, what GH are you referring to when you said that about half the vials had no vacuum? Isn't the Opti's 120ius the Grey tops? I've had no problem with the Greys and they have such a strong vacuum that if I don't hold the plunger to control it, it will slam down and shoot a strong jet stream directly into the puck even when I'm holding the vial upside down.

 

[Logan44551]

Have you ordered the most recent grey 120's? If so, roughly when did you order? (e.g. month/year)
Thank you.

One other theory and question to pose to the board. Perhaps the lack of vacuum is due to the stoppers leaking? My earlier sets of Opti 100's had a softer feeling stopper. The grey 120's seem to have a different, harder feeling stopper. Anyone else notice this?

@opti , I appreciate your post and explanation. I am still enjoying your product and will likely continue to order more, but, with respect, at least half my vials do not have vacuum. My syringes' plungers are super easy to move and will get sucked in with the tiniest bit of vacuum. On half my vials they suck in quickly when first reconstituting. Half, they don't move at all, even if given a budge. Removing the plunger and placing the open syringe into a fresh vial will produce an audble sound when it has vacuum, and absolute silence when it doesn't.

There is a very clear inconsistency here that was not present with previous batches. Does this mean the gh is negatively affected? Doubtful to any significant degree, but without testing these specific vials, who really knows.

Again, this is not meant to disparage, but rather to inform. If I was running such a business, I'd want to know such information, even if it's unpleasant and/or doesn't comport with my understanding of the standards of the facility from which I purchase my product.

This matches my experience exactly, you articulated bit much better than me. The tops are different on this batch.

 

[mands]

There's no disconnect. If the vacuum is supposed to be there as part of the manufacturing process and there is no vacuum when you receive it, then I think it's a reasonable concern that "anywhere" air might have gotten into the vial, no? That's the only concern, as the product always tests well, and it's something that I think should be answered by the source, who is presumably way more familiar with the manufacturing process.

What is your concern about air getting into the vial? Degradation? Most GH manufactures and suppliers that don't vacuum seal(not saying this manufacture doesn't, as I know they do) will add preservatives if they aren't sealing to keep gh stable.

Yes the products are vacuumed sealed from the supplier and that is part of the process as it should be. Each batch is vacuumed sealed in it's own chamber(some chambers very in size) with multiple vials. Some vials on the outer most edges can be sealed less than others.

This is why if you have ever had a kit that eight-nine out of ten had a good vacuum seal and one-two appears to have little or none?

Presumably you aren't familiar with the process and how it works?

mands

 

[BigBaldBeardGuy]

What is your concern about air getting into the vial? Degradation? Most GH manufactures and suppliers that don't vacuum seal(not saying this manufacture doesn't, as I know they do) will add preservatives if they aren't sealing to keep gh stable.

Yes the products are vacuumed sealed from the supplier and that is part of the process as it should be. Each batch is vacuumed sealed in it's own chamber(some chambers very in size) with multiple vials. Some vials on the outer most edges can be sealed less than others.

This is why if you have ever had a kit that eight-nine out of ten had a good vacuum seal and one-two appears to have little or none?

Presumably you aren't familiar with the process and how it works?

mands

You provide good info man, but you always have to get a little jab in at the end. That's great, whatever makes you feel better I guess. I understand the process. It's been explained a bunch of times here on MESO.

So there's no concern that the tops aren't providing an air-tight seal and the reason the vacuum disappears is because the seals fail while the vials are in transport? For example, in the cargo hold of a jet and the temperature at altitude is cold enough where the rubber tops contract and suck in the not so sterile surrounding air?

 

[janoshik]

So there's no concern that the tops aren't providing an air-tight seal and the reason the vacuum disappears is because the seals fail while the vials are in transport? For example, in the cargo hold of a jet and the temperature at altitude is cold enough where the rubber tops contract and suck in the not so sterile surrounding air?

I don't think the tops would be exposed to colder temperature in the cargo hold (or anywhere) than they are in the freeze drier. Gotta be something else I guess.

 

[mands]

You provide good info man, but you always have to get a little jab in at the end. That's great, whatever makes you feel better I guess. I understand the process. It's been explained a bunch of times here on MESO.

So there's no concern that the tops aren't providing an air-tight seal and the reason the vacuum disappears is because the seals fail while the vials are in transport? For example, in the cargo hold of a jet and the temperature at altitude is cold enough where the rubber tops contract and suck in the not so sterile surrounding air?

Hey I was just giving a little jab as you did presuming I wasn't familiar with the process or Opti was more familiar. No worries man. I didn't really think it was offensive honestly. You have thick skin and I've know you on here for quite some time now.

And no I wouldn't be concerned about colder temps in flight or transit. They are being freeze dried and severely low temps in the process.

mands

 

[BigBaldBeardGuy]

Hey I was just giving a little jab as you did presuming I wasn't familiar with the process or Opti was more familiar. No worries man. I didn't really think it was offensive honestly. You have thick skin and I've know you on here for quite some time now.

And no I wouldn't be concerned about colder temps in flight or transit. They are being freeze dried and severely low temps in the process.

mands

Yea, no problem. But I wasn't giving you a jab either. I was hoping Opti would just have an answer. And hoping that it was a reasonable one so we all don't have to speculate.

The testing that's been done shows the product is good. It would be nice to know whether the vials lose their vacuum in the clean laboratory environment or while the bin of mail parcels sit in the open air 3rd world country next to the crate of chickens shitting everywhere.

 

[malfeasance]

I have had vacuum in every single vial of optis.

Me, too.

 

[Standfast]

Me, too.

I've had a couple that had weak vacuum but it's still a vacuum.

 

[Logan44551]

What is your concern about air getting into the vial? Degradation? Most GH manufactures and suppliers that don't vacuum seal(not saying this manufacture doesn't, as I know they do) will add preservatives if they aren't sealing to keep gh stable.

Yes the products are vacuumed sealed from the supplier and that is part of the process as it should be. Each batch is vacuumed sealed in it's own chamber(some chambers very in size) with multiple vials. Some vials on the outer most edges can be sealed less than others.

This is why if you have ever had a kit that eight-nine out of ten had a good vacuum seal and one-two appears to have little or none?

Presumably you aren't familiar with the process and how it works?

mands

That doesn't make sense to me, if the chamber vacuum seals the vials, why would it matter where I'm the chamber they are? Also the ones I had didn't have a weak vacuum, there wasn't one at all.

 

[lynks8]

Me, too.

Can you please tell us roughly when you ordered? month/year?

I've had a couple that had weak vacuum but it's still a vacuum.

Same question: when did you order?

Again, mine, of which only ~50-60% have vacuum, were ordered Dec 2020.

Thanks in advance.

 

[lynks8]

BTW, what GH are you referring to when you said that about half the vials had no vacuum? Isn't the Opti's 120ius the Grey tops? I've had no problem with the Greys and they have such a strong vacuum that if I don't hold the plunger to control it, it will slam down and shoot a strong jet stream directly into the puck even when I'm holding the vial upside down.

I am indeed referring to the 120 greys. Can you tell us roughly when you ordered? Month/year?

To reitierate, the reason I'm asking others this is to try and determine if there's a certain portion of this "batch" that was affected. Perhaps all later orders have been 100% vacuum sealed?

Thanks.

 

[138casanova]

I am indeed referring to the 120 greys. Can you tell us roughly when you ordered? Month/year?

To reitierate, the reason I'm asking others this is to try and determine if there's a certain portion of this "batch" that was affected. Perhaps all later orders have been 100% vacuum sealed?

Thanks.

My 120s from Dec 2020 were all sealed. Ordered some on Jan and March and a two or three from the Jan order had no vac. The March ones are fine, but a couple were weak vacuums. On his Jins now, and they have all been vacuumed tight.

The product is great in my experience. Someone mentioned unsterile air being a possibility. Maybe I'm the only one, but I always inject 1ml of air that comes from my house into the vial first to break the vacuum. Then, I add the water. I'm not dead yet, and I have never had a problem.

 

[Standfast]

Can you please tell us roughly when you ordered? month/year?

Same question: when did you order?

Again, mine, of which only ~50-60% have vacuum, were ordered Dec 2020.

Thanks in advance.

December 2020 as well.

 

[TheDogSoldier]

So to order I just send an email subject ORDER and follow instructions in auto-reply?